To think the lockdown needs to end now?

[Fr0thandBubble]

I could understand a lockdown being imposed for a few weeks to make sure the NHS was up to capacity, but it’s gone well beyond that. The NHS now has lots of excess capacity and yet here we still are.

I am horrified by what has happened to our civil liberties, what it’s doing to our children’s education, what it’s doing to everyone’s livelihoods and mental health, what it’s doing to the economy, how people are not getting life-saving treatment for things like cancer, etc.

I don’t understand why people aren’t given the right to choose to self-isolate if they need to but for the rest of us to be allowed to get on with our lives and to take responsibility for ourselves.

I don’t understand why people who are not old and don’t have underlying health conditions are acting hysterically and why people have decided it’s OK to police other people’s behaviour and shout at them in the street.

I feel like I’m living in some kind of awful dystopian society.

I realise I’m in the minority here but does anyone agree with me?

@TrustTheGeneGenie

Yep. Once you’re in hospital the fatality rate for Covid is 35-40%

Nope. That's not true.

See below

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-52473524

I agree. My neighbour has cancer, she's only 44, no treatment since lockdown. My mother, 87, can't endure this much longer.
Not all children have gardens, and dogs to walk, and parents who can help with schoolwork. The ones already disadvantaged are going to be struggling even more.

earl apologies. The last stats I read on that said it was ICU only.

Yes they are. Our council is actively telling schools to remain closed. We've had 3 cases here in the last week. It's pathetic.

How long for? Another week or so isn't preventing children from ever getting an education.

@TrustTheGeneGenie

earl apologies. The last stats I read on that said it was ICU only.

No worries. This is a wider European study apparently.

How long for?

Indefinitely.

I agree. My neighbour has cancer, she's only 44, no treatment since lockdown.

If she is not receiving treatment now it is because it will cause immunosuppresion and increase her risk of dying from coronavirus. Ending lockdown immediately isn't going to help.

I received my DD end of year report today which suggests she won't be going back until September, piss take

That'll be Sweden who have had to apologise to the people for the way they've handled it. And I don't think that discrimination is good. Finally we didn't really lock down did we? Not like other countries who properly controlled movement and really drove down the R rate.

Sweden has done it.
And they have the highest death rate of any of the Scandinavian countries! The death rate in care homes in Sweden is disgraceful.

Indefinitely.

Which demonstates that there is huge variation across the country. Schools are open in my area despite quite a high death rate (although dropping now).

@nellodee

Just gone and got a rough estimate of how many hospitalisations we have had - I calculate it to be in the region of 110,000. It is an estimate, because it was from a daily graph, and I did it by working out the area, not counting every single one, but I made sure to under estimate it, rather than over estimate it.

If 7% of people have had the virus, it works out that approximately 2.4% of people will require hospitalisation.

Even with these much, much lower figures, we are still looking at needing to find hospital places for another 800,000-900,000 people.

Is this actually possible? Do those people wanting to lift lockdown think that our hospitals can cope with almost a million people needing to stay in hospitals over the next year?

You might find this interesting.

judithcurry.com/2020/05/10/why-herd-immunity-to-covid-19-is-reached-much-earlier-than-thought/

No, lockdown was supposed to bring cases down sufficiently to use track and trace, to continue to suppress the virus until there is a treatment or vaccine.
The government have had to row back from “herd immunity” because it was shown that far too many people would die in the process. In fact they even denied they ever aimed for herd immunity - if you believe them.
We don’t even know if infection with Covid gives long term immunity so the trying to achieve herd immunity through “everyone getting it” is dangerous and ill advised at this point - as scientists and the WHO pointed out. The aim is for as few of us to get it as possible.

@outofthemoon

I agree. My neighbour has cancer, she's only 44, no treatment since lockdown. My mother, 87, can't endure this much longer. Not all children have gardens, and dogs to walk, and parents who can help with schoolwork. The ones already disadvantaged are going to be struggling even more.

One more time- cancer treatment was not stopped because of lockdown. If was stopped because of the virus, because those receiving cancer treatment are too vulnerable to it to risk going into hospital. If there was no lockdown and hospitals were overwhelmed there would be zero other treatments going on anyway. How much cancer treatment do you think was happening in Italy and Spain in March/ April?

@outofthemoon

I agree. My neighbour has cancer, she's only 44, no treatment since lockdown. My mother, 87, can't endure this much longer. Not all children have gardens, and dogs to walk, and parents who can help with schoolwork. The ones already disadvantaged are going to be struggling even more.

So why do you think this will be improved if lockdown ends? Patrick Valance is right now giving the briefing saying that new cases are about 8000 per day and it isn't coming down quickly? Why do you think the right thing to do is to release lockdown?

until there is a treatment or vaccine

Which there may never be. So we have to stay in lockdown indefinitely?

The whole sentence said SUPPRESSION until there is a treatment or vaccine

Suppression means the levels low through lockdown so that levels can be held low through test trace and isolate

Suppression is NOT lockdown

But suppression clearly entails schools being half open which just isn't good enough.
We're creating more bloody problems than were solving.

@TrustTheGeneGenie

until there is a treatment or vaccine

Which there may never be. So we have to stay in lockdown indefinitely?

Even if there isn’t a vaccine, there will be at the very least better treatments once we understand the virus better. And no one said we should stay in lockdown until then. We shuns use track and trace until then, like Germany and South Korea are, successfully. The trouble is that our numbers of cases are too high at the moment to use track and trace successfully. If Patrick Vallance is right and we are getting 8,000 cases a day at the moment, tracing that many contacts would be impossible. We should have locked down sooner and harder, or we should lock down for longer to get to a manageable number of daily cases.

*should

@attackedbycritters

The whole sentence said SUPPRESSION until there is a treatment or vaccine

Suppression means the levels low through lockdown so that levels can be held low through test trace and isolate

Suppression is NOT lockdown

Exactly

Because if they end lockdown completely, we’ll head for another peak and the NHS risk being overwhelmed. The point of it being drip, drip is to see where it takes us and then pull back to full lockdown again if necessary. Lockdown isn’t about stopping us getting the virus, it’s about protecting the NHS.

359 more deaths today. I’ll stay in lockdown thanks.

Cancer treatment hasn’t stopped! Outpatient appointments are supposed to take place away from the main hospital building to minimise risk. We’re using an unused hospice 5 minutes away for this. I’m shocked areas are stopping cancer treatments.

Dd1’s school wrote today to confirm dd won’t be going back this school year. Luckily her school has been amazing and I don’t anticipated her being behind. She does normal timetable with some video lessons and all work is submitted and given feedback. No idea what September will look like - I don’t think it’ll be straight forward and back to normal but only time will tell.

Yes we would all like it to end. Nobody wants to be i. This situation but still hundreds are dying from this every day. Until people follow rules and don’t decide they are above this illness it will take longer to go away . You obviously don’t have anybody near to you who has died or been at deaths door with this illness or you would think differently 😢