Son & wife's attitude issues

[doyafeellucky]

Sorry, this has turned into a longer post than intended but even then, I cannot describe all the situations and my frustrations.

Ive always been one to think I can work out problems but Im at my wits ends now. My wife and I both love our adult son who is now in his early 30's. Before our son and now wife were engaged and married, we thought we had made her feel welcome in both our home and family.

At first things seemed good. We have no problem with our son living a full independent life but, a number of things have hurt me. Im growing tired of the disregard being displayed by our son towards us and I feel we are being made into second choices. I dont expect our son to put us on a pedestal but think he and his wife should be sharing occasions more between the families rather than seeming to prioritise the others.

Prior to their marriage, I was shocked when we were told his future mother in law was organising a birthday bash for our son and would we like to come along? It was almost an after thought but hindsight suggests it was a hint of what was to come.

As most parents do nowadays, Bank of Mum & Dad, both us and our son's future mother in law helped them buy their first home. I didnt know at the time but her mother and partner were invited to house welcoming meal. We got no such invite which I find upsetting to say the least.

With initial income being tight, we asked if they'd like to come for tea, nothing special, once a month and they agreed. Everything was fine for the first 5 or 6 months. After one meal where my wife had spent time preparing, our son's fiancee decided she wanted to leave straight after the meal. I suggested my wife wanted some time to talk with them as she'd been preparing the meal and just upping and leaving was a bit unfair on her. Apparently that didnt bode well.

Later, we learnt my son's then fiancee started saying we were 'too formal,' whatever that means. Next our son says his fiancee didnt like coming to our home which meant they started visiting us less. When they visit together, they are always on their way out somewhere else or are coming back so they cannot stay long.

I have noticed she is always looking for an excuse to leave as soon as she arrives no matter how much effort we make to talk. She's more interested in her phone and What's App. But I come in useful at times for her being asked to take her to the nearest railway station from time to time.

Now, the last couple of times they have popped around, she has started staying outside in the car, again, meaning we dont get to see our son for long.

The actual wedding was something else, Our family was made to feel like it was there to make up the numbers. Unknown to us at the time, numerous official pictures of the bride and groom with all her family were taken. Despite members of our extended family being present we got 2 official pictures of my wife, our other son and myself with them. Even then, we were an after thought at seeing and being able to order the official pictures and given just 1 week before orders were no longer being taken. That hurt me enormously, goodness knows how my wife felt.

I later found out that during the evening reception when my wife welcomed our daughter in law into the family, she said our family name was 'sh*t' and she didnt intend using it although she does do so in all letters etc. I would probably have made a scene if my wife had told me this at the time.

It's the same at special occasions. 2 out of the last 3 Christmases, we have had to decamp to her mother's home because 'she always spends Christmas at her mother's and couldnt give a sh*t whether her now husband is with her or not.' Those are her words. We invited her family to ours in return for the first Christmas and would be happy to do so again but their plans are already made etc, etc so sorry we cannot make it.

Both my wife's and my birthday are near Christmas. Im not too bothered about celebrating my birthdays anymore. My wife and I had discussed it and decided to mark her birthday with some informal pub grub. But my son then says his wife doesnt like 'pub grub' which is strange because the last Christmas meal was at a pub! So we ended up having a restaurant meal which was nearer my birthday and not my wife's as I wanted.

The last straw is son and wife came around on Saturday to say they are going out with her mother for Mother's Day and would we like them to visit us 'on the way there or on the way back.'

If these events were being held at my son and his wife's home, Id have no problem with this but every special occasion has to be at her mother's home, venue of choice or involvement. We dont even get the opportunity to ask would you like to go out for Mother's Day, anniversay etc.

I find myself hoping my son and wife do not have any children, I am convinced we would never see them while they'll spend all the time at her mother's.

Im at the point now where I consider I need to make my feelings clear to our son. If he wants to consider us as second choice parents, Im not inclined to make him first choice inheritance.

My wife seems prepared to put up with this while Im not as I think it's only going to get worse and we continue to be pushed aside. I really dont know how to broach the subject with my son. I find it hard to believe he doesnt see what is happening here because there are lots of other things going on that I havent covered.

Basically, how should I approach this? Thank you for reading and any input.

OP, i though you were being a bit demanding till I reached the bit about their wedding. Snubbing you and leaving your family out of the photos was disgraceful, and a very odd thing to do. Sitting in the car while your son comes in to see you is an insult.

