To hope this racist woman loses her job

[TildaKauskumholm]

twitter.com/melodyMcooper/status/1264965252866641920?s=19. Was appalled to see this video on Twitter - a guy in Central park, NYC, who was birdwatching, politely asked a woman to put her dog on the lead as per the regulation in that part of the park. He started filming it as she got abusive and called the cops, to say that she (white) and her dog were being threatened by an African-American man and could they send the police (as we know this can often result in a shooting).All the while she was holding her dog up by dangling it from its collar, half strangling it. The man left and his sister put the video on Twitter, resulting in the racist dog strangler being identified very quickly... she has a high powered job with an insurance company. The animal shelter took back the dog, and her company says she is on 'administrative leave' hopefully meaning she will get fired. I was really shocked and dismayed that such open racism is still going on, even though she was being filmed! Surely she must lose her job at least, what company would want to be linked to something like this?

I'm going to try and be as brief as possible as it isn't the point of the thread, but I feel this pervasive notion that Africans of the diaspora cannot trace their ancestry because of enslavement needs addressing.

@SharonasCorona
UmmH your posts make no sense. White Americans have enormous pride in their ancestry and will tell people they’re 1/8th Native American, etc, and I know some who went to work in Germany and France because of their roots. A lot of Africans Americans just don’t have that. It’s part of why Mohammed Ali changed his name from Cassius Clay.

Your post doesn't make sense. Africans of the diaspora have as much pride in their African ancestry as white Americans have in their European ancestry. Muhammad Ali was making a point by his name change. Advances in technology since then have enabled a lot of people to trace their roots to specific African countries.

@Laaf80
I don’t think they were handing out boarding cards or keeping arrivals lists for the enslaved folk. Many white people can trace genealogy through surnames, baptism, death, marriage certificates. The enslaved were denied such record keeping. African-American surnames often come from the slavers/plantation or were adopted on freedom.

Actually meticulous records were kept - who wouldn't keep records of 'property' purchased? Ships manifests, plantation records, baptisms, marriages and deaths apply to enslaved Africans as well, albeit that they were listed as property not people. I know people who have traced African ancestry through the period of enslavement right back to localised ethnic groups in Africa. I'm not saying it's easy, and some resort to DNA when the trail goes cold. My point is that it is not impossible and it annoys me when people just assume that it is.

Uggghhhh. Race posts on mumsnet are a headache

that even if white women don't operate in that manner they always know that they can. That's the terrifying thing about white women being allies because they can instantaneously turn against you.

And for a lot of people it doesn’t take much to flip from ally to oppressor. Amy Cooper calls herself a liberal and votes democrat. I bet she doesn’t consider herself a racist. I bet she has black friends, coworkers or acquaintances whom she likes. I bet she views herself as being on the right side of the race issue.

And despite all that, it took seconds for her to flip to being someone using the mechanism of state sanctioned police brutality to put a black man back in his place. As soon as she had an interaction which she didn’t like, she was willing to use her white privilege as a threat.

So if you’re sad that you’ll be seen as ‘just another racist’ because you’re white, or if you think it’s unfair that people say you benefit from racism even if you aren’t an active participant in it, remember this video and truly understand why it is that you (and I mean me too, because I am white and I am absolutely included in this) are not a safe and trustworthy ally to people of colour. And then use that to do everything you can to actively work against the racism that you benefit from.

Here’s a hint - that doesn’t start with complaining to black people that it’s unfair that they aren’t giving us the benefit of the doubt.

@annamie thank you for that.

I don’t see it as excusing myself, I’m explaining how racism is hidden, buried deep inside people & it only takes one comment to realise this. The person themselves might not even know they are racist. Your comment was hurtful & nasty @memememoi

@memememoi you've been unnecessarily vicious to LipsyGirl.

‘Why shouldn’t she get another job? Is she supposed to be jobless and homeless for life? Is no one ever allowed to be sorry and repent and learn?’

I’m absolutely not saying she shouldn’t get a job and I’m not trying to diminish how bad social shaming is.

But it is a well established internet phenomenon and it is always going to appeal to a large group of people.

The right do it to women to. Look at how black female protestors have been shamed after Evergreen college. And unlike Amy Cooper, it probably will have an impact on their career prospects.

I don’t condone social shaming, but I also think it won’t actually destroy a white woman’s life.

I think this thread needs to stay. There have been some really good post on here. We need to talk about Racism. Not talking about it, does not make it disappear.

