To think people expect too much from mothers of very small children?

[BellingtonWoots]

Well, parents, not just mothers, but mainly mothers. Because I'm starting to feel like this is the case.

DD is 18 months old. I went back to work when she was 9 months old, but did bits and pieces at home and KIT days from 6 months. DH works shifts, so I do most of the bedtimes, getting ready, breakfast, though DH does have days off where he does everything while I work. So DH isn't the problem here. It's more of a general thing, how other people see me/what society expects of me.

I honestly feel like I hit the ground running since DD was born. We had family and friends descend on us for daily visits for weeks after she was born, which was lovely in a way but very tiring and I didn't get to rest as much as I wanted. I had a section and although I recovered well, it was slow, and I still have pain and discomfort around my scar.

No sooner did things get into a routine with DD, and no sooner was she a little less dependent on me due to weaning, than it seemed I had to go back to work. Life ever since has been extremely busy, and all of a sudden she's 18 months old and becoming a toddler really

She doesn't sleep well, we're tired and we have very little time to ourselves. I would love to stay at home and go at her pace- trips to the park, reading stories- but I have to work. I have cut down my hours, but I simply couldn't afford to be a SAHM and I don't really know anyone who is- PILs already seem to think I'm taking advantage of DH by reducing my hours.

People also seem to think that I have loads of time on my hands now. SIL was always asking me to watch her four year old when I was off on maternity, even when DD was only six weeks old and I was still very sore. I had friends asking me for lifts, asking me to pick them up from places, because they knew I'd be home. People invite DH and I to things, and get ratty and offended when we say we can't come. It's not like we are the first in our circle to have children, in fact on DH's side we are the last. They are always asking DH for favours too (related to his job) asking him to come and do this or that at their house. Most of the time he says no, but still. We really do have such limited time together as a family, and even less as a couple, we are lucky to even get an hour in the evening because of DD sleeping badly, we don't want to give up half of Saturday running around to please other people.

My parents are very good, to be fair, and I remember as a child they would have done things like pick up my aunt who had a small baby to save her having to drive to Granny's 70th party, because "she'll be tired and it'll be nice for her to have the rest" and there was an understanding that small children were hard work, that sometimes they prevented people doing things, and although the women in my family all had jobs ranging from teacher to cleaner, there was a sense that staying at home for periods of time was totally normal and understandable as well

I don't know if it's just the circles I'm in now, but I feel like the pressure is now the opposite way- you're being selfish and self indulgent and weak if you don't make the baby fit in with your previous life, you shouldn't make any changes, you shouldn't fall into the trap of being a boring mum.

I've realised I have to put really firm boundaries in place and to ring-fence my time at home and with DH and DD, and my time on my own as well, or I could run myself ragged pleasing other people. I find it so hard being away from DD too. Luckily I can leave her with DH no problem, which I do at times, and obviously she gets childminded, and it's fine, but I don't WANT to leave her a whole lot more than that- I had her because I wanted to raise a child, and when I'm home from work I want to actually see her!

I think it's depressing how much crap is seen as "the norm" these days. Long exhausting commutes, juggling work and childcare and school holidays and being professional at work all day and still having the energy to be an attentive parent when you have a crap sleeper. It all seems like such a miserable slog and all people can say is unhelpful crap like "you just get on with it like everyone else"

I also agree with the eco nagging, the average working parent isn't likely to have time to travel to the only place that sells food without plastic or the shop miles away where you can fill your glass bottles with washing up liquid. We need realistic solutions.

Completely agree OP. Add to that the expectation that we don’t ‘look’ like mums as well. We must look younger than we are, manicured and we must not complain etc etc there is a lot of pressure!

