Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to be heartbroken

524 replies

MonnaLIza · 01/02/2020 12:35

It's a beautiful, sunny day. I am healthy. I have a new job, which I love. I also love my DH and kids and I am loved by them. We own a good home, a 'machine for living in', with room for everyone, and we can afford food and occasional treats such as days out and holidays. We bake bread, make muffins (which sometimes turn out to be edible) and go support our local football team. We are all reasonably educated and articulate, fully tax solvent and in socially meaningful professions (that's me and DH, our kids are in education).

And yet, there is a definitely low mood in the house today, and this is not just because I am recovering from clinical depression. Today, even if nothing seems different, is the first day of my life as an 'outsider'. I am no longer a EU citizen in my own country but officially an 'other'. An immigrant.

I am now somebody who needs to prove their right to be here, in their own home. Another layer of bureaucracy, more practical struggles. But it's the change in my 'status' that breaks my heart. I am no longer part of this country which I have made my home for the last twenty years.

Yes, I have 'settled status', an invisible document, which I have obtained in a much less easy way that the government would like you to think (for instance I could not use my iPhone to register as it only worked on android phones). An invisible document which proclaims to be valid until it's valid. No doubt in the future there will be more hoops to jumps, more papers to fill and i just hope these hoops and jumps will come when I am fit, young and tech-savy enough to be able to jump them.

I will, of course, snap out of this, but at the moment I am, I think not unreasonably, heartbroken.

And my biggest heartbreak is not for me - Katie Hopkins compared immigrants to cockroaches for our resilience and, ultimately, I am resilient. When I realised the industry I was in was getting destroyed by Brexit and austerity I got another job. I have qualifications and skills. I will survive in my immigrant-coackrochy ways.

No, my biggest heartbreak is for Britain itself, for the people who have been interviewed on TV who are celebrating Brexit without being able to articulate one single benefit of it to their life. I have lived in this country long enough to have seen another Britain, a multicultural, vibrant, accepting country, where having an accent and coming from somewhere else was considered an exciting, interesting thing. I can still see that in some enlightened places, which are increasingly engulfed by the darkness of 'patriotism'.

I guess I am heartbroken because I had not only imagined a brighter future, I had seen how great things can be, and now the lights are going off.

We are discussing moving to Scotland or Ireland. It would be easy for me and my DH but harder on their kids. They are born in England, they are English. What to do - stay and resists? Move?

I do not know yet. I will know soon, we will talk and make plans.

But today I am heartbroken.

OP posts:
potter5 · 03/02/2020 13:45

Over dramatic post. Everyone from the EU now has to fill out the form. You aren't the only one.

I voted to leave - purely because of all the money we have to send the EU which could be spent on people in this country who need it.

I voted to leave - because of being dictated to by the EU.

We are the UK and we should be governed only by the UK.

MonnaLIza · 03/02/2020 13:55

@potter5 and all the leavers: go gloat elsewhere and leave me and my internationalist fiends here to mourn what we have lost.

Go play and make little cardboard cutout of the daily fail.

OP posts:
zafferana · 03/02/2020 13:55

It is not the EU, and immigration, the cause of poverty and austerity in this country it's this heartless government that you guys have elected. A government of schmutz elected by klutz!

That's pretty rich coming from an Italian. I love Italy, but its governments are generally a shambles. Are you saying all Italians are klutzes too for electing them? It really doesn't help your 'woe is me' cause to bitterly criticise the people of this country that you claim to want to live in.

I was sympathetic initially as I think a lot of people feel a loss with our exit from the EU - I know I do - but you're now coming across as petulant, bitter and entitled. Governments get elected that many didn't vote for, referendums are held and the results may not be what you want, but deal with it and stop being so whiny. If you're sincere about wanting to stay here then fill out the forms and stay. As I said before, you're welcome here, but stop expecting everything to go your way, because it won't.

MonnaLIza · 03/02/2020 13:56

@WhereShallWeMoveTo. Aren't you a capitalist? Pay up baby. I am not taking to you for free. Only to nice people and you ain't. Bye hun! X

OP posts:
Nonnymum · 03/02/2020 14:01

I am. So sorry you feel this way OP. Just remember not everyone in the UK wants this a huge minority don't. And if the latest polls are to be believed actually the majority of the Country want to Remain now!
You are welcome here, much more welcome than the idiots who are posted racist stuff on line and should tin abuse at anyone who is different from them.

