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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To break up my marriage

154 replies

Forgivemenot43 · 03/05/2020 16:57

I've NC for this as it's really sensitive and I'm in a dilemma. Sorry it's really long so don't start reading if you can't be arsed. I've been married for 20 yrs to my absolute soul mate. We met aged 15 and have been inseparable ever since. We have 2 children aged 9 and 16. Life is on the whole good. However, here comes the bad bit.....
We are all quite highly strung and when we have a row it can get out of hand. This happens about 2 - 3 times a year. The eldest dd is very argumentative and can be at times vile, particularly towards me. Like many teens I guess. So it usually starts with us arguing then I lose my temper and yell and she yells back etc etc. This can then escalate to my husband getting involved then he loses his temper and yells and because he's angry he has punched walls etc and put holes in them. Then we all make up and it's brushed under the carpet until it happens again.
So the other night my dd was horrible to me and was going to storm out of the house. She said some really nasty things and it was all over something really trivial. Her dad then gets angry and demands she loses her phone for her behaviour. Only like has happened loads of times before, she won't give him it. She gloats and says there's nothing you can do about it as you can't touch me. When this has happened in the past he has just given up and her behaviour has gone unpunished or we've had to suspend the phone through the network. But this time he was so pissed off with her he grabbed hold of her to physically get the phone off her. I didn't witness this as I was downstairs but I could hear what was going on. She was screaming and shouting hysterically angry because he had overpowered her and I have now learnt hurt her. She stormed out and he went after her while I was comforting our youngest child who was in bed but saw it from his room. Dd came back and went straight to her room with her phone as he gave her it back. Since then they've kind of being ok with each other and like other times, beginning to move on and forget it happened. But today dd showed me her arm where he grabbed her. There's clear finger marks where he has grabbed her arm to restrain her to get the phone. I feel sick thinking about it. She's rightfully angry but doesn't want to tell the police or anything drastic to happen. Then an hour later we are all on a walk together and she starts having a go at him and threatens him that 1 call and he's going to jail. She knows that he knows hes done wrong and I don't think she'll forget this. So deep down I know I should protect my child and ask him to leave but I'm scared of the whole consequences of breaking up my family. I dont really think dd wants this but at the same time I know she is a child. Apart from these awful arguments we have a great life. We go on holidays the kids love and adore him and we are like a normal family. What do I do? If he left it would devastate my youngest and I think it would dd too. And of course it would me. I have no financial worry at all but it's everything else. Breaking up my family. Please can I have some advice.

OP posts:
mbosnz · 03/05/2020 18:46

I don't see a whole hell of a lot to respect with a hole punching, girl assaulting father.

Incidentally Toomboom, did your DH behave like this teenager's father?
Did he punch holes in the wall, and assault his children to the point of leaving marks? If not, do you think that could be a differentiating factor?

winterchills · 03/05/2020 18:46

He didn't beat her he grabbed her, however the punching walls etc doesn't sound good at all. Teenagers can be awful and test anyone's patience.

Genevieva · 03/05/2020 18:47

The is not the place to get answers. People who don't know you opining on the few details written her will not be helpful. You all need some professional help with anger management and you all need to recognise your own culpability if you are going to solve this problem, rather than just pointing the finger at each other.

mbosnz · 03/05/2020 18:48

I’m not convinced grabbing a teenager to take their phone off them is “assault”.

Um, be very clear that if you 'grab' that teenager, to the point that you leave marks the next day, that is extremely likely to be taken very seriously as constituting assault. Personally, I would attempt to exercise some self control, and not risk it.

diddl · 03/05/2020 18:50

Well she's obviously learning from the two of you, isn't she?

And why is he getting involved with your arguments with your daughter?

You need to be shutting them down-you're the adult!

He needs to butt the fuck out!

But above all, he punches holes in walls-the first time that happened was the time to leave!

Sounds as if you all need anger management classes!

Lightline · 03/05/2020 18:50

Reading this with interest as I came from a family where screaming, shouting and physical violence (the violence from my mentally ill brother) was pretty much an everyday occurrence. You kind of grow up thinking it’s normal.
I’ve had a lot of counselling and when I had my DS initially shouted at him when angry I quickly realised how awful it was and have managed the last 11 years without doing that. Now he is 17 I have the occasional argument with him about school work and get a bit verbally nasty at times when he is particularly obnoxious but we’ve not physically fought
I think it’s a simplistic answer to say just leave as that will cause more problems that it solves. It should be acknowledged that your DH behaviour was wrong and maybe get some family therapy.
I’ve managed to overcome a completely chaotic and emotionally and physically abusive home I’m sure a fight 2-3 times a year won’t do that much damage to your DC

mbosnz · 03/05/2020 18:54

I’m sure a fight 2-3 times a year won’t do that much damage to your DC

So, first we had holes in walls.

Now we have bruising on DD - obviously she deserved it, being a vile, manipulative brat.

What's next? Broken arm? Broken jaw? And um, whose fault would that be?

etopp · 03/05/2020 18:54

I just don't know if its worse to break the family up when we are happy most of the time or like you say, it's worse the damage it is doing when it happens. If it happened every week or 2 I would have had enough but it's because there is such normal and happy times inbetween the arguments

I have been in your position, OP. I left. It was horrendous, but arguably slightly less horrendous than staying.

