To say... it's a fucking VIRUS

[ArtisanBreadBin]

The number of posts on here about how the NHS have recommended "antibac" no they haven't. I wipe it with "antibac" why would you. I can't find any "antibac" handwash, you don't fucking need it.

AIBU to hope that people can learn the difference between a fucking virus and a bacteria. If it was a bacteria it would be called CORONA fucking BACTERIA!!!!

In any case "antibac" is a waste of time and money, use soap and water. FML.

Well recently on a cleaning group people were comparing the differences between anti bac sprays and disinfectant. One woman thought that disinfectants or bleach were no good and wouldn’t kill viruses and you had to use anti bac instead. I think the clue is in the name anti ‘bacterial’ not anti ‘virus’ 🤷‍♀️ Anti bac might work to a certain extent but disinfectant is much more effective for cleaning.

They work on viruses too.

I love this thread.

OP's like a cat that's angry for no reason, biting and scratching the ankles of humans who are trying their best to ignore it.

choma

Thank you for this!
Exactly how this thread should have started! Are you listening OP?

Can we maybe have a list of “antibac” products that don’t Also contain either the appropriate alcohol % or surfactants?

OP I’m assuming that since you’re so wound up about this there must be a veritable plethora. Even listing one would help?

I think the main message is that, as hand washing goes, soap is all that is needed.
It doesn't have to be anti-bac at all.

op

If you are interested, this is a link to some of the extra ingredients in anti-bacterial soap for example.

So you can get soap - which is great at destroying viruses because it destroys the virus lipid bilayer

You can then add some specific anti-bacterial agents

For example

Triclosan -

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triclosan

Triclosan binds to bacterial enoyl-acyl carrier protein reductase (ENR) enzyme,[31] which is encoded by the gene FabI. This binding increases the enzyme's affinity for nicotinamide adenine dinucleotide (NAD+). This results in the formation of a stable, ternary complex of ENR-NAD+-triclosan, which is unable to participate in fatty acid synthesis

However - Triclosan is no longer on the EU approved list and must be named on US products

Dettol contains Chloroxylenol - which is bactericidal. (Dettol also contains surfactants)

pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Chloroxylenol#section=Agrochemical-Category

Chloroxylenol is a substituted phenol which has been widely used for many years as an ingredient of antiseptic and disinfectant products intended for external use [L1999]. It is known to be bactericidal in low concentration to a wide range of Gram positive and Gram negative bacteria

As you remember about phenols - it's what gives Dettol its smell.

I too would be interested to see if you can find anti-bacterials products that do not contain surfactants or alcohol but do contain chemicals that specifically target bacteria.

I think the main message is that, as hand washing goes, soap is all that is needed

This.

I get your passion @ArtisanBreadBin but @chomalungma is going to have more people listening to them and taking on board what they are saying because they are calm and explaining it well.

If you really want to make a difference in being listened to and being helpful in educating people, think about your approach. Shouting, swearing and being rude just switches people off from your content and focuses them instead on your delivery.

It seems that there are alcohol-free hand sanitisers.

www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-people-buying-alcohol-free-hand-sanitizer-doesnt-work-2020-3

This has links to covid myth busters, but doesn't actually state that it isn't useful for viruses.
www.vpharma.co.uk/trisanaf

@lweji

That article will make the OP scream - and fair enough

""Not all hand sanitizers are created equally, and the CDC and other health experts have recommendations for finding a gel that can kill the majority of unwanted bacteria on a person's skin"

I agree, though I like my DH to have antibac in his truck as he can't always wash his hands before eating, since the shortage we have had to be more inventive hence the purchase of a five litre container of cherry smelling (its all I could get) disinfectant, which he actually prefers as it's much kinder on his hands and he washes down the whole of his cab with it, he doesn't even mind the the smell lol

The CDC view on the effectiveness of non alcohol based hand sanitisers

www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/hcp/hand-hygiene-faq.html

Are benzalkonium chloride-containing hand rub products an acceptable alternative to ABHR for COVID-19?

CDC does not have a recommended alternative to hand rub products with greater than 60% ethanol or 70% isopropanol as active ingredients.

Benzalkonium chloride, along with both ethanol and isopropanol, is deemed eligible by FDA for use in the formulation of healthcare personnel hand rubs

1. However, available evidence indicates benzalkonium chloride has less reliable activity against coronavirus than either of the alcohols

The longer this goes on the more I think stupidity is our biggest problem

I alcohol gel my hands before getting in my car,it saves all this handle and steering wheel washing.

@ArtisanBreadBin

Can we just get you to shout and froth at the virus until it runs away?

I thought the OPs poor critical thinking skills and straw man arguments might have been down to a couple of glasses of wine last night but she's still at it today

There are lists by the US and Canadian governments which list the BRAND NAMES of the cleaning products that are recommended to kill Covid 19 (rather than the active ingredients). Does anyone know if a list of the brand names of recommended cleaning products has been compiled by the UK govt.? This really would help clear up a lot of confusion.

It's hard to get a list of recommended brand names. The PHE isn't that pro-active compared to the CDC

Here's an interesting one. Alcohol free hand sanitiser - it contains biocides which disrupt the membrance.

www.integritexeurope.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Medi9-Technical-Data-from-Integritex-August-2015.pdf

It's a detergent and disinfectant that seems used in quite a few medical centres - and is sold out.

Dettol spray and dettol wipes, actually do kill coronavirus it actually states it on the back on the bottle / packet

So your wrong OP

And i do not appreciate you private messaging me.
Your rude!!!!!

I wonder how many people @ArtisanBreadBin has private messeged, having a discussion on here, is one thing.
But there really isnt a need to private message me.

So rude and disrespectful

I voted YABU, @ArtisanBreadBin, because I stopped caring what your point was after your first few posts.

I've never seen such patronising, conceited posts on MN before.

If your idea was to get a message across to people who need to hear it, you need an attitude change. Nobody's going to listen to someone who's so insecure that they need to point out their own qualifications, take other people down, pm rude messages to those who disagree, and swear. You've completely undermined any authority that your qualification may have afforded you.

"Dettol spray and dettol wipes, actually do kill coronavirus it actually states it on the back on the bottle / packet"
I thought the same thing, but the coronavirus they mention is not Covid19. Dettol said it is likely to kill Covid 19 but not proven. Only thing guaranteed is alcohol or bleach.

I use fairy or bar soap with hot water. I save the anti bac for the kids to use with cold water