To have no sympathy for alcoholics?

[Macrometa]

I'm the adult child of one, my life has been nothing but completely miserable because of it.

Today in my home town the newspaper ran a story about an alcoholic man who trespassed into the cancer department late at night. He stole two bottles of alcohol sanitizer from a fridge and drank them, he vomited sick and blood on the floor, urinated on the floor and then ripped down a cubicle curtain. He was found by a frightened cleaner the next morning.

The comments are full of people feeling sorry for the bloke, yet no concern for the cleaner who had to deal with the aftermath or the hospital who are now down on vital supplies and have to pay for repairs.

AIBU to have no sympathy for alcoholics?

Its not always a conscious choice. Some people living on the streets turn to alcohol just to keep warm in the freezing cold or to block out the shit in their lives. Addictions can lead to a physical and mental illness. People may not have any sympathy but surely a bit of understanding of how people got into these situations is ok. A lot of illnesses could be called self inflicted but no one likes to accept that.

It’s an illness. I saw my father die from it. Yes you are being unreasonable, it’s a condition not a choice.

You have absolutely no idea what it's like to actually be an alcoholic though.
Looking from the outside in and living with and suffering at the hands of someone who is an alcoholic is completely different to actually suffering the addiction yourself.
I'm not minimising what you have been through but really it's not as simple as you make out.

Am sure this guy wasn't on a jolly when he did what he did.
It's much more complicated.
I hope he gets the help he needs.

I don't think you can compare choosing alcohol to choosing cancer or bipolar.

Some will way smokers choose to get cancer because they choose to smoke, I suppose that is true - they know the risks and choose to do it.

But bipolar? Nobody gets bipolar by choosing to have a drink.

We are fortunate to have an NHS who fund the need for antidepressants, counselling, psychological help.

A lot less than was formerly the case, unfortunately. My DH has serious MH issues and although his are nothing to do with alcohol, he was an inpatient on two different MH wards at various times with a majority of alcoholics receiving treatment for the MH problems that had contributed to their addiction.

Both of those wards have been permanently closed down now, and there has been nothing put in place to replace them.

You have absolutely no idea what it's like to actually be an alcoholic though.

Or why they do it. No ones explained why they do it.

Why not? Is it a choice or an illness? Do you feel pity or condem? Both cause horrific damage to the innocent, it is a valid comparison

It is not a valid comparison! So do you think that myself and the other thousands of children who have been, or are being abused and have developed unhealthy coping methods are as bad as the men who raped and abused us?? Utter madness

You have absolutely no idea what it's like to actually be an alcoholic though. I suspect that anyone who has lived with one has a pretty good idea. Levels of co dependency differ, obviously, but alcoholics are pretty good at letting you know just how awful everything is for them, how things happen to make them like that, how much they hate themselves and want to do better, are so very sorry.

All of which can be absolutely true. But of little or no help to anyone, let alone the alcoholic!

Yeah - like the mentally ill just need to pull themselves together

The severely mentally ill have a responsibility to remain on medication that they are perscribed. Also, people who are depressed/anxious have a responsibility to access help, as they are told on here regularly.

If children are being neglected as a result of the parent being depressed, is that ok? Of course not. The parent has a personal responsibility to get help, so that they don't impact the lives of their dependents.

I say that with no malice, I have had poor mental health.

Or why they do it. No ones explained why they do it.

I dont think they even know. My grandfather died in his 50s of alcoholism. My own father is one and he denies it until he is blue in the face he doesnt even realise he is doing it. Just opens a can as if its pepsi. Dps father died age 40 of it. Dp can drink 2 bottles of spirits and not even think about it. I ask why. He doesnt know. Dp is massively cutting down from what he was drinking and has stopped all the drugs he used to do so it can be a very slow process but his acheivement towards normal life is a slow process.

My friend at the moment is hospitalised. Vommitting blood for days. Has been told she has severely reduced liver function but wont give up drink. Blames it on everything but the drink. Is 25 years old.

YANBU, it is a self imposed situation.
It cannot in any way be compared with an illness you have foisted on you. If it wasnt a choice there wouldn't be Alcoholics Anonymous - there isnt Cancer Anonymus is there? Because drugs and alcohols are choices. Illnesses are not.

There must of been a point in this man’s life when he could have stopped. Not now maybe he’s too far gone at this stage, but surely there comes a point when you think I’ve had loads to drink this week/ month I’ll knock it on the head for a while.
There must be a point from which you can turn back?
Or you choose to keep going.

No ones explained why they do it.

I'll try. I started drinking at 16 to be 'in' with the dodgy crowd and to try to blank some stuff that was ongoing. Unlike the majority of people, I loved the feeling so much, I couldn't stop. I simply wanted to recreate that feeling over and over again, not realising that it's impossible. I needed more and more and more. It got out of hand and became consuming. My body and brain thought I needed it. Eventually I did need it and it was more important than anything else because I had addled my synapses (or something ) so much that the only thing there was the craving.

Finally, one morning I woke up and knew it had to stop. I don't know why then, or how I knew but I did. I haven't touched any since. I hate the old me and what she did so much and will live with that forever.
Not the best explanation but all I can do.

I agree OP. I am also the child of an alcoholic. It is the epitome of selfishness.

I get a bit fed up of endless excuses being made for people these days, 'maybe they're depressed', 'maybe they had a bad childhood'.

At some point in life you have to stand on your own two feet and take responsibility for your own actions, regardless of the circumstances that got you there.