I don’t think a lot has really changed just the challenges bringing up kids is hard work. However these days taking care of a home is much easier.

managedmis if I had to sod around with handmade granola bars I think I would burst. Where do they think there is slack in anyone’s day to fit this in?

ncagain I chucked a peanut butter jar in the bin the other day, because last time I attempted to wash one out (which took ages), my sink u-bend got blocked and I had to throw a load of unblocking chemicals down it to get it working again, so it completely negated any eco benefit from recycling one small jar. It’s still not draining very quickly, so will no doubt have to do it again shortly. The whole point of a curry ready meal is that it saves time and effort. If you have to spend ages scrubbing the tray afterwards it defeats the object of having it in the first place.

I agree Snuggy that we need solutions that are realistic and achievable and take account of the fact that so many already live insanely busy, exhausting lives, and are barely keeping their head above water as it is. It’s great to compost, quadruple your washing up by washing every recyclable item, buy products from the refill shop, etc, but it all takes time (and often more money), and one has to have extra time, energy and money to do it.

I actually think its societal expectation now. Its some what expected for mothers to retain a career and be a mother.

I think it must be your circle of friends and acquaintances, OP. I never experienced this tbh. Also you need to learn to say no to things. I can't say that it remotely occurred to me to think about whether I was being a 'boring mum' or not, or whether I was doing enough or trying to keep my life like it was before the baby. Why would it be?!

I don’t think extensive periods in childcare is good for tiny tots.
I don’t think financial dependence on a man is ideal either.
I don’t think women being exhausted trying to do it all and have it all leads to anything but feeling worn out and dissatisfied.

I agree. Ideally, women would have the option of finding a balance. In practise, most women find that one of those things has to give for a time.

I think you didn't have time to recover properly post c-section and it's all snowballed .

Finding any sort of healthy medium is very difficult.

i agree OP. I have a lovely but extremely challenging 3yo who has very rarely slept more than 7-8 hours a day, hardly ever sleeps through the night, and is up every day at 5am. I just can’t have the sort of relaxed life other parents seem to as there is literally not one single waking moment when I am not at work or dealing with my super energetic child or desperately scrabbling to keep on top of housework. I’ve just reduced my hours so that I can have half a day a week to get the laundry done. If I am feeling really low about it I sometimes (unhelpfully) tot up all the extra hours other parents of my acquaintance have had to themselves since their average-sleeping dc started sleeping through. (Just short of 3 thousand more hours than me).

Hang in there. I am told it does get easier!

I agree OP , after my DC were born I had to very suddenly find a backbone because I was amazed at the expectations suddenly placed on me. It was a tough time actually and I lost friends and family relationships.

I have to say, now my DC are 7 and 4 and the fog if sleep deprivation has waned a bit , I do not regret losing those relationships. In fact if I really sat and thought about it I would be angry that when I needed some leeway, I seemed to get none.

Early parenthood for people is different but for me it was no picnic. I was exhausted , had to go back to work (I had no choice financially) in a demanding job with non sleepers. More than anything I needed some understanding but actually it seemed as if it increased tpeoples expectations of me. As if by suddenly becoming a mum meant I could spin 50 more plates than before when in reality I didn't have a clue how to manage it all.

I snapped and started saying no, and frankly oddly a helpful cocktail of hormones and sleep deprivation bringing me to my knees meant I no longer cared if people though I was rude. I was in emergency mode just getting through the day.

Now years later I'm grateful that happened because my spine is steel and I dont hesitate to protect my family time .

It becomes a strangely positive thing OP, dont hesitate to protect your time and energy , yes you may lose relationships but I guarantee they wont be ones that make much difference in the long run. On the other hand, the people who did behave like human beings I am eternally grateful to and have my undying friendship and loyalty , when things were hard they were still there without any pressure and I've never forgotten it.

This is not the fault of feminism. What bullshit.

This is consumerism and the demands of modern life. Wages have not kept pace with the cost of living. There are very, very few people who can afford (it are willing to make the massive lifestyle changes) to be SAHMs anymore.