I don't know what to suggest except to stay cordial and keep inviting them to your events. Perhaps organise something you could invite her parents to as well? Being friendly with DIL's parets may be the best way to stay inside their family network.

This all sounds very intense. Your son is an adult but you talk about him like he has married, his wife is now a part of your family and so he, and his wife, should fit in with your wishes and you and your wife should enjoy(live vicariously through) both your son and his wives life, since she is now part of your family. Your DIL and DS don't seem to be able to go anywhere without each other, which is also intense. It's seems to me that your son has switched intense parents for an intense wife. Someone is going to have to loosen the reins. Your son can see you on your own surely. Why does everything have to be agreed between so many different adults. It's too much.

It was unbelievably rude of her to tell your wife that your name was “shit”! It that really what she said?
Also the staying in the car is dreadful.

It does sound like you have been seeing them fairly often though and have hardly been cut out.
You have to think what your objective is here, and not indulge your impulses. If you and your wife would be happier to have no future involvement with that son and any children they may have, then disinherit him and have a big confrontation.
If that would make you unhappy, then however unfair it is, you have to play things carefully.
Were your parents and your wife’s parents very involved in your lives as newlyweds? Your son may not share your expectations.
I’m sorry your DIL appears to be unfriendly and rude, however you must grit your teeth and remain welcoming and pleasant. Don’t force things but show a passing interest in her, her job, her family.

Good luck.

My mother didn’t like my paternal grandmother who, to be fair, was hard work. She had no issues with my grandfather. But, we spent far, far more time with my maternal grandparents. My father was 1 of 7, so no particular hardship for grandparents, and we dud visit (they lived on a farm 90 minutes away) at least once a month.

My father used to visit my grandmother routinely on his own, as did I, after my grandfather passed and we were grown.

Even if DIL doesn’t want to see you, your son should make an effort to come around on his own.

I suggest you build a life of your own with no expectations from your son or DIL. Spend your money and leave your son’s inheritance to others in the family, or to a charity. You can always change it if things improve. Just don’t complain, and have no expectations.

She does sound rude...but I think that's the difference with sons and daughters.

Something really stood out to me. You said that it took a long time for your son to even introduce her to you. It may be that your sons relationship with yourselves isn't quite as good as you thought. What was preventing him from introducing her to you? I have no idea what kind of parents you are but in your own words, you're relationship was great because he was "spoilt rotten." That doesn't necessarily equate to a great relationship. My parents gave me everything I wanted but it wasn't necessarily the right thing to do. Please remember that there is someone in the middle of all this. Your son. You have no idea what he is saying to him wife.
There are always three sides to every story. Yours, theirs and the truth.
Also, my married name is a bit shit too and I told my MIL this. We had a great laugh and she agreed that she wasn't a fan.

Quite frankly, as a parent to adult children myself and had similar experience with my eldest daughter, I sort of understand your predicament. The way I dealt with it was just backed off and let her be.
She's an adult, she's free to spend her time with while she wants and when she wants. I had to learn that the problem was actually with me and not her. I was still in the 'mother entitled' zone. Had expectations that I wasn't entitled to have and unknowingly, they can be quite full on for the child. It must've have been horrible for her to be torn between myself and her partner.
I've learnt to love her differently than I had done before, in that, no pressure to see her, spend time with her on special occasions. She spends Christmas with her in-laws and it doesn't bother me at all. She goes out with her friends on her birthday, again no problem to me.
In fact, with my changed ways-we are so much closer than we have ever been and our relationship is wonderful now.
I would back up a bit and let them be. It sounds like you're pushing them away whilst trying to pull them in. Time x

That sounds like a good plan that Emptywallet is suggesting.

Are you more hurt for yourself or for your wife, OP?

Dil is rude if she said your name was shit. But you only have someone else's word for that, correct?

Yabu to expect them to split special occasions 50/50. It's not up to you & you are not entitled to a say in how they spend their time.

It didn't seem like you were joking when you said 'I've said she's my favourite dil. She says she's my only one. We can't win'.

If you said, 'your time is precious & yours to do with as you will. We'd love to see you occasionally & if you're free to come for a meal we don't expect you to sit around for ages afterwards if you have other things to do, we're just happy to have you & check in', they might actually feel more welcome & inclined to spend time with you. You seem to have some sort of mental scales in your head as to how they should behave & split their time. You do not need to talk to ds about this & I'd be worried that by doing so, you will alienate him further. You don't come across here as someone I'd not want to spend much time with. Sorry if that offends & perhaps you are not like that in RL. I don't know.