If it wasnt a choice there wouldn't be Alcoholics Anonymous - there isnt Cancer Anonymus is there?

AA is a support group. And yes cancer support groups also exist.

I have more sympathy for the people whose lives they are ruining.

Agreed.

You really think severe mentally ill people have a responsibility to take their meds. Thats not always possible due to the nature if their illness. Why do you think people end up in hospital or on depot injections. Some mental illness doesnt respond to medication. Severely depressed and anxious people cant always access help because they are too depressed or anxious to pick up the phone or go out. When you're so unwell you dont even realise you're mentally unwell or are neglecting yourself or your children. Mental health support can be very difficult to access and services have been massively cut over the years.

@EdwinaMay
I didn't decide to do it. It wasn't a choice I made. I didn't decide one day that I would start abusing alcohol.
In my case I was living with crippling anxiety and was diagnosed with ptsd.I was getting help but I was also caught in a cycle where I was medicating myself with alcohol.

A drink on a weekend turned into a drink before I dared to leave the house.
The physical symptoms of not drinking became so severe I had to drink in order to try and function. I lost friends and family were horrified at what I was doing. I was horrified at myself and my self-esteem was rock bottom.

I don't know of any alcoholic who has ever chose it as something they want. It's a symptom of something much more. Something nobody wants.

Of course someone beating their partner while intoxicated isnt ok. Did I say anywhere that actions taken while under the influence are ok? It is possible to empathise with the person and condemn the behaviour. Eg I know someone who robbed an old lady for heroin money. His actions were indefensible and absolutely not ok. Yet I am still able to empathise with his heroin addiction.

macro I would love to have your certainty. Let's not hope your words come back to bite you. You make it all sound so simple - go to the gp, get support. Unfortunately it's not that easy. Again it comes down to personal experience. If you're someone with confidence and self worth you might have no issue contacting the gp. If you've a deep mistrust of authority and drs,and live a chaotic lifestyle, this might be different. Of course there are different reasons and more complicated reasons than that. I can't believe an adult needs that spelling out to them.

Yiu make it sound so black and white, as though one day you just choose to drink a whisky like countless times before, only this time you KNOW it will cause you ruination. It isnt that simple.
I was drinking lots in my 3rd year of uni. To deal with the upcoming stress of moving home where the emotional abuse happened. I was also applying for jobs but hadnt been successful and it looked bleak. I started drinking more, and it crept up. I decided I was drinking too much and stopped. I didnt go to my gp or counselling because my trauma meant I parent speak out for a long time. I thought it was normal. Then I had trouble sleeping, after I stopped drinking. I had mams strong painkillers left after an operation and knew they helped me sleep. Lsck of sleep was affecting my daily life. I had no clue about addiction or opiates and how risky it was. Mam often traded her tablets like sweets to uncles who then gave them to work mates or to aunties who took them when they were stressed. Many people did that around me, and it seemed normal. It certainly did not seem anywhere near sticking a needle in my arm. I didnt have to go down some dodgy streets to speak to dealers to get it. I simply popped a pill. And that's where it started.
I am not 'playing the victim'. It was my choice and I own my choice. But you seem to have an opinion that you take a first drink knowing itll kill you. Not many do, by the way, considering most of the adult population drink.
Your view is very old fashioned and very much like my dads. What is your opinion on methadone may I ask? On drug and alcohol services? On detox? Does your lack of sympathy extend to smokers and obese people and those who break their legs in skiing accidents? And what generation are you from to have such a backwards world view? Only I'd be shocked if any younger person held such backwards and ignorant views in this day and age.

No sympathy. Alcoholism doesn't 'just happen', it's self inflicted.

Maybe they do need support. But don’t underestimate how much they are affecting the people around them e.g. loved ones. They’re usually the people who have to just get on with it while the alcoholic just carries on.

I do understand addiction, I just don't agree that the addicts are beyond personal responsibility.

I used cannabis in my teens as a coping mechanism for childhood abuse, contrary to what people may think, it is very addictive.

I recognised it as a detrimental habit and I stopped.

I was then a smoker of cigarettes, again very much addicted. I used that as a coping mechanism for stress and didn't care too much about the ramifications.

If I went on to develop cancer as a result of smoking then that would have been my own fault.

Me doing both of those things were choices.

I fell pregnant and never picked up a cigarette again because I cared more about them having a healthy mother than I cared about having to go through cravings and withdrawal.

I sought psychological help for past issues and addressed them.

On top of those experiences I have witnessed up close and personally the addiction of alcohol. Nobody can say I don't understand it.

It still begins with a choice, continuing it is a choice, not seeking relevant help is a choice.

I have sympathy in the sense of the huge drinking culture that is the UK. It's actively encouraged.

It's hard to be away from alcohol. Go on a work night out, everyone is drinking alcohol. Go on holiday and the adults are usually drinking a lot of alcohol. Go to a concert and most people are drinking alcohol. There's a big pub/bar/restaurant culture where beer/wine/gin reign supreme.

You're constantly around it unless you live like a hermit.

I'm not an alcoholic but i'd rarely go a week without alcohol. In this lockdown I haven't touched it for 2 months because I haven't been in the usual social settings.

I did expect to read that news article with little sympathy for the derelict drunk but, wow, he's in a bad way and acknowledges he needs help. He probably wants to go to prison to escape his own terrible behaviour. Awful addiction.

Macrometa

Deciding to stop smoking weed when you’re a teenager is not comparable to someone who has been addicted to alcohol for a long time.

I’m very sorry for what happened in your childhood but I think it is clouding your judgement.