Would you rather people who voted Tory or don't absolutely hate the Government just stayed silent on threads?

[ITonyah]

As it seems pointless bothering on Mumsnet any more.

Personally I'm a bit sick of being called a bot because I voted Conservative.

There are a lot of threads with pained titles asking people to explain why they voted Tory/don't hate Boris Johnson etc but when it comes down to it noone is at all interested and it's just an excuse for a pile on.

YANBU - No, keep posting as I like to see both sides of an argument, I don't think you are a bot!

YABU - Yes, please just keep any Tory voting or opinions to yourself.

There are far too many pile ons and accusations of being a paid bot (indeed that comes up so frequently now that I'm wondering who is paying for it - remember this is something all parties do, and Tories we're not early!adopters by any stretch)

It's a shame, but certain politics are hounded off these days.

I suspect by posters who in RL also eschew those who do not think like them. Because I can't account for the surprise, the handwringing and the calls for other people to justify themselves which occur after every loss at the polls

I've never voted Tory.

Cummings and Boris are clearly lying and are unrepentant.

However -

And Labour CERTAINLY wouldn't have handled this any better

I agree it's highly unlikely we'd have seen anything better overall from Labour.

It is fucking depressing we are led by such liars.

What is the average MN poster's definition of a "bot" exactly?

Not speaking for anyone but myself, but my markers are:-

Appear very quickly on any thread with the slightest whiff of criticism.
Always post “do you think the other lot could have done better”
Never post on any other threads bar politics and only ever ones where the government is criticised.

I’m expecting at least one to be popping up on here shortly

What is the average MN poster's definition of a "bot" exactly?

Someone else posting on a politics thread, but with whom they don't want to debate.

I don't think this is a party political thing now. I think that's one of the reasons people are so angry actually. There were (as we saw from the result) lots of new Conservative voters at the last election who feel completely let down. Lots of Tory voters telling their Tory MPs what they think.

Most of my anger over the last GE result was directed at Labour for being such appalling opposition but that doesn't stop it being very disappointing for the government to be quite this bad at dealing with a crisis. Despite not voting for them, I had conceded that early handling of the C19 issue was good and I too was glad JC was in charge. I was pleasantly surprised by the economic measures put in place but it's been downhill from there, until they've managed to get us in the dangerous position where any further lockdown required is highly unlikely to be respected.

DC actions themselves, if followed by a proper apology would have blown over quickly. The government have created this by their awful handling of it. The time senior people have spent on it is ridiculous and worrying.

I have no objections to anyone arguing any POV, and I often find myself arguing both sides but do object to this "Be Kind" nonsense being trotted out as some sort of definitive end to an argument, by people who are actually just using it to be unkind.

why should people have to hide their views now? People disagree, too bad. Tories haters can hide the threads if it triggers them.

Who cares about the "bot accusation", it's such a lazy way to try to shut people up when you can't find anything to say. It's either that or the usual "shut up you twat". Who cares?

Of course haters are not interested. They were already miffed when they realised the majority didn't agree with them on election day. They are in a superb position now, when they can criticise everything, and will criticise even more in a few months with the benefit of insight - without having to make a single decision.

ITonyah

I meant on Mumsnet particularly. Debate hasn't moved beyond which party you support.
Bookmark

You literally are doing exactly that?

Tory MNers turning every single criticism of any govt action into “but what about Corbyn” is patently ridiculous.
Some people form their identity way too much around who they voted for.
Do they have anything else going on in their lives apart from U.K. flags and Boris?

Sad.

"And even I'm sick of the Dominic Cummings backlash"

Perhaps that's what they're counting on?

Oh dear, glad JC was not in charge

That is used as a very convenient get out of jail card by Labour supporters, to avoid having to discuss criticism of the Labour over the past five years, until April this year anyway

I’m not a Labour supporter.....

Without doubt if someone posts “Boris Johnson is useless”, it will be used as a comeback. It is never relevant.

What is the average MN poster's definition of a "bot" exactly?