MonnaLIza · 03/02/2020 14:01

@zafferana frankly I never wanted to live in the UK. It just happened. If I had chosen the Swedish chap over the Scottish chap now I would live in Stockholm. Or perhaps in NY. Or maybe Rome. And I make no apologies to say that who voted Tory was a bit of a klutz. You know... Turkeys... Xmas....

What makes me sound entitled? The fact that I am concerned that my destiny may be like a considerable amount of my Italian family who died because they had the wrong belief?

OP posts:
Nonnymum · 03/02/2020 14:04

I voted to leave - because of being dictated to by the EU.*
There was no dictatorship from the EU. We were part of the EU we helped make those rules. We even had a veto so if we didn't like the rules the UK could veto them. The Idea of the EU being a dictatorship is ill informed nonsense

LochJessMonster · 03/02/2020 14:07

This - I think you're being a bit dramatic. Nothing has really changed for you and life goes on.

Lndnmummy · 03/02/2020 14:09

Yes OP, I feel exactly like you do. I have lived and paid taxes in this country for 20years. My husband and children are born here. I love this country, I am always respectful of where I am. I cheer for the English football team, I cook a roast on a Sunday. I watch East Enders. On Friday I had to explain to my 7 year old why “people don’t want his mummy to live in London”.

It IS heartbreaking and for what it’s worth, I don’t trust the settled status either. This is the second wind rush generation.

Lndnmummy · 03/02/2020 14:18

LochJessMonster
This - I think you're being a bit dramatic. Nothing has really changed for you and life goes on

How dare you? A hell of a lot of things have changed for us. How dare you? As an example having worked here for 20 years my father now needs care. He lives in a EU country. He now won’t be able to come and live with me so that I can care for him.

“Nothing has changed for you” how ignorant and deluded.

zafferana · 03/02/2020 14:21

You sound entitled OP because you seem to think that because your relatives suffered you have the 'right' to live under a government of your choosing. You don't. I don't. No one does. You either live in democracy that will sometimes vote in a government you don't like, or you live somewhere that doesn't give anyone the vote and I'm pretty sure that that's worse. And please, own your choice. You did choose to live here, because you chose to marry someone from this country. You could've married someone else, by your own admission, but you chose this country when you chose him. So own it. You might feel a bit less powerless if you start owning your own choices in life.

WhereShallWeMoveTo · 03/02/2020 14:38

@WhereShallWeMoveTo. Aren't you a capitalist? Pay up baby. I am not taking to you for free. Only to nice people and you ain't. Bye hun! X

Good grief, you'll be poking your tongue out at me next. I'll take it from that response that I have won this particular debate.

LochJessMonster · 03/02/2020 14:43

@Lndnmummy you chose to live in a different country to your father. There is nothing stopping you from going back and looking after him in whatever country he is in now. No one is guaranteed the right to live in whatever country they want.

Brexit is not stopping people from living in the UK. Its stopping uncontrolled immigration which is detrimentally affecting the country. Being against uncontrolled immigration is not being racist.

Dragonembroidery · 03/02/2020 14:47

Really OP you don't seem very kind.

I voted leave. Various reasons:

  1. EU is anti democratic
  2. EU has ridiculously high subscription fees. Independently verified to be in millions, despite the lie of remainers, that that was a lie. I've had (ex) friends scoffing in real life "did you see that on the side of a bus??!! Ha Ha you thicko"
  3. Middle class toffy nosed elitist privileged chattering classes annoy me.
  4. Their arguments were paper thin. I see the world hasn't come to an end as forecast. No need for stockpiling. Plenty of jobs. Plenty of workers rights.
  5. Now the world has proven that point 4 was nonsense. They're trying a new tack. #thick
  6. No one likes being called names. I'm not racist, my mum is from Nigeria. I'm not thick either but I suppose you will say I am.
  7. Thank god for democracy
  8. Europe is a continent. We haven't left Europe
  9. UK economy already on the up. See Nissan in ft.
  10. What about italixit? Are they to be called racists and thick too?
  11. It's split families and friends and remainers are still going on and on despite LOSING. #get over it and we can try to mend society. It was only a bureaucratic club. Bureaucratic clubs come and go.
Lndnmummy · 03/02/2020 14:54

@LochJessMonster, deep breaths

As a matter of fact quite a few things are “stopping me” from “going back” to care for my father.

  1. my husband and his family are British and live here. His mother also have caring needs.
  2. My two children are British and go to school here.
  3. I own a property here
  4. I have a career here (and by that I also ensure that 100 + Uk families also have a job/income). If I “went home” those people would loose their jobs too. Who will pay for their food?

And again Brexit IS stopping people from living in the UK. It will also not stop “uncontrolled” immigration. You are very naive if you believe that.