My DH earns 55,000 a year and we cannot afford for me to stay at home. We live in the smaller house in a nice area. The cost of food and bills and our mortgage, relative to our wages is staggering.

OP- your friends and some family sound unsupportive. But you said you have been a helper in the past. They have come to expect you to accommodate them and you simply cannot put others first now you have you child. Draw some firm lines.

I think feminism is a red herring. A real feminism would look beyond whether something generates money and appreciate the value of women's work whether that's in a formal job or caring and childrearing.

Oh god the eco nagging! The expectation to do baking! (I was a crap baker pre kids, not magically better post kids). The sheer orchestration of family life! At least there is no expectation to sew everything from scratch- my mum was one of very few working mothers where I grew up, and all the other mums sewed their little darlings clothes. Mum was looked down on as she had no time/ability/desire to sew. Anyhoo. One thing i have struggled with returning to work is an expectation I will dial it back and not become too successful. I manage a high level position within part time hours. The hours have stayed the same while my position in the company has gone up. My success has been blamed as the reason for my dc’s health issues, and friends and family expected I would be the one to quit and look after said dc (despite me earning 2/3 more than dh)
You can’t win.

@Honsandrebels

100% this.

I had a male colleague assume I wasn’t coming back to work after having DD. He was already busy taking over areas I was responsible for (without being asked) because apparently having a child would mean I didn’t have the brain space for things i’d Spent most of my adult life becoming an expert in.

FFS

You are not being unreasonable OP...I lived in the generation where someone said women can have it all...its not true by the way but its expected we can! Something has to give for us to remain sane! I would love to tell you it gets easier and to be fair it does but then wait til school starts and the primary school years bring a whole lot more pressure and demands....You need to look after you and decide as early on as you can what is appropriate for you ...do this now..learn to say no and learn to be happy saying no. My one piece of advice would be to chuck the manuals to life in the bin and live as you feel comfortable..if you want/need a pyjama day or indeed weekend with your little one do it,,just do it with no explanation needed and no apology. It will not be long now til your little one can wobble about in the fresh air in your garden as the nights get lighter and days start getting warmer then she will sleep! Cooped up in the winter months with dark nights and central heating does no one any good I dont think...sat in the garden on an evening with a cuppa and a little one toddling around is much better ...hang on in there!

YANBU op and that's without your cheeky sil and demanding friends. Holding down a full time job while looking after babies and infants is hard and society doesn't value staying at home to look after dc either. It's getting better but many men still don't step up enough on the home front and do their proper share precisely because they don't feel the same societal pressure to do so, because somehow looking after babies and small infants is shoved under the heading of "low status, women's work".

I think the pendulum has swung too far the other way and society, especially the UK, doesn't make enough allowances for parents with DC under six, or the unavoidable fact that small DC tend to have lots of minor illnesses and often don't sleep very well. The baby and child should imho, for the future health of society as a whole, be put at the front, back and centre of social and economic policy. And yet child fees are ridiculously high and nursery workers poorly paid. All of that is far too much pressure as it is.

Add to that the current (often commercially driven) influence of beauty and domestic goddess bloggers on Instagram and You Tube and young mothers are now meant to be perfect nurturing mothers, holding down a job, keeping fit, with tidy minimalist home, batch cooking at weekends all while making farking memories and maintaining family relationships and those with friends. Expectations on mothers of babies and infants are completely unrealistic.

The welfare of babies and infants and mothers and the family unit as a whole (whatever shape or form that comes in) should, within reason, come ahead of commercial imperatives between the ages of 0 to 6. It's not that long a time in the life of a human being taken as a whole, and I for one would be prepared to pay higher taxes to accommodate it. And call me old-fashioned but I think society as a whole would benefit.