Someone who tells anyone critical of govt policy to shut up and move on and repeats current govt Campaign key Words Mindlessly ad nauseum
It’s actually astroturfing not bots.
Bots are automated.

Tory MNers turning every single criticism of any govt action into “but what about Corbyn” is patently ridiculous.

It isn't ridiculous to think that we might not have such an overwhelming Tory majority if JC hadn't been in charge.

This is boring to me now.
Why don’t you just move on?

And don’t forget to “Be Kind”

Have voted Tory, have generally been supportive of the Government. And I couldn’t really get worked up about what Cummings actually did.
What I am annoyed with is getting pissed on and it getting called rain and taken for a fucking idiot mug by the Cabinet, who’ve all come out and said no no, it’s you lot that got it wrong you silly Billy’s, you were allowed to do what Dom did anyway, there there.
While the evidence of my eyes and ears and their own slogans from that time tell me different.

YANBU - If anyone can find any redeeming features in the current government (particularly after this weekend)I am always genuinely interested to hear them.

Some seem to think saying stuff like "Corbyn and Abbott would have been worse" is a useful contribution. Its not.

But actual debate based on facts is great. For instance - I think Boris is a terrible PM and the general handling of the pandemic has been appalling but Rishi Sunac's handling of the financial side has actually been pretty great and has certainly helped keep my employer afloat for which I am grateful.

I am truly frightened to see the level of incompetence and the use of lies to support it all. In front of whole nation, he has the cheek to say he wanted to check his eye sight. It’s like all of us a insects who have no intelligence whatsoever.
This is truly frightening to see.

Without doubt if someone posts “Boris Johnson is useless”, it will be used as a comeback. It is never relevant.

Whether it is relevant or not depends on the thread.

Criticism of current policies - no, it's not relevant.

Criticism of, say, the Tory Party's record of disunity, then yes, it is relevant.

There was a thread about a month ago about Johnson having cult-like worship by his supporters. Any pointing out that Corbyn also had this was dismissed as "But Corbyn" even though the OP said that Johnson had it more than any politician since Blair.

Mind you, certain posters on that thread have since said that after hearing Johnson's comments about being overweight, they went out to buy extra cakes and donuts. That's the level that political debate can fall to on here.

If Labour put up a credible alternative I'd consider them. Corbyn wasn't the leader and frankly neither is Starmer. (another London centric, anti Brexit, human rights lawyer. That's going to win back the heartlands

Can't people who say this realise how silly it is. The labour party had fundamentally different values and different beliefs about the way the country is run. It's not just about their leader, who could change at any time anyway, it's about what they stand for.

Not to simplify it too much but Tory - small state intervention/capitalism/privatisation. Labour - large state intervention/ public services/socialism

If you do change from one to the other you either don't get what they stand for or have completely changed your fundamental values. It's ridiculous to completely change the way you think the country should be run because Kier Starmer is a bit more palatable than Jeremy Corby .

I posted a thread discussing making a complaint (genuine) about my MP.

One popped up saying “do you think Corbyn would have done better”.

I cringed for them

Sorry my last sentence isn't correct at all. I meant it's ridiculous to change the way you vote because of the leader. I see that you don't like Starmer either.

Are you saying that if JC hadn't been in charge at the GE, the Tory majority would be smaller, and therefore their actions would be better? Because that still reads as though you are blaming the terrible handling of this crisis on JC!

I don’t understand the bot accusation. That usually means automated posting.

I’m in the middle but have had that being paid thing.

Keep posting

I don't think that's correct Frozenfan, it's about degrees. Labour under e.g. Tony Blair was not exactly the same set of "fundamental values" as it was under JC.

SnackSizeRaisin

No, I'm saying a smaller majority would have meant that the Tory party wouldn't have been able to do whatever they feel like. Which may have been better for the country as a whole.

I’m not a Labour supporter

Sure. But nevertheless, it is often used by Labour supporters to avoid having to answer any criticism of the party under his leadership. Apparently it isn't said exclusively by them.