To not download the contact tracing app

[Ghostlyglow]

When it becomes available. How many people will?

I will. I’m not working for MI5 or running a large drug empire (I mean it was all just so time consuming...) & if the government want to do something with the fascinating information of my non lockdown life - my commute to work, visits to the post office, picking up and dropping off kids left right and centre and popping to the Spar for some wine and snacks after a long day they are more than welcome. Literally nothing to hide.

Really don’t get the problem, especially as in theory it may save people’s lives and allow the country to recover economically.

What is it that those who object think that the government will do with this information that will negatively impact you (genuine question?)?

No. My phone is ancient, no longer can get apps or updates, but I’m happy with it.

Yes I will - you only have to see the success Korea have had using tech during the Covid-19 period to see it makes sense. We cannot keep the economy going without measures like this.

If you think that simply disabling the location usage on an app stops you being tracked then you’re very naive.

What could you do, if you have a smartphone with apps and didn't want to be tracked, then? Just asking out of interest as I'm not at all tech savvy. I have nothing to hide

I'm fine with getting the app.... I want lock down ended & I think this sort of thing is needed.

I think it's going to cause a lot of unnecessary worry

My work place, National, lots of locations, has introduced a reporting tool. You set your status and then update it if things change, so for example I'm currently remote working symptom free. If I have symptoms or someone in my household is, then I change my status. This enables my employer to see which locations are affected most and we can either go to work, work from home etc based on the risk.
This seems a much more useful way of tracking cases to me, apart from of course the lag in developing symptoms but still spreading it around, which is going to be a problem whatever you use.

There'd be little point as I don't tend to carry my phone around with me. In fact, I'm not really sure why I have a mobile phone .... Trouble is, my friends and contacts do tend to use WhatsApp. My traffic is low level but it may prove tricky to get rid of it. I shall have a think.

My vefy big issue is the erosing of civil liberties.
There has been plety of articls recentky talking abut wearing a bracelet for example for know where you are to check you are not flouting lockdown (which this app does too btw), where you have been etc...

Yes at the surface, it look great. In reality, its opening doors wide open for other new restrictions/tracking to take place.
Saying you don't care because you only go to work etc... is naive imo.

The same happened with the terrorist laws in 2016. They are now been used for many other reasons (eg HMRC can go and have a look at all your emails, inetrnet use etc...) and have been found to be against human rights twice now. Its still standing.
The new Covid legislation is creating massive issues atm within the judiciary system because of the possible 'over use' of some police forces. It has the potential to limit our freedoms massively in the name 'of protecting people'.

We need to be careful!

how do you get between houses? I would have thought your situation would be perfect for keeping your phone charged as you can charge it in the car

I drive, but not long distances iyswim. Because it's rural, there's no way of walking due to single track roads and lack of pavements, so I may only be in the car 5 minutes or so each time, which isn't long enough to keep my phone charged really.

I'll download it.
I mean Facebook often suggests ads to me about things I have not googled but have just spoken the name out loud and I live happily with that.

The same happened with the terrorist laws in 2016

Er, that's a full 13 years after the RIPA legislation which was sold to the gullible as "essential to keep us safe" only to be used by councils to catch people putting their bins out on the wrong day.

(Not to mention it's elimination of client-lawyer privilege).

@WatcherintheRye, unfortunately it's hard to stop ALL tracking. But you sure can limit it and chose who is going to track you.
I have all my apps with no location bar one (that I use as a satnav).
I didnt allow Apple to know my location (nor do I allow my phone to send 'information' to them) when I set it up. I am extremely careful with FB, don't have messenger etc etc etc

I have been as restrictive as I can.

It's not perfect. But better than nothing.

Yes I agree Professor. Another example....

I'd rather have the app and wear a mask when out in confined public spaces than a rushed vaccine.

But DH doesn't have a smartphone, so he can't download an app anyway. New Zealand were looking into some sort of bluetooth credit card that they would give everyone, that might make more sense that trying to get everyone to download the app.

Personally I am not against the app but it has to be used in the context of testing too, it's not enough on its own.

We also need to understand how long we'll be expected to use it for, and what criteria we need to stop using it. And also what happens to the data, especially after the health emergency is over. Having a dataset which says who saw who where and for how long is massively valuable for all sorts of people from criminals to business, so it needs to be hack-proof, and it won't be.

I didnt allow Apple to know my location (nor do I allow my phone to send 'information' to them)

Worth looking at the number of times Google and Apple have "accidentally" been found to be caching data they claimed they weren't collecting. Googles wifi map was pretty much a shadow GPS system for populated areas ....

The new Covid legislation is creating massive issues atm within the judiciary system because of the possible 'over use' of some police forces. It has the potential to limit our freedoms massively in the name 'of protecting people'. We need to be careful

I agree. They are now discussing suspending jury trials, too. They did that in NI, but they never reintroduced them once the Good Friday agreement had been signed. Once you've lost rights, it's not so easy to get them back.

If you think that simply disabling the location usage on an app stops you being tracked then you’re very naive

you often can't anyway. Some apps won't work unless you have location enabled, even if they don't seem to have any real connection with your location. I can't think of an example at the moment though.

We probably won't either

Repressing the virus by test and trace will ONLY work if the vast majority co operate. just the same as Stay at home only works if the majority do it. I see the Police figures show the majority of fine for lockdown breaches are young males between the age of 20 and 35. and between midnight and 3 am. No surprise there then

I understood it was more blue tooth contact to contact rather than location

Downloaded it weeks ago.

It makes perfect sense and is the main tool to end lockdown

Is the actual Track and Trace App out yet, not just the NHS symptoms app? I thought it was only just being triallled this week in the Isle of Wight. Have I missed something?

I think I disagree with the Harvard guy about apps being useless. They're only useless if there's zero correlation between getting infected and the app telling you when you're risk. The author seems to be missing the point, the app isn't there mainly for the benefit of the individual user, no-one is claiming it's going to be a reliable guide whether a particular individual is at risk. It's for society, it's a way to make social distancing somewhat selective instead of all-on or or all-off.

He seems to think you would only quarantine for two weeks if you're certain you're at risk. But at the moment the whole of society is quarantining despite us knowing that that vast majority haven't been infected. His presumption that you shouldn't and wouldn't quarantine if there's a high probability that it's a false alarm is wrong. Even if almost all alert are false alarms, if all the affected people quarantine, that's still better than everyone being in lock-down.