You have called anyone who hasn't made positive comments trolls. It's not nice if you don't get your own feelings confirmed but there's often a reason for that. The reason is that the majority of the population don't agree with your outlook.

Maybe you're not as easy to be around as her family.

You're asking the wrong people for a sympathetic hearing, the MN default setting is that her in-laws are to be ignored, his in-laws are the only ones who matter and if he dares to suggest otherwise he is guilty of the ubiquitous sin of failing to support her, ie agreeing woith everything she thinks.

I do think that it is really hard being parents of a son on mn..parents in law do get a hard time !! Am not sure how to play this..just be supportive toward your son and he might grow some balls .

This sounds awful OP, and not unlike another more famous family at the moment. Your son is being pushed around by his wife, for some reason, and needs to grow a backbone and assert himself more. You need to talk to him about it, also being assertive, but not aggressive or in a demanding way. Just point out the facts that his wife's disapproval and rudeness and the exclusion of you and your wife is hurtful, and you would like it to change. Whatever you do, do NOT mention or hint at anything to do with inheritance or money. That would give them every excuse to cut you out altogether, and is in any case a separate issue. Hope it all works out better for you.

Well OP - I think your idea about 'special family occasions' is a bit unrealistic and old fashioned. I come from a big family and we certainly didn't all get together for my parents wedding anniversary - I'd send a card and if there was a do for their 25th or 50th anniversaries I was there. But I wouldn't always see them on their or my birthdays either. Again cards would be exchanged and we'd exchange presents when we next saw each other.

Its clear that this is how its going to be. So you need to adapt and do different things. Suggest meals out, a drink with your son, a walk or visit somewhere. Offer the help them with practical things - dont always expect them to come to you. Get on with your lives and be busy and don't guilt trip them. And unless you really never want to see your son again don't threaten to disinherit him. Thats horrid. How can you equate having a meaningful relationship with money? It doesn't say anything good about you and no one loves a blackmailer.

A PP mentioned ages back about "sitting around waiting for the crumbs from their table" I used to be like that. I would babysit at a moments notice and that included midnight, 2 a.m. and many other weird times. I helped with DIY I cleaned houses when they were so messy.
I offered day trips, a few days break, money etc. Then I realised I was only ever contacted when they wanted something.
I changed my life. I decided not to sit waiting for any contact at all. I joined clubs, went to classes and had to refuse babysitting as I had plans for the day. They were not pleased that I started a life of my own and therefore not always available. I even met someone which was a happy event for me after years of being alone. The DC never spent any time with me, just dropped the DGC off. Now I get to go to places, daytrips and short breaks away from home. It is nice but it would have been nicer if my DC had been more communicative and pleasant. The person I met was not impressed with the swearing and demands that I got. It is sad that DC have acted like this but their partners who are cocklodgers would not really want to be around someone who actually is a man.
As for inheritance why leave money to people you hardly know?

OP you're an inlaw to a DIL you're not going to get much help here. Women are perfect don't you know? And all in-laws are the devil incarnate!!

Sadly there is a saying "A daughter's a daughter all of your life and son's a son until he gets a wife"

And it is so true. My eldest son goes on holiday with her family, spends most Sunday's with them. My DIL even had an argument with my son in front of me, when he wanted to go to his own sisters birthday meal, instead of her sisters birthday.

My son told her that no he would go to his sisters bday and she could go to her sisters. I didn't want them to argue so I changed the date of the birthday meal, so they both could go to both.

However Mothers Day and Christmas it's always her family's house. I always smile and say I don't mind whatever is easiest for you both. I dread to think what will happen when they have kids, I'll never get to see them.

It's so so so sad but a lot of women are like that with their husbands and quite rightly if the woman is making her husband choose, he needs to chose his wife. I talk him regularly on his handfree when he's driving home from work. That's the only time I really have with him.

It breaks my heart but what can you do? He's happy. He's knows I'm here if he needs me. And that's all that matters to me.

My brother's first wife was from a very wealthy family, he came from a very poor single parent home. Our mum worked very hard, she supported him through uni where she could but the reality was she just couldn't compete. They took him on as their son and made it clear from day one.

Sad reality was when they divorced he had no one. Although there was no fall out and we stayed in contact we'd very much built our own lives. We barely know our niece, and he doesn't know our children. It's sad. But it is what it is.

He took an interest after the divorce and I was there as a sibling, he started visiting and we had a lot of phone contact. Then he remarried and the same thing happened.

