To put children in school when I'm not working?

[hibbledobble]

I know that at the moment, school is childcare for key workers only, and that children should only go in when necessary.

I'm a junior doctor, and I have just been sent to covid-19 wards, from previously doing a speciality.

I am happy to help in these extraordinary circumstances, but I am struggling with the current situation. There has been a lot of anxiety regarding the change into an unfamiliar environment, and lack of communication from the hospital. I haven't done general medicine for a very long time.

Emotionally it is harrowing right now, and I find myself crying daily at work. It is really difficult to cope. As doctors, we have been warned that we will all have PTSD by the end of this.

Would IBU to put my children in school some days when I'm not working, to give myself some space to focus on my mental health?

We know the risks but are willing to do our bit to help you do our bit for our friends, family and neighbours who may need you.

You may know the risks, but you obviously don’t understand them if you’re so blasé about them coming in when not necessary.

OP thank you for what you are doing for our country. I can't imagine the unbelievable strain you must be going through at the moment and we are all indented to you for it.

When it comes to your kids please please do whatever helps you to get yourself some headspace - self-care is so important the amount of pressure you're under.

Stay safe, take care and know we're all rooting for you xx

@Destroyer did you say what your job is? I missed it.

As for the people comparing being stuck at home with no play equipment to watching people die all around you? What the actual fuck is wrong with you?

OP as a senior frontline nurse I say yanbu at all we desperately need all hands-on deck. I am lucky my DH works from home so my dc stay at home. If I had to work without any break the emotional toll would be huge, please use the school that is why they are there. Ignore the destroyer I bet she is lucky enough to WFH so no need to worry.

My mental health is on the edge with what I have seen and had to do out of my remit. I dread work but, I like you go In because people's life literally depend on it. Most of the amazing teacher's on here agree with you. You are doing an amazing job and we need you.

I feel guilty for working and exposing my dc to this virus', they didn't ask for this but, here we all are. We need to all do what we do best.
Take care of yourself, I am quite worried about the emotional fall out from medical staff after this.

@hibbledobble you are missing out that if I was signed off sick, then the hospital would be short another doctor at a time when we are desperately needed

You are missing the point that if you are signed off with Covid, it’s no different - except more potentially fatal. You are at higher risk of catching the illness, your children are at higher risk of spreading it. If it spreads round the school children and school workers, you'll have nowhere to put them anyway. Your hospital will have more patients.

The testing is another matter for another thread.

In this situation there wouldn't be much additional risk as the children already go on your work days? I can see both sides here, as a parent I'd be keen to give you a break, but if you are able to do this then so should all the other key workers which would defeat the purpose of closing the schools.

I’m a teacher - everyone I work with I’m sure would be proud to look after your children on your days off. Please send them to school - the routine is good for them and the rest is essential for you.

Thank you for what you are doing for us all xx

If everyone who feels that they should send them in because they are more special than others, then there’s absolutely no way to keep the children far enough apart to 'socially distance' them properly.

Doctors and nurses are more “special” than everyone else.

It is quite clear that the pressure my medic/nurse friends are under is very different to the pressure and challenges the rest of us are facing. There will need to be a massive programme of emotional support and rest when this is all done but I doubt that will be prioritised. The OP needs to do what she needs to do to carry on working. If that means a few more hours of school then so be it.

I can totally understand why you would want to do it.

However, I don't think that you should.

I am a key worker so entitled to to childcare but but using it. The advice is only to use it IF essential. I have assessed that the interaction must increase risk for the children, teachers and key workers families?

I'm lucky that my husband can work fully from home and I can in the main. There is still important work to be done and we are both knackered, making up for lost hours of both child and work commitments later in the evenings.

I get that your situation isn't as flexible and top job by the way, and maybe if you need one day just to catch up, perhaps, but I think you know by even asking that it isn't what they have set it out for.

How old are your kids? Could they just chill at home? Presumably not?

Oh do bore off destroyer

@Rupertpenrysmistress hugs. I hope you get all the support you need.

@destroyer you are totally missing the point. By working at all, I am at risk of contracting covid-19. Yes, I would reduce my risk drastically by stopping working. If all doctors, nurses and HCAs stopped working then we would be in trouble.

I think you missed out earlier when I said that I have most likely had it already, so am most likely already immune. When, or if, an antibody test becomes available, this could be confirmed.

Interested to know what jobs those who are so against it are doing?

