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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think checkout lady was being OTT about alcohol and child?

445 replies

Potkettlexx · 20/02/2020 15:02

In supermarket yesterday with DD 7. DD struggles at school so I let her help with shopping to get her used to the concept.

Bought some bread and small gift pack bottle baileys £5 for in-laws bday.

Got DD to scan the gift box and the bread and press the correct buttons etc... (dd Aldo has some sensory and coordination difficulties so again it helps this doing practical things)

DD wanted to pay with my card so I told her what buttons to press and gave her the card to tap on card reader. Dd didn’t really understand so I just gently took it from her and tapped my card myself.

Before I took over, dd was trying and the woman supervising the self service tills piled up ‘ohh you’ll have to be the one that pats with the card’ or something to that affect.

I was thinking.... for real?!

I get that they need to be very careful when selling alcohol....

I get that a 15 year old can look 18....

I get that an 18 year old could be potentially buying it for younger friends....

I get that they could be disciplined if they were willingly selling alcohol to under 18’s....

But for goodness sake, surely common sense would say she really didn’t need to say that under the circumstances.

After all, the reason the sale of alcohol is forbidden to under 18’s is incase they drink it and quite right.

That’s not the same as the this situation. It was clearly evident I was the one ‘buying it’ and giving my consent. Does she honestly think I was planning on giving it to my 7 year old?! 🙄

OP posts:
Franklydear · 20/02/2020 16:15

@cautionary, there is no good reason, when I was a cashier, it would have been because I didn’t want a big fine and a criminal record, simple as that.

Fedupofdoingit · 20/02/2020 16:15

poster Potkettlexx
@FakeFraudSquad

Give over a horrible attitude. What a horrible attitude you’ve got to another mumsnetter that dares to question something!

You are the one with a horrible attitude! You think it is okay for an employee to risk her job and be charged for selling alcohol to a minor, just so your daughter can play around with your bank card. Didn’t you see the earlier post where someone was fined £80 and given a written warning for a similar occurrence?? What age do you suggest should be the cut off for buying alcohol??

messolini9 · 20/02/2020 16:17

but for anything to go ‘wrong’, I would have to give her it to drink.
No - the illegality isn't purely the consumption by a minor - it's also PURCHASE by a minor.

Do you honestly think someone would have the time or money to take the lady to court? Who would do that?
Retail staff are trained not to allow this situation, & warned of secret shoppers & fines of up to £1000. Yes - £1000, a personal fine to the employee. Also job loss. Would you risk it, OP?

Again, the only way would be if I gave dd the alcohol to drink.
Again - no. See above.

Quartz2208 · 20/02/2020 16:18

noway the law isnt grey though in this instance and doesnt have a common sense application. If you scan the card you buy it. The law here is incredibly black and white.

RhodaCamel · 20/02/2020 16:18

I was shopping with my 12 year old dd the other day, she had chosen some false nails (which unbeknown to me contained a small pot of glue). Dd was paying with her pocket money but the cashier wouldn’t sell it to her as she was under 14. Fair enough but when I said I would pay they refused, I then said dd could sit back in the car, I’d go round the store, pick up a new pack and pay for them myself but they said they still wouldn’t sell them to me. I don’t blame the staff, it’s not their personal policy but it is starting to grate on my nerves with the amount of policies, rules and regulations we have these days. Whilst I appreciate that we need to protect the young/vulnerable etc it really is becoming a complete nanny state and more about fear of legislation and sue and compensation culture more than anything.

Esspee · 20/02/2020 16:19

You are railing against the supermarket and the employee when your gripe is with the law.
If it bothers you so much write to your MP suggesting the law be changed.
There is no leeway with the law and you are the one being unreasonable.

lonelyatchristmas · 20/02/2020 16:20

I work in a retail shop and let me tell you OP if I was caught selling alcohol or cigarettes to a child be it by them Tapping or inserting the card even with parents next to them it is an instant dismissal, we would be sent straight out the door no questions asked all because it's the law and to be honest my motto in work is that I don't care how insulted someone gets about ID I will not apologise for asking someone or refusing to serve.. I will not put my job however much I dislike it at risk so your daughter can tap the card..
We have mystery shoppers as well where the guards and the shop send underage people in to see if they get served.. That happens and I could be prosecuted so I understand
100% why that woman did it..

Mulhollandmagoo · 20/02/2020 16:21

So you’re goddaughter won’t serve people alcohol even though she knows they are over 18???

It's not that she won't, if it was up to her she probably would, but she can't!! She's bound by policies and procedures set out by her employer, regulated by the licensing authority. Whatever we think of it, it's necessary. Those cashier's would have to pay a fine themselves if they were caught and it's not worth the risk for them....your issue is not with the store assistants but with their employers who write these rules for their employees to follow! You're shooting the messenger here big time!

Becca19962014 · 20/02/2020 16:23

I frequently get refused alcohol. I'm late 40s.
There comes a time when it's a compliment! Though I do feel for staff if they happen to find out!!

I'd like to add however, that the risk to the person supervising the tills wasn't worth it. Not only are they all covered by (sometimes real life monitored) CCTV but the charge against her would have been automatic - there's no appeal it's just done end of. In some places the fine is passed to the employee in full, plus a fine for management and the employee can find themselves dismissed and banned from working selling alcohol for five years (I think it's five) and it seriously impacts on your ability to get another job and you can forget claiming out of work benefit as well because this isn't something that could be viewed as an accident.

Also your child shouldn't be playing with your bank card.

