AIBU to wish I hadn’t taken away Friday night from dd5?

[MeAndHimAndHer]

DD, 5, is usually fairly well behaved and compliant. For the past three days she has been horrible: really cheeky, rude, demanding, whiny. She’s been acting as though she’s really tired and hungry when she’s neither!
This morning she refused every step of getting ready for school, to the point of full on tantrumming. In the midst of all this, when she had calmed after an outburst over teeth cleaning, I told her that any more of that behaviour this morning and Friday night would be cancelled.
She looks forward all week to staying up late, playing board games, having a treaty late tea.
Anyway there was more shitty behaviour, lots of it, and I said more than once, that she would be having an early night tonight with none of the above.
Now it’s nearly time to collect her and 1. I feel guilty that she’s made it to the end of a difficult week with no Friday joy and 2. My evening is going to be horrendous as she will be so upset and her behaviour will no doubt continue the same as no reason not to, so bedtime will likely start early and take hours with more screaming and tantrums.
I have to carry through though, don’t I?

I’d follow through or she knows you make empty threats.
Sounds like she needs an early night anyway! I think 5 is old enough to understand consequences.

Bloody hell, threats, sanctions and punishments? Even the words are harsh.

You can change your mind, OP, it’s OK. If that were my DC that behaviour would mean they were more in need of reconnection and safe boundaries (like predictable activity due to weekday) not less.

I don’t threaten my kids. They are nice people. If they aren’t being nice, there is a reason for it. I wouldn’t threaten anybody else either!

I feel sorry for the wee girl. That kind of behaviour, out of the blue, is a sign of something. As you say, OP, it might just be testing the boundaries, but it could be anxiety about something else too.

You follow through and be more mindful of the threats you make in future.

You cannot teach children that their poor behaviour doesnt matter if they are good for an hour later.

She will probably be mentally exhausted. January is awful.

Could also be hormones.

What you do not want to do is teach her mummy doesnt mean what she says.

There's always a reason for behaviour. They genuinely do not have the psychology to purposely wind you up until around 7-8 years. Something is bothering her under the surface.

Instead of reinforcing negative behaviours, praise positive behaviours.

Up to you what to decide to do regarding this evening, as backing down may reinforce that with a tantrum she still gets the treats. But if this is out of the ordinary, maybe try talking to her and see what the outcome is before making a decision.

Having said that, parenting is tough. You're doing a fab job.

Agree with Tantrums that at five a day is a very long time and she might just decide mum is being mean for no reason. She may struggle to connect a tantrum in the morning with no treats at bedtime. See how she is and if you feel you need to do something, explain why. I’m with modifying what you would usually do in terms of treats but giving her lots of love. At five we don’t have many emotional resources and we act everything out, so it’s worth seeing if she is worried about anything or just not well.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'cancelling Friday night'.

She's still going to need something to eat and something to do, you can just scale it down ie tea as usual time rather than late and a bit of TV/film rather than board games which, if she's tired and cranky, are probably asking for trouble anyway.

And an early night.

Just spend sometime with her, listening and trying to get her to put her worries into words rather than acting them out.

You don't need to either 'treat' or 'punish' her, to 'give in' or 'follow through'. Relationships and life are more complex and nuanced than that.

All the people saying follow through- she’s 5, and been at school all day
Do you really think she’s going to get the connection? She probably barely remembers the tantrum this morning. It’s not an immediate consequence, so it has no meaning to a 5 year old

Also- I did plenty of apologising for being upset and angry and saying things in the heat of the moment and none of my kids are twats or arseholes, they are pretty amazing kind considerate young adults

Love how there's four pages of posters urging the OP to follow through.

I'd follow through because the threat was made and you need to be consistent, but try to make the early night an alternative event rather than a punishment. Snuggle up and read extra bedtime stories (we call it Story Marathon), have a snack and a quiet chat while cosy about anything that's bothering her and how sometimes when we feel angry we need to get some extra sleep to feel like ourselves again.

Worked for DS2. He actually asks for Story Marathon now if he's feeling a bit overwrought.

I did plenty of apologising for being upset and angry and saying things in the heat of the moment

Maybe if you've only said it once 'heat of the moment' works. But the OP said it more than once, and the behaviour continued.

The OP is hardly going to send her DD to bed on bread and water, having made her sit in a corner facing the wall until bed time. There's still going to be food and interaction and a chance to talk about things. But even if there is a reason for the behaviour - tiredness, illness - at 5 she's too young to understand that it makes a difference. All she'll remember is that mum doesn't really mean what she says so I can do as I like.

I’d give her the chance to earn it back. She’s 5 and I know here it’s been a long week and everyone in our house has felt a bit under the weather. I’d move towards a cosy movie night with blankets and cuddles and let her relax. Tomorrow is another day.

@TheHouseWithTheBambooDoor - yep, sniggering (like a 5 year old) here.

Be a parent follow it through .
non of this earn it back shit in other words be as naughty as you want then good for a bit and it's earned back.

Do you really think she’s going to get the connection? She probably barely remembers the tantrum this morning. It’s not an immediate consequence, so it has no meaning to a 5 year old

It’s not a dog but a human child & even at 5 will remember if NT

She's 5?! Dear me.

Have a lovely evening with her, try and work out what's causing the behaviour. There's always a reason. Don't withold the loving; that's exactly what she needs.

BambooDoor thanks for that image ...

Or you could give her a cuddle, explain how upset you were with her behaviour and have a scaled back evening?

Don’t do that. You set a consequence, stick to it. Otherwise future consequences will mean nothing. It won’t do her any harm and maybe an early night will help if her behaviour is about tiredness.

You should follow through as you've said you'll do it. If you don't, the next time she kicks off and you threaten to remove something, she won't believe you.

Cancel the usual activities

Cuddle her and talk to her instead. Read to her while she has a lie down, etc.

No 5 year old acts like an arsehole as a choice. She is doing the best she can. Punishing her by removing activities that make her feel close to you, is literally the opposite of what you should be doing. Closeness and connection is how young children learn to cope with emotions and tiredness.

Whenever I read about parents punishing children for struggling I just think, who the fuck hurt you. It's so sadistic and counter productive.

No 5 year old acts like an arsehole as a choice.

I've had two 5 year olds, they certainly do if they can get away with it. They are even bigger arseholes at times when they are teenagers.

Children do the best they can with what they have.

If you're a parent who habitually punishes a child for their moments of weakness, then yes, you'll end up with teens who act like their parents - I.e. like arseholes

Anyone with a cursory understanding of developmental psychology knows that, but I appreciate they let anyone have kids etc

Please follow through. I had parents who didn’t always and it was not good for me and still has some issues.

I think nearly all 5 year olds are tired at this stage in the term. School can be exhausting!

I'd definitely find a way she can earn it back

From some responses you'd think you were talking about cancelling her Christmas, birthday or summer holiday . It's a Friday night. Yes, she looks forward to it all week but there will be another one in 7 short days.

This is in a perfect sweet spot (important enough to her that it matters; not a rare event or so important that she'll really be losing out on anything) to teach her that you mean what you say and her behaviour has consequences. Yes, be kind about it. Tell her you're sad too that it won't be the usual fun Friday, but unfortunately that's the choice she made this morning and ypu both have to live with it. Give her cuddles, read a story, reassure her that you're not angry and the argument is over.

But for God's sake (or more to the point, for your daughter's), you have to follow through.