Anyone worried this is going to ruin Amy Cooper’s life just needs to look at George Zimmerman. He’s doing a fine job capitalising on his murder of a young black man.

"Vicious"... interesting. how so?

i think part of being an ally is understanding that people may never completely trust you, and there are good reasons for that. Being an ally means not making your own feelings about that the most important thing.

memememoi you've totally laid into someone who mentioned her concerns about racism because her children were mixed race. She's done nothing to warrant your ire.

Saying you’re not racist is not wrong, @memememoi. It’s the cliched ‘I’m not racist, but...’ that’s wrong.

I personally believe we all have prejudices, even if we don’t want to have them but people like @LipsyGirl seeing racism and affirming that ‘I am not racist and I never will be’ is not harmful, especially as she is dealing with people calling her child a ‘darkie’.

UmmH, thanks for that post. It was really interesting.

I agree that the comment about Lipseygirl was unduly harsh. If she had mentioned her mixed race children within the context of denying or minimising racism, then I’d understand. But it was quite the opposite. She has the opportunity to observe it from a different perspective and is rightly critical of it. Is she not entitled to comment on that?

Thanks, Stripesgalore :)

This thread has made me incredibly sad to think because of the colour of my skin people will just assume I’m racist. No matter what I do or say, I’m just another racist white person
This is the only thing that @LipsyGirl has said that raised my eyebrow. I don't think the initial criticism of her was fair. She was just saying that she's become more aware of, and sensitive too, racism as a consequence of being part of a mixed race family.

Carry on 🙄

At some point in all our lives we are taken out of what our normal is, for me I live in a rural area, mainly while people. We get exposed to different things/peoples opinions. We have to decide what is right or wrong. This is what’s happened to me

UmmH no one is saying it's impossible for every single person to trace their African ancestry, but it is extremely difficult for most people to trace their roots all the way back to an African region. Records were kept in the US (though even these have loads of gaps) but there were no passenger manifests for the ships coming from Africa to the US. People were listed as property, not by name or identification. DNA tests are not always reliable. So you have to be quite lucky and do loads of research (often on-site research) to get all the way back to somewhere in Africa. In general, it is much easier for white Americans to trace back to somewhere in Europe.

"If i was being threatened by a man who happened to be black I would call the police and say there is a black man threatening me"

BUT

if you warned the man before you did this, you'd just say you were going to call the police .

She told she'd say she was being threatened by an African American man

and we all know how dangerous that could be for him

imo, the tearful expression is thwarted rage:
she's in the wrong about the dog lead and she doesn't like being made to obey the rules, maybe especially by someone she doesn't really regard as an equal.

@memememoi you’re just being childish now.

@Ratasha I can see why @Lipsy was hurt, she made some robust statements against racism, and then was attacked by @memememoi and then she thought @GeorgianaD and @MissBarbary were also attacking her.

If you only allow people to speak out against racism in the ‘right’ way then you alienate a lot of people.

I think this thread needs to stay. There have been some really good post on here. We need to talk about Racism

Agree, it gets people thinking.
Amongst the outright disgusting posts, there's a wider perspective to take.
That for all those who don't realise what they're doing or saying, for those who don't acknowledge racism, for those who are white and wouldn't dream of weaponising skin colour etc etc....it's a lot to think about.

I apologise to anybody I thought was attacking me, that wasn’t. This caught me off guard. I’m sorry guys

Skinrash said

I have my doubts also about this 'bird watcher' but will see what is later reported about it.

Well here he is, the scary bastard:

mobile.twitter.com/JoshuaPotash/status/1265338098256424973

Skinrash , why don't you share with the group what you think he was doing? Don't be shy, share your doubts, tell us what you know.

NotTerfnorCis and Morris Zapp

So going by that twitter link, do you still think he's a privileged, elitist, dominant sexist pig who hangs around the bushes waiting to bully white women? Or a man who works for an organisation that tries to preserve an area as a nature reserve; and is forced to use dog biscuits to stop dicks who won't keep their dogs on a lead as per the by-laws of Central Park away from his beloved birds? Since your rather risable interpretation of the phone footage (and convenient disregard for him asking her to keep away from him) places him as the aggressor, I have no doubt that little interview in your eyes is tantamount to a day in the life of a serial killer or some such.

It's small wonder non white women want nothing to do with your brand of feminism. Even GC ones like me.

@LipsyGirl you’ve nothing to apologise for.