That said I want to know the opinion of the 20% who agree with you that it's ok!

LolaSmiles · 20/02/2020 16:24

In other words "why won't the shop staff break the law so my child can play with my debit card".

I hate the 'they should break the law because I could give them alcohol at home' argument. It's simple:

  • Underage children can't buy age restricted products.
  • Whether a parent chooses to allow their child to try alcohol in their own home over the age of 5 is their business
They are two different situations.
ShiveringCoyote · 20/02/2020 16:24

OP there are literally hundreds of other places you can use for working on your childs difficulties. You expect an employee on minimum wage to pander to you. Would you support them and pay their wages if they lost their job because your kid wanted to tap the card?

Skysblue · 20/02/2020 16:26

Yabu to expect a stranger to break the law and risk her job for you.

Yabvvu to argue with everybody who points that out.

Yanbu to find the law / procedures a little over the top, but that’s not what the thread is about.

Don’t bother replying to me, I won’t be checking the thread.

GabsAlot · 20/02/2020 16:26

who said it was another customer that would complain-if she gets caught by a random check she'll get charged and lose her job

Quartz2208 · 20/02/2020 16:27

cautionary because it relates to licensing laws and the license that a shop has to sell. The offence relates to on its behalf. Licensing fines are harsh and without defence

When it comes to your own home the legal age is 5

sunglasses123 · 20/02/2020 16:29

I think this is another case of a person thinking they know better than the shop, the law, the employee and the fine imposed.

The most important thing here for the OP was that her daughter be 'allowed' to play shops. Stuff anyone else. The law isnt for her. To the PP who suggested that the OP pay the fine...

100% they would disappear off the face of the earth. In a previous role I was occasionally asked to push my clients order to the top of the queue because for all sorts of worthy reasons (not!) they had forgotton to place it in the first place. I was shouted at and told offices wouldnt open in time because the infrastructure wasnt there.

Without outing myself if I had rung the supplier and tried to get them to push the order to the top I would be fired. Of course I wanted to please my client and once an order is in I could start charging for the service so it was definitely in my interest to do this but every year I had to undergo online training confirming that I understood if I ever tried to bypass the process I would be fired.

I used to calmly explain this to the irate people and said as much as I was tempted to do it I couldnt...I would be fired! No one would then say I dont care what happens to you. I just want my order expediated!

But in this instance the OP wants laws but doesnt want them to affect anything she might want to do including messing around with cards, alcohol at a till and a child.

I was once on a plane waiting to take off and a women refused to sit down because she wasnt sitting next to her 12 year old son. She claimed she had been told at check in that it would all be sorted out once on board (i.e others move to allow her to sit next to her snowfake). The boy looked like he couldnt give a stuff. The steward did try and get people to move and eventually bribed someone with some extensive duty free but honestly. If its that important to you ffs - reserve a seat in advance!!

Mulledwineinajug · 20/02/2020 16:29

I once had this with a two year old ‘paying’ for petrol. Ffs.

ACautionaryTale · 20/02/2020 16:31

"- Underage children can't buy age restricted products.

  • Whether a parent chooses to allow their child to try alcohol in their own home over the age of 5 is their business"

Which is not what I am saying.

The child is not buying alcohol I am
i'm buying alcohol for my kid to drink at home

According to everyone here, you can't sell it to me if you know I intend to do something perfectly legal with it.

maggiecate · 20/02/2020 16:31

The are a couple of reasons that you have to ask for ID even if you know the person is over 18 . First is conflict avoidance. If you don’t ask them the next person you do ask can say “well you didn’t ask them!” and you’re then into a situation where one customer is legitimately aggrieved that they are being treated differently, and conflicts can escalate. Secondly You have to be SEEN to be following process. If there’s a secret shopper or just a regular customer who is concerned about underage drinking they can report back that not everyone is being ID checked.

Canadianpancake · 20/02/2020 16:32

So tell me again why the law doesn't apply to you?

RhymingRabbit3 · 20/02/2020 16:32

And that’s all very well saying the technically dd bought the alcohol, but for anything to go ‘wrong’, I would have to give her it to drink.

Her buying the alcohol is illegal. You giving her to drink is not illegal (bizarrely).

The trouble is that if this is allowed, would it be acceptable for a 12 year old to "technically" buy alcohol with you supervising if shes obviously helping you? A 15 year old? There is no gray area - under 18s are not allowed to pay for alcohol and your daughter is under 18. The shop assistant is doing her job and she is the one who would be in trouble - not you!

Youngatheart00 · 20/02/2020 16:33

It’s a supermarket, not a playground. Can’t you just get the weekly shop done without your 7yo ‘helping’. It’s not charming to anyone else. The shop assistant, as many have said, was just doing her job.

GabsAlot · 20/02/2020 16:34

and dont alot of kids have those personal cards now they can buy stuff with to get them used to money noone knows if it was hers or yours

buckeejit · 20/02/2020 16:34

Sorry OP. YABU. Just tow the line & set a good example. It sounds like one of my children arguing with me about something! There has to be a line & there it is

SoupDragon · 20/02/2020 16:35

When one facepalm isn't enough

To think checkout lady was being OTT about alcohol and child?
Quartz2208 · 20/02/2020 16:36

mulledwine yes of course you were stopped because the age for buying petrol is 16 and the act of scanning the card is buying.

Part of this I think is that we have become so removed from the act of handing over money its like a credit card scan isnt really paying and its just waving a card. Except it isnt. Its completely the act of buying