My only regret is that I didn't leave when the DC were tiny. I kept thinking it would change. It didn't.

pilates · 03/05/2020 18:55

Family anger management?

ivfgottostaypositive · 03/05/2020 18:58

We are all quite highly strung and when we have a row it can get out of hand

From the sounds of it you are all to blame

And at her age sorry she's being a little b"&*# - he's grabbed hold of her not whalloped her one (but to be honest she sounds like she needs a bloody good spanking)

I'd let this occasion go and see what happens next time

Puds11 · 03/05/2020 18:59

I think being angry to the point you physically have to punch something is not ok. It’s aggressive and threatening behaviour. Not the environment for children to be brought up in.

ivfgottostaypositive · 03/05/2020 18:59

And better to punch the wall than you - sorry but if you are pushing each other this far you are both to blame

Brefugee · 03/05/2020 19:02

It sounds utterly awful.
First thing is you all need family therapy.
DH needs to apologise for grabbing DD
DD needs to apologise for being vile. And she needs to have her phone taken off her and gets it back for good behaviour only.

Peachez · 03/05/2020 19:03

And after dad 'assaulting' the 'child' he gave the phone back to her. Brilliant.

suzy2b · 03/05/2020 19:04

My granddaughter is also a nightmare she is only 11 but has been like it for a couple of years she will scream at me if i tell her to do something she will tell me to shut up I'v told her to do school work which she refuses and through the book across the room is horrid to her younger sister every time she hits or kicks her little sister she gets it .back she says she hates her sister

mbosnz · 03/05/2020 19:04

If the only way you can think of to 'discipline' a 16 year old is to give them 'a bloody good spanking' - not much point is there? You've obviously never established a good relationship with good boundaries where nobody should be belting anyone up (and at that age, that's what it is, I saw the end results of my father doing that to my sister and it wasn't pretty - and it was even less effective), and it's not going to happen now. Accept you've been crap parents, most probably set your kid up for a crap life, and I dunno, either chuck them out, so at least they don't have to live with your continued cock-ups, or just eviscerate each other for another couple of years.

Let's be clear. This wasn't discipline or punishment. This was loss of self control and temper. On the adults part.

1forAll74 · 03/05/2020 19:04

I don't imagine that your Husband needs anger management, he was just at the end of his tether dealing with a brat child, who seemingly doesn't behave very well.

But I think that your family need a big overhaul,in the respect of all this aggro going on, or your younger child will be upset, and start to think all this is normal.

suzy2b · 03/05/2020 19:08

she also has her laptop taken off of her with force sometimes for weeks at a time unfortunately there live with me and they drive me up the wall when all this is over i'm going away for a month. my daughter will have to look after them herself

mbosnz · 03/05/2020 19:10

don't imagine that your Husband needs anger management, he was just at the end of his tether dealing with a brat child

Absolutely. That's why he's putting holes in walls, and bruises on children. It's their fault. If only they'd just behave as he thinks they ought. . .

Zofloramummy · 03/05/2020 19:14

Family therapy definitely. I’m sure there are lovely times but that isn’t enough to make up for the sheer fear your youngest child must feel during all this. You all need better coping strategies than escalating to screaming and punching walls. It’s just not normal behaviour for adults.

DontStandSoCloseToMe · 03/05/2020 19:15

Your daughter reacts to conflict with aggression and emotional manipulation, I wonder where she's learnt that? You've raised your children in an abusive household, screaming, shouting, punching homes in walls is not normal but it is to your children. Make a break, draw a line and make sure you do something about your emotional management issues and both children get support before the pattern is repeated in their own relationships.

mencken · 03/05/2020 19:15

'highly strung' is like 'free spirit'. The latter actually means 'skanky, freeloading, entitled shit'. The former means 'no self control and childish temper tantrums'

not hard to see where your daughter gets it from. The whole lot of you need serious help. Admittedly the teenage behaviour bar on MN is very low, but a man who punches holes in walls?

get sorted out before one of you puts another in hospital, and before another child starts to think this is normal.

guanciale · 03/05/2020 19:15

send the kid to social services

Original poster
Forgivemenot43 · 03/05/2020 19:20

I have never laid a finger on my dd. I think someone was getting confused with the spanking comment. That wasnt me.
I take on board all criticism, I deserve it I know. I think some people however are thinking me and dh are yelling at each other then he punches walls etc regularly. That's not what happens. Sorry if I didn't make it clear. Yes he has punched walls in the past, not on this occasion. He recognises that this isnt normal and will get help. We normally all are happy together including dd. Despite our arguments we do get on really well. She is very close to me and tells me everything. It's just when she's lost her temper. It's not her fault I know. Its ours. I'm ashamed that both of our children have had to be part of this. I think this is going to be the wake up call I needed. To stop rising when she tests me cos boy she does. Even my sister agrees who is the most placid person ever! I can't bare the thought of her having future abusive relationships because of us. I hope we can repair the damage that has been done. Not sure if I've already said but dd and her dad have now made up. He has cuddled her loads and said how sorry he is. It's true about him being at the end of his tether. I guess lockdown doesn't help. Thank you for all the opinions. Hard to read but needed.

OP posts:
suggestionsplease1 · 03/05/2020 19:28

"It's not her fault I know. It's ours". Don't minimise the responsibility that your 16 yr old daughter should have for her own behaviours. No, it is not right or acceptable that your DH punches holes in walls, and absolutely not right that he grabbed her and left bruising. However, that aside your DD should be being 'horrible' to you, and should not be blackmailing you.

To be clear - I'm not saying your husband's reaction is condonable, it's not, regardless of circumstances, unless he was maybe grabbing her to stop her jumping out of a window, or trying to stop her from assaulting someone. But your daughter certainly has some work to do too.

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