Going out almost everyday - not essential

[Justasking321]

Me and my 2 kids have followed lockdown rules since this all started. Stayed indoors and have only gone out to buy food once a week. Friend I know with 1 child has never adhered to the guidance and gone out almost everyday day, shopping, park, out with friends, etc.. I have told her as well since the beginning of all this that I won't be doing playdates till this is all over. We've kept our distance. Was talking on the phone and I asked her what she was doing today. She said nothing just going for a walk (with her dc). Her ds and my ds have a quick chat on the phone and her dc tells mine, "We're going in the car to (friends) house. I'm going to play at his house". So she lied to me and her dc said what the real plan was. I don't know why she lied. She even went to visit her parents at the weekend an hours drive away because she had not seen them in ages. I can't believe she lied to me and feel different towards her now, even more so because they are putting other people's lives at risk by going out whenever they feel like it because according to her "they are sociable people and have no symptoms" 😟
AIBU- get over it and move on
IANBU- she lied and Is still not following government guidelines. Keep my distance friendship wise.

it's all very well for you op you have 2 kids that can play together. When you have an only child it's alot harder to entertain them.

@Greenpop21 because they may be elderly/disabled/don't drive/have limited funds/a large family/be shopping for others/no access to public transport at the moment. There are lots of reasons why someone may need to go out daily. All of which are irrelevant, because they're doing nothing wrong.

@PineappleDanish People in your village need to get a fucking.This really is bringing out the worst in some people.

I agree!

This was posted on our community website by some bloke.
He said he'd seen 'the same' people going out twice or three times in day'for no specific purpose'.

Given we have a small shop, a post office, a farm shop selling veg boxes, and also a lot of walks on the doorstep, how the fuck does he know what people are going out for?

So if I dash up the road to catch the post and them go out later for a longer walk across the fields, I'm not doing the right thing and he's there with his notebook.

'Woman with short black hair and a red sweat top, off out again for no apparent reason.'

More scary was the fact about 20 other people agreed with hi,.

@Kordelia agreed, but the OP is probably complaining about people leaving the house from her large garden...

I live in a flat and take my kids out for 30 to 45 minutes on weekdays and longer on weekends to a large park 3 roads away where we stay off the paths and climb trees - well they climb trees while i walk around the tree to keep moving...

Also regarding the shopping, all i have in my flat is a below counter small fridge, now try getting a weekly shop in there for 4 people... in the colder days we kept some things in a box in the tiny balcony, but not in warmer days

Jingling

You need a wig and different clothes. I think if I saw posts like that about me, I'd be in and out with as many different coats, hats, scarves, wigs etc as I could find.

*VegetableMunge” the law “ though isn’t really relevant as there’s no one enforcing it. It might as well be guidance. No bits of paper to show the police like France/ Italy /China had. It relies on us making judgements.

No one would give QuimJongUn as a disabled person, a fine for going shopping everyday. Mostly because other people ARE following the rules. If everyone goes shopping like Quim four times in one day and then daily after that, we’re fucked. Then we would go to full lockdown.Then Quim would get a fine.

So argue all you want that’s there’s nothing in the rules about shopping daily . We’ve had the rule to say Stay at Home. Going out as if there’s no restrictions as in Quims case is clearly against the rules whether or not they are enforced.

There's no rules about how frequently you can shop! Everyone has different parameters - we can only fit 2-3 days worth of food in the fridge and don't have a freezer (just icebox) as it's a temporary place due to divorce. Meeting up with friends is not allowed but as long as you keep your distance and there's only 2 of you, walking in the park with a friend is within the rules (no gatherings of more than 2 people) mental health matters too

Going out as if there’s no restrictions as in Quims case is clearly against the rules

... except it's not.

I am working with people like this. They just don't seem to see the dangers at all. I don't think it helps because we are still working so a lot of the time everything feels normal.

@Smileyaxolotl1

If you saw the size of my kitchen you would see why 3 trips a week is required to feed us healthily. Where my kids (adults) are they are managing with a delivery a fortnight and a couple of trips to Tesco express because they had a fully stocked larder, giant fridge and freezer. It's all down to circumstances (I chose to stay with my dp)

Do people really get there knickers in a twist over what others are doing...as long as me and my loved ones are safe and following guidelines then i dont give a shit what others doing.....too many people on here desperate to 'report' and shame their neighbours...get a life !!!

The "spirit of the law" is to minimise contact with other people to reduce the spread of Covid 19. The laws and guidelines exist around that purpose otherwise we need to be very worried about civil liberties. The practical impact of that on people's ability to live around functions such as shopping will vary. I am no more right for taking my car shopping once per week than someone who needs to walk to their local shop more frequently.

It was clear 3-4 weeks back when restrictions were put in place that this wasn't a situation of a few weeks of total lockdown and the problem goes away, as China is now noticing now resteictions are easing. Covid 19 is not the only threat to public health, physical or mental. We have no idea how long restrictions are in place for, but we do know that particularly vulnerable people were told to shield for 12 weeks/ 3 months. Do we really want a significant proportion of the population to emerge from months of restrictions, completely unfit, gaining surplus weight, deficient in vitamin D, loss of bone density, aggrophobic, with OCD type rituals and probably many more consequences of not venturing beyond their property. Do we want unnecesary suicides from people pushed to the brink by prolonged isolation or fear or people "grassing them up" over petty and often made up rules. Do we want escalating domestic abuse/ violence and even murders because people felt that they could not justify leaving the house for some respite.

The one thing we can control in all this is ourselves. We can't control others, and unless they are spectacularly flouting the rules and endangering others to the point that it is worthy of notifying the police, it simply is not worth stressing others who are doing lock down differently. When this ends, whenever that may be, we will want friendships and communities intact.