My dsis is a senior hdu nurse and has been drafted onto the covid ward.

She has told me it's the most emotionally and physically draining situation ever. The staff are also pushed to their limits.

She is so lucky that she hasn't got kids to worry about to put at risk.

Op take all the help you need xx

@Marieo destroyer is a housewife on benefit

YANBU - not remotely!

Your mental health is incredibly important, and you have to work in unprecedented and traumatic circumstances, circumstances I can’t even imagine. Plus, your mental health is important for your children too.

I used to work in palliative care and have seen a lot of deaths - but I can’t even imagine what this is like for you.

Thank you for all you do. There aren’t enough words to describe how incredible every part of the workforce is in fighting against this. But we are all with you in spirit, I hope that gives you some comfort.

@hibbledobble please know that many of your NHS colleagues in the field of mental health are aware of your plight and are working hard on providing support.

Have you come across NHS in Mind yet? www.nhsinmind.co.uk/
It has been designed to provide some support and tips for helping front line workers manage the massive psychological pressure.

Many of us are being redeployed to offer psychological first aid to help in the immediate term and to ward off PTSD.

Please feel free to send me a direct message if you'd like to know more.

As many others have said, it is right and sensible to practice self care

By working at all, I am at risk of contracting covid-19. Yes, I would reduce my risk drastically by stopping working. If all doctors, nurses and HCAs stopped working then we would be in trouble.

Of course, but I’m referring to the risk of your actions causing other people’s children and the school staff being more at risk if you don’t follow the guidelines and send them in when you’re not supposed to.

I think you missed out earlier when I said that I have most likely had it already, so am most likely already immune. When, or if, an antibody test becomes available, this could be confirmed.

If the virus can survive on surfaces and clothes, I’d be interested in seeing how you would prevent it spreading (even if you can’t catch it again). I’d be interested in this anyway.

Threadbare toe, thank you, I will have a look at that. My hospital does have some things planned too, which I am grateful for.

Destroyer, my children going to school an extra day isn't the big risk here. The biggest risk by far is the wards.

I take sensible precautions, as other HCPs do. I wear a surgical hat at work and scrubs. At the end of the day I take off the scrubs and wash my hands and face. I then go home (cycling, so I don't take public transport) and change my clothes again. My bag is left in my locker well away from the ward. I wear theatre shoes on the ward which I clean with clinell wipes at the end of the day, and these stay at work.

@Destroyer why can't other key workers put their kids in school full time if they want/ need to? I don't know a single nursery or school that's restricted the children to only days where they are working. They've all taken the attitude of a place is a place, they don't ask about working pattern or working from home.

I don't know a single nursery or school that's restricted the children to only days where they are working.

Ours certainly has. If there is a parent/carer at home, the families are asked not to send their children in to school on that day.

Each school/trust will have their own policy.

Antibody levels do not always correlate with immunity so you may well not be immune when the test becomes available. They are only an indirect measure. Some people may have immunity against a virus without detectable antibody levels, and some people may be very susceptible to infection even though antibodies are present.

YABU to put other people’s children at risk although it is a difficult situation I agree.

@feelinguseless101 I’ve already said upthread that my school won’t take my kids on days I’m not working. My sergeant had to provide a copy of the roster and even then they were originally only willing to take them for afternoon sessions on the days when I finish at 3am and start work again at 2pm although they did eventually agree to full days. They will not accept them at all on my days off, even when I come off nights. It’s to protect the staff, kids and the other key workers by having as few people as possible on site at any one time.

hibbledobble - Have you asked the school what their policy is? It may be that they are one of the schools that are happy to take children even when a parent is at home.

Oh destroyer there’s no reasoning with you.
I hope you or a close relative don’t get to hospital to find there’s no staff because 40% are off self isolating with Covid-19 (not a great situation) and another good chunk off with stress for the inevitable because they couldn’t cope (much worse situation as unknown timescale).
And the other small amount are spread too thinly and exhausted.

I’m reasonable and rational about this virus and there is a need to be following the rules but there’s also a need to be realistic and for the most critical workers this is a reasonable solution.
Also, it is probably reasonable to assume that during non working hours, when her children are at school, op will spend some time thinking about what she’s dealt with and solutions to problem she has faced, which just can’t be done with little children around.

So as well as recuperating it could actually benefit patient care and the fight against this.

But you haven’t shown an ounce of reasonableness so far.... so I don’t expect you will.