And yes, being against “uncontrollable” immigration is a very very racist stance indeed. Because you fail to understand, or care, about the greater issue at stake.

Lndnmummy · 03/02/2020 14:57

@LochJessMonster, yes I choose to live in a different country to my father. And by making that choice I have contributed hundreds of thousands of pound to the economy in taxes and national insurance contributions. I have also provided hundreds of “uk” families with an income to feed there families.
On the whole, I have contributed to the UK economy more than I have “taken”. I pay for private schooling and medical car, yet
Contribute thousands each month to “the system”

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 03/02/2020 14:59

And yes, being against “uncontrollable” immigration is a very very racist stance indeed
How is it racist..should no country be allowed an immigration policy?
Immigrants are people, some good, some bad, some a benefit, some less so. Not everyone is a positive contributor to a society!

LochJessMonster · 03/02/2020 15:02

@Lndnmummy Great that you have contributed to our economy. You are exactly the type of person who the UK welcomes and encourages. Brexit won't stop that. It is not about stopping people coming and living here. It's about being able to choose who can live here.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 03/02/2020 15:02

I have contributed hundreds of thousands of pound to the economy in taxes and national insurance contributions. I have also provided hundreds of “uk” families with an income to feed there families TBH tax in the UK is pretty low, not to mention you come off incredibly arrogant- yes you pay tax- many many of us do!

Dragonembroidery · 03/02/2020 15:03

Looks like the UK made you very rich. I wish I was rich. Very few third generation (or more) brits are.
Wonder how Italians would feel if it was like that there.

TiddlestheCat · 03/02/2020 15:14

@NomDeDieu

I respectfully disagree. I say this as someone who recently nearly lost my husband. He spent weeks in a coma on a life support machine. His body shut down. His heart stopped. He's Canadian (we've been married for 15 years and have children together). We've done the whole endless forms/visas/having to live in separate countries/surrender careers etc. We've recently had to move out of our house and into my parents. We've had our lives turned upside down many times. In fact, the company that he works for folded on Friday without warning,so he's just been laid off with no redundancy. This is problematic because he still has lasting health difficulties and is unlikely to find a new job as easily. Yet I can categorically tell you, that, in my experience job loss/moving countries/uprooting is difficult and sad, but does not compare with the trauma of watching a loved one's body shut down. We were extremely lucky. He survived. So the word 'heartbreaking' should rightly be used for the very worst that someone can go through (people who have been through far worse than I have). In this case the OP will merely have to fill out a load of forms. Probably much much less paperwork than has been required over the years by my husband and I. She is not going to be sent back to Italy having resided in the UK for so long with English children. People talk about being kind on this thread, but I have seen little kindness exhibited to the poor poster whose child is critically ill! She is right to introduce a sense of proportion. I wish the OP all the best. I have many friends from many different nationalities. I am married to one. I am a remainer. I just object to the overuse of the term 'heartbroken'. It's a tad melodramatic imo.

Lndnmummy · 03/02/2020 15:29

I’m arrogant because I’m trying to justify that I’m not here to scrounge? Jesus wept.

Sarcelle · 03/02/2020 15:32

The OP's first post was very dramatic. Her following ones compound that impression.

This decision to leave may not be what everybody wanted, but we don't always get our way. It's time to put the hysteria, resentment and negativity away. It's done, move on mentally, if not move somewhere where you do feel valued.

That is not me saying, if you don't like it, go back to your own country, it's saying that if you genuinely feel resentment and unhappiness about how things have played out in the UK, move somewhere else. Or just accept it, it cannot be changed.

OnlyFoolsnMothers · 03/02/2020 15:35

Lndnmummy I dont think you are here to scrounge. Equally I dont think everyone who has migrated to the UK is a net contribute or an NHS saviour. Hence the need for an immigration system

TheGreatWave · 03/02/2020 15:41

EU has ridiculously high subscription fees. Independently verified to be in millions, despite the lie of remainers, that that was a lie. I've had (ex) friends scoffing in real life "did you see that on the side of a bus??!! Ha Ha you thicko"

The "fees" were never debated (though it isn't quite as clear cut as some came back) but the implication that the money would go to the NHS.

Middle class toffy nosed elitist privileged chattering classes annoy me

You can't be middle class and elite.

Their arguments were paper thin. I see the world hasn't come to an end as forecast. No need for stockpiling. Plenty of jobs. Plenty of workers rights.

We haven't actually left, the stockpiling was over No Deal. Let's see what things look like next year before claiming that.