I really hope he doesn't need anything from us one day because in all honesty I won't bother to be there emotionally again.

I can't believe your DIL is so rude - it would take nothing to pop in and say a cheery hello when passing. It sounds like you have done a lot to make her feel welcome.
My advice would be to realign your expectations - lead your own lives and accept they may not be a big part. Always include them in appropriate invites, share little snippets of news/photos on whatsapp, and make it clear you value their company and the door is always open.
If you come across as needy or having certain expectaions from them, it creates guilt and other negative feelings and there will be push back.

I personally hate the idea my DC will only see me out of duty rather than becasue they actually want to/enjoy spending time with me.

And ffs. Don't tell your son you're going to disinherit him. It will probably make things worse.

You do however have every right to leave the entirety of your estate to the local cats home if he doesn't manage to grow a pair of balls over the next few years.

Your DIL sounds really horrible OP.

Maybe just start inviting your son over and leaving her out as she's made it (rudely) clear that's what she wants.

I wouldn't let the rude cow in my house.

When you are a parent, there can never be a "last straw." The door always needs to be open. ROFL, tell that to my mil..her threatening us with legal action killed that relationship stone dead after 27 years.

I am irritated with those posters who've had a go at the OP for being formal, and 'making' them go round once a month. Firstly, it's nice to read a post that is spelled correctly, and has paragraphs. Being able to write a coherent account of something doesn't make you 'formal'. Secondly, the invitation for a meal once a month was to relieve financial pressure on the son and dil, as money was tight for them. I would have seen that as a nice gesture.

My db went much the same way after his wedding; and even now, after 25 years of marriage, only sees my Mum when he can be arsed to do so, and blew her off at Christmas a couple of years ago, when it was his turn to host her, so I had her for the second year in a row. My sil never wants to speak to my Mum when she phones, although she is happy to borrow money from her (and Mum is retired). I have come to the conclusion that we are all just very different people, and if db wasn't my brother, I wouldn't give him a second thought, or go out of my way to spend time with him, or my sil.

If I were you OP, I'd get on with living your life and having a great relationship with your other son. You don't have to change how you do things in your own home to suit your dil; be pleasant and welcoming, but it is your home, not hers. Don't let either of them walk over you, and spend the money, as you can't take it with you. One could argue that he has had his inheritance up front for the house deposit, so should not be expecting anything more. Stop being available to help (or to be used as and when it suits them), and you might find if they feel they aren't central to your existence that they have FOMO, and come around more.

Good luck; I have an only child (not by choice), and I am wondering how it will play out when he meets someone.

If you give your DS an ultimatum, force him to choose, then he will choose his wife and your relationship will be destroyed.

Personally, I'd forget about seeing them as a couple. Still invite them to things, but don't expect them to turn up together. Instead focus on your relationship with your son...go out together just the two of you. Ask him over to help out with something then offer him a bite of lunch. Let him be around you with no pressure, so he can relax and enjoy his time with you. You can still have a relationship with your DS, even if you aren't close to your DiL.

It sounds a bit like a Meghan and Harry story.

So sorry you are going through this. I would likely back way off but keep the door open for him in case his marriage falls apart.

I certainly wouldn’t be available to drive her to the train given she sits in the car instead of coming in to say hello.

What happens at your house when they visit? Your daughter in law rightly makes the effort with her own family and involves your son, but what is your son like with you? Does he make any effort or is she left to flounder in an environment that she finds uncomfortable or tense? It’s possible there’s just a few crossed wires but for the most part, your son seems to be getting off the hook while everything is directed at her.

Your hurt is almost leaping off the screen and I’m sorry for that, families can be hard work at times.

There are people who are just like this. We have had the same issue in our family. It's not you, it's her. She would have done the same thing to whoever she married, regardless of what their family were like.

For whatever reason, certain people when they get married set down a course of isolating their partner from their family and friends. It truly is abusive behaviour, but because the culprit is often female, people don't call it out. It is a slow process, the extreme behaviour never starts immediately because if it did, then the partner would have run a mile. The partner is like a frog being slowly boiled in water, they don't realise what they have married until it is too late.

You won't change her. Anything you say or do will be used against you - as evidence of how unreasonable and nasty you are too her. 'You see, this is why I don't want to see your parents'. I think the best thing you can do is continue to make it clear to your son that you are here for him and hope that one day he comes around.

How is he with the friends he had before he met her? I would be willing to bet that he mostly sees her friends now, or friends they met when they were together. If he does see his old friends, it will be on his own.