to find it impossible to forgive Brexiters

[mrsmootoo]

Can't forgive Brexiters for voting Leave. Find it impossible to move on from this. If there are any positives about leaving EU (?!) they are far outweighed by Remaining. Brexit posts on social media are so aggressive and unpleasant - you lost get over it. Really concerned about my kids' prospects, not being able to travel/work abroad as easily etc.

I feel a lot of anger towards Cameron, Corby, Boris and FArage
I don't feel anything about leave voters. There was a ballot box, they had a choice, they looked at the campaign and picked the one they liked.
I don't think it was a great choice but its the one made and we just need to make the best of it now.

YABVVU.

There is this wonderful meme:

Why should remainers respect the leave vote? Just because a majority of the UK population voted for something doesn't mean it will be the right decision for the Uk. People make silly decisions all the time. Only in hindsight, when they see that their lives will not be transformed by Brexit will they realise it was a shit move.

Imagine what it’s like to live in some of the countries we’ve meddled with who are living with the aftermath. Imagine having been born in British Hong Kong and experienced being “given” to China. Shit happens. Raise your children to do better and do good where you can.

Despite how people voted I truly believe that this country has been damaged beyond hope. Twat Boris saying he was going to unite the country, same with Gove on the radio tonight. How are they going to do this when people are still so polarised.

But what good is anger going to do you? I could be angry about lots of things I don't like, but it won't change them. So it is a waste of emotional energy.

This, although you can't pick what you're angry about, it's true. I've reached a stage where I think the best thing to do is quietly let it play out. If (I strongly suspect when) it all goes utterly wrong, then is the time to make sure the government are held to account. it's not the fault of immigrants, or remainers, or benefits scroungers. This country is fucked because the Tories are arrogant wankers using it for their own self-serving ends. So let it play out and when it does, channel that anger to make sure the right people are blamed.

I mean it might go swimmingly well. It's just very, very slightly possible it will be OK, in which case phew. The greater likelihood is that the economy will tank and people will suffer. In which case, if you voted for this, do not look to me for forgiveness.

I can't forgive Brexiters for their vote, especially as it's seen as 'democratic'.

Tell that to Northern Ireland.
Tell that to Scotland
Tell that to Gibraltar

Right now all of those countries have had their democratic voice muted.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

This time next year it will be yesterday's news.

Given that the transition period ends on 31st December and we have yet to negotiate a deal for what happens after that I suspect it will be very much still current news this time next year. People don't seem to realise this doesn't end on Jan 31st, that's when it starts!

What did Gove say?

I don't know anyone who gave a fig about the EU in 2010, it was a non issue, the media and farage stirred the pot after Cameron stupidly threw them a bone, i won't judge them over a vote tbh most regret their decision anyway and are rather worried about the future.

Not sure if this is quite accurate. I remember the 2010 elections and travelling to visit a friend on the south coast. The villages there were full of UKIP posters.

UKIP scored the highest number of votes in the European elections in 2014 (albeit with a low turnout). That couldn’t have come from nowhere.

Still we don't hear anything from leavers about how anything will be better. No concrete answers just 🦄 and 🌈 and some rubbish about Empire!

The OP is simply being honest about how she feels. This is an anonymous forum. For what it’s worth I feel very similar. Privately I have no interest in people who voted for this. I can’t really be bothered with wider politics anymore. All the politicians on the radio are odious without exception. I shall continue to concentrate on minimising the harm this has done to my own children. I know a lot of people who admit to feeling ‘turned inward’ like this.

It’s time to move on. People have different opinions and that’s just life.

I don’t like conservatives running the country but I don’t hate the people who voted them in. It’s called being a grown up.

Brexit is happening - at Christmas, theoretically. Friday is Stage 1.

The tedious 'frustrated underdog' thing that has been the bone keeping the Pro-Brexit people jumping is going to wear increasingly thin.

I don't understand the psychology of people who cling desperately to a victim identity in the face of the achievement of their wishes.

It's bizarre.

I guess, as it doesn't result in cake for all, there will be some mileage in: 'We're still being denied our Cake Brexit by saboteurs!'

But I think that will wear thin.

If only because true winnners will emerge: the disparity between the south east and the rest of the U.K. is likely to increase; the disjunction between those in declining industries and those in areas of demand will accelerate; income disparity between the very well-off and the rest of us will also accelerate.

