To be so ashamed of my country and being British?

[KenDodd]

For so many reasons recently. I feel so, so sad about what has happened to our country.

YANBU to feel that way
YABU to feel that way

This article by a Dutch resident provides really accurate summary of the issues facing England from an outsiders perspective
www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/magazine/how-i-learnt-to-loathe-england

Here is one section
I’ve seen a good deal in England which suggested that, just maybe, not all was well with the collective psyche—the in-your-face binge drinking, the bookies stoking gambling addiction on every high street, the abject but routine neglect of public housing which went undiscussed until the Grenfell Tower fire.

But that scene on the morning after the referendum encapsulates my disappointment with the country. Not only the division, but also the way it had been inflamed. Why would you allow a handful of billionaires to poison your national conversation with disinformation—either directly through the tabloids they own, or indirectly, by using those newspapers to intimidate the public broadcaster? Why would you allow them to use their papers to build up and co-opt politicians peddling those lies? Why would you let them get away with this stuff about “foreign judges” and the need to “take back control” when Britain’s own public opinion is routinely manipulated by five or six unaccountable rich white men, themselves either foreigners or foreign-domiciled?

Hmmn, an article in Prospect, eh?

'Story selection often moderately favors the left and utilizes loaded headlines ... Politically, Prospect Magazine is opposed to Brexit, believes climate change is a threat and reports negatively on conservative Prime Minister Boris Johnson. ...'

I have many European friends yes we have talked about Brexit they were surprised we left but being laughed at no not really.

And many (especially German friends) are unhappy at what the feel is having to bail other countries out. Italy and Spain their economy was already fragile now along with France too things are not going to be quite so harmonious within the EU

@Alsohuman - your powers of premonition must be astounding given that you knew last year when you didn't vote Tory that COVID-19 was coming and the government would handle it poorly. Could I have tomorrow's lottery numbers please?

Wet few countries can claim to have handled CV well. If the UK situation is being reported elsewhere then I suspect that it's to deflect their domestic incompetence.

It's almost certainly not a coincidence that "Professor Lockdown" was exposed in the run up to Boris deciding whether or not to extend lockdown.

The media have an agenda so you have to take a lot of news with a pinch of salt. Without sounding like Trump, fake news is rampant

My first word should be "very"

And your powers of comprehension must be very poor if you think I said anything even remotely resembling that @StepAwayFromGoogle.

I’m very proud of a lot of things British, but I have recently found myself cringing at our politics, our politicians and the way this crisis is handled.

Doesn’t make me ashamed to be British but I suppose I do feel maybe, slightly ashamed of what’s happening to our country and the people that seem to get so much publicity, ie Nigel Forage etc,

Ah, such a cheery thread!

The best thing about living in Briatin is that you can start a thread on mumsnet about everything that is awful about living here and not get sent to prison for it.

weepingwillow I found some of the comments under the article instructive, and I was reading the article wondering how someone whose country has brown cafes, could be lecturing the English on excessiveness. The Dutch aren't direct, they are actually bloody rude in some cases, so it's not an accurate summary, but a clash of cultures (and since when does one plus one equal three, as per the article?) I note Mark Rutte seems very anxious that one equals one given his very slender majority. The reason some of us don't like EU 'compromise' is that there is never a resolution and the can is kicked further down the road. Eventually the EU will run out of road, but it is entertaining to see how long they think they can keep can kicking.

As for the comment about the Brits not knowing who the five presidents were, did anyone? I remember when Cathy Ashton was appointed High Representative. Dh fell off the sofa laughing as the EUMS to which dh was seconded, was about to be subsumed into the EEAS, and he and his international colleagues had never heard of Cathy Ashton.

Not helped by Brexit. And although we know stereotypes don't apply to everyone, it is currently the majority outlook as has been proved with the results of the last few elections.

@BonnesVacances, the tragedy is the majority didn’t vote for Cameron in 2015 or Johnson in 2019. Yet our first pass the post system means they win. Brexit of course was almost split down the middle and 30% didn’t vote. I also place a lot of the blame on Brexit on right wing media who dominate our print media and the consequences of austerity meaning many were prey to the messages that many of our ills were down to the EU which is rubbish of course.