Going and visiting people (without delivering essential support) is against the guidence/ law. Going out daily for walks is healthy for mind and body. In our community, it is common for driveway chats in passing with people keeping at least 2m. They're not pre-arranged, but it's an important bit of social connection and community. Shopping frequently for things you need is fine. Popping out for an ice cream as an excuse to get out isn't in the spirit of minimising contact points for viral spread.

Unless you're vulnerable you do not have to stay in every day.

I go out daily for a walk and to the shops when needed for food.

The phrase "herd immunity" went down like a lead balloon, but the reality is that the choice until there is a vaccine is either herd immunity and managing the load on the NHS to a level where it continues to function or total lockdown until there is a vaccine or the disease is eradicated with no external source of reintroducing reinfection.

People who are still social mixing are dealing with the herd immunity to the benefit of the rest of us. Just keep your distance if you are minimising your risks of infection.

I go out once a day to walk the dog. And because an hour of walking a day is allowed

Nobody is enforcing the law leflic? Are you serious? The police are, sometimes incorrectly. People have been stopped and questioned, some have been fined for breaching the actual rules. This is a fact.

As for nobody giving a fine to a disabled person for shopping multiple times a day, you'd hope not since it would be illegal. I, a non-disabled person, would also not be fined (or if they tried it, they'd soon regret it) because IT'S NOT ILLEGAL. There would be no legal basis for the fine.

Your post suggests you don't understand the difference between the rules, which we are obliged to comply with or risk facing legal sanction, and the guidance plus things various members of government we have said, which we are not. It's not a matter of opinion though. There isn't anything at all in the rules to prevent someone shopping for essentials 4 times a day and that is simply a fact. Again, cite the rule saying this is forbidden if you disagree.

As for a stricter lockdown if people continue to do things they're legally permitted to do, that's pure speculation on your part. You also seem not to have considered that we are policed by consent, that there aren't nearly enough police and army to enforce a stricter lockdown if enough of the population decide that it's not happening. This is why people freestyling stricter versions of the rules than actually exist and using them as sticks of ignorance to beat other people with is so very unhelpful.

@QuimJongUn still no reason to go shopping daily.

@Greenpop21 for many, it is. Which is fine. Because it's 100% lawful to do so.

Going out as if there’s no restrictions as in Quims case is clearly against the rules

... except it's not

Shopping every 24 hours is not “infrequent”. The rules say shop infrequently and Stay at Home.

Seriously I don’t actually care if you get it. Neither myself or my DS are vulnerable. I ‘m happy to get it and get some immunity. I’ll be back at work soon and frankly there’s people off all the time with illness. All my older family members are being sensible. So shop yourself stupid. Just don’t pretend you are doing what you are supposed to be doing in lockdown.

People also have to remember that the aim is not to totally stop the spread of Covid-19, because that's pretty much impossible, merely to restrict it to levels that the NHS can cope with.

Of course, ideally, cases would be as few as possible, but it also has to be remembered that the knock on effects of lockdown are not consequence free, including deaths due to other causes.

Suicides due to poorer mental health due to change in routine, financial pressures etc will increase.
Domestic murders will increase
Accidents in the home will increase
Deaths due to inadequately exercised dogs could increase

Plus there's the huge knock on financial and economic consequences that will blight us all for decades. The longer this goes on for and the tighter the restrictions, the worse these will be.

It's not quality of rule adherence that will stop Covid-19, it's effective social distancing. If you live in a remote area, you can be out all day and not come close to another person.

If you live in a populated area, you could be out just once a week and be in closer contact with more people so, while you are being 'better' at keeping to the 'as infrequently as possible' guideline, you're at more risk of spreading the virus.

@Leflic the guidelines say as infrequently as possible. That's what I'm doing. For some that may mean once a fortnight, for others once a day. I'd love to be able to go out less frequently, but my circumstances dictate otherwise.

Seriously I don’t actually care if you get it

You see, this is what's so charming about people like you. So full of concern lest others go to the shop more often than they (in your opinion) ought to, yet 'not caring' if people get it. If I do get it, because of my RA, I'm likely to get it severely. But cheers for your concern, it's touching.

And you still haven't said why you consider my four shopping trips in one day to source medication to be non essential.

Why do people keep talking about 'the spirit of the guidelines'? There is no 'spirit'. There is what's set down in law.
Ever heard of statutory interpretation? Where a judgement is made based on the intention or spirit of the legislation?

YABVU

You sound like a boring snitch. Mind your own affairs.

I wouldn't be cross that she was flouting the restrictions you can't be worrying over other peoples stupidity it will get you nowhere. But when her DS is telling your DS that he is doing things that you have said are not allowed that would make me mad, how do you explain to DS that his friends mum is simple.

You also seem not to have considered that we are policed by consent, that there aren't nearly enough police and army to enforce a stricter lockdown if enough of the population decide that it's not happening.

That’s literally the point I first made! The rules/ laws aren’t being enforced. Yes the odd party in London may be broken up and fined or people that don’t leave the park when asked nicely to move on.
Where’s the law that says you can’t sunbathe in the park? There isn’t. There is one that says you can only be out for exercise, Infrequent shopping, medical needs.
No they haven’t defined essential shopping or infrequently in law. But shopping four time’s in a day and every day afterwards is frequent and it would be fairly easy for a judge to reach that conclusion. But you’re right because we govern by consent it wouldn’t get that far.

Just wish people would own it. Great you shop a lot. It’s not because you are supposed to, it’s because no one is stopping you.