I hardly dare speculate as the economic and societal pressures for mothers to return to work early are so huge, it's almost seen as heresy to suggest that babies and infants may not always benefit 100% from being cared for outside of the home, but I often wonder if the current declining mental health of teens in the UK isn't somehow related to the quality of care children receive in nurseries when they are one among many . Before everyone shouts me down, I am certain that nursery care in some instances can be very beneficial to some infants (and some mothers), and there are many other reasons for poor mh in adolescence, the smart phone being one. But I don't think enough serious research is being done on how being in paid childcare affects young children emotionally and developmentally and what affects this huge societal shift, and the stresses it provokes, has had on mothers of babies and infants either.

Also I am relatively lucky in that I work 4 days, tto & my commute is 20 min drive & school 250 metres away. I have a cleaner & a hands on mother so I should be able to do more.

DC2 came into bed at 4am & I'm a light sleeper so didn't go back to sleep so I'm already knackered.

This has never interesting reading, and makes me feel less alone. I have no idea how some people seem to manage - although thinking about it the ones I know either have lots money or parental help or a nanny. Or a big house where they can just throw all their mess into one room and shut the door!

I do constantly feel guilty for struggling though. I know I should feel grateful and enjoy these times. And I do, but it’s just they are buried under a layer of exhaustion and outstanding to do lists.

Thank you all- typically I haven't been able to get back to reply until now, but I'm a little wet of eyeball due to some of the replies - it's so nice to realise I'm not alone

I don't want to go back to the 1950s,but I do think capitalism and big businesses jumped on the idea of women as a new, cheap, source of labour, and I think there's element of "this is what you asked for, so why are you complaining" at play. When in reality, I don't think many women DON'T want to work ever again, I certainly wouldn't like it, but what I WOULD like is a bit of leeway and acknowledgement that raising a family is important and time consuming - I've worked since I was 13, I'll probably have to work until I drop, the way things are going - would, say, five years at home to get the lion's share of the physical part of child rearing out of the way be such a big deal? I think it would make me a more productive worker in the long run, when I did go back after these hypothetical five years.

Yes to the National Trust properties - it's not enough to go and run around the park anymore, it has to be Instagram worthy. My friends wanted to meet up the other day - we couldn't meet in the perfectly nice coffee shop which is close and convenient to us all, we had to drive for 40 minutes to try this awesome new sushi place. I cried out, and got a "well YOU organise it next time". I was the one who always organised!

Of course I can grow a backbone and say no, but the expectations are still there to begin with, and the energy needed to stand up to them

I actually think my life is quite a lot easier, as someone who works full-time, than a lot of my friends who work part-time - they seem to be expected to do their full job in a fraction and they have all, without fail, been expected by their DP to do everything at home. I have the longer commute so DH does more than me. We also did shared parental leave, which I think was the best decision we made. I don't know another couple in real life where the DC aren't seen as more of the 'woman's job' and I do think that often starts on mat leave and goes from there.

People always advocate stepping back at work when you have children but there are lots of advantages to being a bit more senior. I set my own diary and can work from home if necessary. I think it also helps a lot that my job is mentally engaging but not at all physical - it's basically the opposite of wrangling a toddler, so each feels like a nice contrast to the other. Doing something where you're on your feet all day and then coming home to a toddler must be very different.

You sound like a total martyr to be honest.

Why don't you just say no?

Yanbu

I have no idea how families manage with two full time jobs and young children. They must have no rest time at all.

I do also think sleep makes such a difference. DS generally sleeps well but life is certainly much, much harder when he doesn't. When I first went back to work he was an awful sleeper and it did feel like we were just barely surviving, and things felt so different once he slept well. I think if you've ever had a baby/toddler who sleeps well it might be hard to see why you're finding some of it so tough, but that doesn't mean you're wrong to do so!

In some ways the school years worry me more. I don't want to be a SAHM until my children are old enough to be left on their own during school holidays but the holidays just sound like a nightmare especially if you don't have a retired grandparent nearby or kids that don't want to do long shifts at holiday club all the time. That's even if there is a holiday club open longer than 9-3.

I'm hoping to find a term time job but obviously there are only so many.