@didkt, it remains the UK doesn’t have so many more refugees risking their lives to reach UK over all other European countries. It is also fact that the numbers granted asylum by the UK are much lower figures than many other European countries.

Finally, whilst asylum seekers wait for their application to be processed they get an absolute pittance to live on, around £37 a week plus housing and are not allowed to work. I am not ashamed of being English but I am ashamed of many of our govt’s, this one and previous ones policies.

I also think as a country we have some significant problems, largest gap in Europe between the most wealthy and poor, largest gaps in wealth across different regions of the UK (a region of the UK is in the top ten most deprived areas of the EU but London is one of the most affluent in the EU (think possibly the most, need to check the figures), a desperate need for more housing and a NHS that is being slowly fragmented and being taken down the route to a private healthcare for profit model.

There are of course things I like about the UK but see many areas that need great improvements for many of the population.

I can't remember who said it, but there is a famous quote " a Nation gets the Government it deserves"

Tunnocks34 not heard a peep from Nigel recently, is he still in the UK ?

Tunnocks34 not heard a peep from Nigel recently, is he still in the UK ?

Mr Farage is making a complete arse of himself currently by driving several hours to the coast and being filmed ranting at length about thousands of brown people invading the shores of England daily.

He has been visited by Police about his behaviour but he reckons he's an essential service and the police have it all wrong.

Can you actually believe that this guy had enough power to influence lots of members of the English public to support him?

Well this is a very sorry state when 40% of voters feel ashamed of our country.

As for this - your powers of premonition must be astounding given that you knew last year when you didn't vote Tory that COVID-19 was coming and the government would handle it poorly.

Well yes, the individuals within our government are great at three word slogans with nothing of substance behind them, anyone could see that, it didn't take special powers just a look at their track record and voting record. How could any voter trust the competence of a politician who lies so much? Covid is no surprise, we routinely plan for pandemics, politicians should be ready. The people who stand for election should be fit to deal with pandemics, wars, natural disasters, economic meltdown, climate change the lot, these things are not unusual. This lot are taking the fucking piss out of the people who voted for them.

🥱

Well this is a very sorry state when 40% of voters feel ashamed of our country.

I’m sure you could find a perennial set of silly whiners who would express that opinion no matter what was happening.

Alsohuman

No they don’t Cendrillon. Those of you who voted for this shitshow are going to have to own it. Not in my name. Not with my consent. I flatly refuse to be tainted by it.

Wonderful. So the next time a party I don’t like wins the election, I can just check out completely and refuse to go along with anything they do? How interesting.

From an expat POV. The last time we came back to the UK, I was shocked. There is a pervasive sense of unease. London felt dirty and soulless, rather than the vibrant multicultural city I loved.

I really noticed how run down things looked - clearly councils are not spending money on maintenance - Manchester in particular.

I do think things have changed.

Sometimes when change is gradual you don't notice it.

This thread is really scary - and I agree with you OP. I feel no sense of kinship with this country and never have, really. (And no, I’m not young, and not a Guardian-ite, I still have one foot firmly in the very working class environment I grew up in.) I have people and things tying me to the UK at the moment but I would certainly like to try living elsewhere when that’s not the case. For the moment, I am British and there’s nothing I can do about it, so I feel a sense of responsibility to this odd little island.

All the posters saying “well it’s worse elsewhere so you shouldn’t complain” - others being worse off does not mean that we cannot be justifiably unhappy with something. Imagine if we told posters in emotionally abusive relationships to put up and shut up because some women are beaten and raped by their partners, or if we told posters in mental health crisis that other people had worse lives so they shouldn’t be distressed.

And for the posters saying “well I don’t feel accountable for the govt/other people might be awful but I’m not, so I’m proud to be British” etc - that “I’m alright Jack”, lack of a sense of social and collective responsibility is a big part of the reason why we have racism and xenophobia; why press and government lies go unchallenged and why we’ve had so many coronavirus deaths. If more of us had a sense of social responsibility and duty, then maybe we’d all get along a bit better and be a bit nicer to each other.

I’m ashamed of the Left in this country.

Brilliant country, brilliant government, excellent healthcare, education for all, benefit system for those in need.

Post COVID - furlough scheme where government pay 80% of wages, business grants, interest free loans.

Extremely proud.

Brilliant government?