So it's hard to see how that alliance of victim hood will persist.

It's going to be interesting.

I actually feel fairly resigned. I didn't choose this. It's not my responsibility.

I'm sad I have to go through it - but, on the other hand, a ring-side view of history is interesting.

www.gov.uk/visit-europe-1-january-2021

Even just looking at the government advice on travelling after this year, I can't believe anyone thinks it is a good idea! Just buying travel insurance is going to cost so much more than they had to pay in for many people. And that's before you look at EVERYTHING else.

i'd rather be living in a post brexit britain and feel safe than many places in the world with wars, famines and disease. we are very fortunate to live here. anyone who thinks otherwise that's their opinion.

Then I assume you were not living in Northern Ireland up until 1998.

@TheRealMcKenna I do apologise, my error.

I have several friends and many ex-colleagues (healthcare setting though I'm not a clinician) from non-UK backgrounds, many from the EU, and I'm not kidding when I say for us, Brexit is like a bereavement. I worked in France and Germany as part of my student year abroad in the late 1980s, and I remember how very difficult and time-consuming it was to get anything done. Yes, we have better technology now, but we have even more bureaucracy than we had then.

Just for fun, could any Brexiteers take a walk around their local supermarket and have a look at how litle food, especially the fresh food, is actually grown in Britain? And much of the food that is grown/produced here is picked/processed by, oh, let me see, EU nationals.

I was a civil servant for a little while and one of the things that still sticks in my head was a presentation from a navy officer who asked us all to guess what percentage of everything we eat, wear, and use comes in to the UK through the ports.

Most of us guessed somewhere between about 40% and 80%.

The actual answer?

97%.

At least that was the case in the early 2000s.

And most of it had to pass through Europe at some point.

I'm SOOOO looking forward to eating a diet of mainly porridge, potatoes, apples, berries, Cheddar cheese, and wilted lettuce for the remaining half of my life since at least they'll grow here/can be produced here. Not to mention spending every holiday from now on in Cornwall, Wales, Scotland or Northumberland. (Not that there is anything wrong with those places, I love all four, but you cannot guarantee the weather. Even in August.)

Thank you for the podcast recommendation though, I'll definitely give it a look/listen.

Ah i am a remainer and was so upset and angry but you know what, we have to move forward now. I can’t hate so many people around me who I know personally and know to be good people.
However. . . When/if it all goes tits up I’m certainly gonna be an annoying “I told you so “ person 😂😂

And while we're on the subject of shit decisions, all those that voted Tory, just so they can get Brexit done are idiots too. The number of people I know who are struggling to make ends meet, struggling to support their kids through university and watching their children come out with huge debts at the end of it. Friends with children with disabilities who have seen their benefits cut. The school I work in having to cut staffing levels, struggle for resources, class sizes rising, SEN kids left unsupported because of cuts to services. And yet the very people affected by all this keep voting Tory!

Equally, I’ve felt a lot of racism from people saying “I don’t understand why an ethnic minority would vote for Brexit”. I feel like they’re saying “you’re not REALLY British” and I find that upsetting and offensive but I keep quiet and try to hear all views. There we have it. I'm sorry you have had to endure that. Were they well off white people. Autumn telling you how to think? I voted Remain and couldn't understand the result of the referendum at all. Now I do. It's part of a cultural backlash. The last General Election was the Brexit election whether people like it or not.

Most of them seem more focussed that the other side lost than the fact that they won. It's a strange, but telling, mentality. The main motivation for Brexit was to withhold UK money from other "less worthy" EU countries, rather than what it could do for the UK. Most of them accept that our economy will tank but it's apparently worth to keep our money "in-house".

Don't let them rub your face in it. Focus your efforts and emotions on rejoining. Apparently some of them spent 47 years trying to reverse the UK joining the EU. So will be able to understand that many of us will be doing the same to get us back in. Positive action is the future, not looking back with bitterness and resentment.

Impossible to forgive and hate are two very different emotions.

Please stop conflating the two.

The Brexiteers won and the Remainers lost by a small margin.

So I guess Brexit should happen and once done Brexiteers should reach out and seek to heal the gap with the Remainers.

But as it is they just crowing. Ringing bells to mark it. It's insensitive, it's ugly and ungracious. That's why you can't forgive them. And neither can I.

Thanks Urgay, you made my point very elegantly.