to find it impossible to forgive Brexiters

[mrsmootoo]

Can't forgive Brexiters for voting Leave. Find it impossible to move on from this. If there are any positives about leaving EU (?!) they are far outweighed by Remaining. Brexit posts on social media are so aggressive and unpleasant - you lost get over it. Really concerned about my kids' prospects, not being able to travel/work abroad as easily etc.

02Marriedtoapenguin
Come up North, bask in the glory that was life under the EU. That's why people voted leave

^^I truly hope that this was intended as a joke! Please tell me that it wasn't a serious comment!

@Deadsouls

You’re right. We can only speculate. The reality is, no one knows from either side of the fence what’s going to happen. We’ll just have to hope that outcome is a good one for us

Surely you will just need to apply for a visa to work/study in Europe?

If you want to live somewhere long-term, have residency rights, you might need to earn a certain amount of money, you might need to prove you have special skills, have private health insurance, there might be a points-based system, whatever, it depends on the country. But it will be harder, more expensive, more bureaucratic, and for some people, not possible.

I studied in Russia for a semester. From what I remember, I needed an invitation, a HIV test, a long form I had to fill in, I had to pay a fee and take a trip to London (which I am not near, although I could have done that bit by post). And this was just for three months, so not comparable to permanently relocating to Australia or the USA for example.

Why would you choose that over FOM if you want the opportunity to live/work/study/retire in another country? (Unless of course you're not bothered about that, you just want to keep people out of your own.) It's not like you just to fill in an extra form as people keep saying.

We may need teachers but schools won’t be able to afford them. Schools may be getting extra funding per pupil but unfortunately this extra funding won’t cover teaching staff pay increases so schools are going to be worse off. Yet another lie people voted for.

Why would highly skilled EU Doctors and Dentists leave?

One because she worked for the EMA and her job went to Amsterdam, directly as a result of Brexit - so her husband went with her. Two medical people gone. And as others say, made to believe they were not welcome.

The advert was in Polish. I kid you not. The job was in West London.

Put it into Google translate and apply if it looks like something you could do.

We neither want nor need your forgiveness.

@Chocowoka

I think maybe I am not putting my point across well.

To put it simply, I'm not sure how leaving the EU will solve the problems which you outlined in your original post, given that the 2nd and 3rd largest population of immigrants into Britain are not from EU member states.

Equally you say that all immigrants, if skilled, should be allowed to enter the UK, then again, what does leaving the EU have to do this?

It just doesn't seem to stand up as a robust argument for Brexit. But I understand that different people voted leave for different reasons. So for one person, it might be NHS bed shortages, for another the idea of 'taking back control'. Another to end FOM, another to have the freedom to negotiate trade deals with the rest of the world. Maybe another to control fishing waters, another because or crumbling infrastructure or high unemployment and lack of opportunity.

@NoMorePoliticsPlease really?! First of all why the f are you even on this thread if you mean your name? Looking for goady opportunities? Someone has a thought different to you and in one paragraph you smear them as being Shallow, clueless, a snowflake, thinking the world revolves around them and telling them to find a worthier cause, using laughable hyperbole and more just because they have their own opinion and feel strongly about it? I find your sort of Pier Morgan/ Garage personality traits in people shameful, god help anyone whoever needs to fall on your good grace and favour!

Then there are the expats abroad who voted to leave and may no longer benefit from reciprocal healthcare.

If they can't afford their own private healthcare, in order not to be a drain on their host country's services, much like the 'unskilled' immigrants who come to Britain and use local resources, (doctor, dentist etc), should they be made to return to the UK?

After all, it's a two way thing.

And they were also sick of being governed by the EU on things like human rights etc

Good God. Churchill must be turning in his grave.

@80sMum

Yes, who needs a mere trifle such as the ECHR as conceived of after WW2 by Churchill?
Not Brexit Britain apparently

won unfairly through lies and propaganda

I'd be very interested in hearing an example of any kind of vote in the UK where this didn't happen.

Not "impossible" to forgive, but I would say "hard" , for some leave voters I know. That doesn't mean I hate people who voted to leave, or think they're all thick, or think they shouldn't be allowed to vote, or any of those straw men.

It is possible to understand why someone has done something and still think they've made a crap decision. Leave voters aren't saints with wonderful reasons for voting that way that remainers are willfully refusing to see - they are ordinary people with sometimes really quite crap justifications for their vote. Winning doesn't turn those reasons into good ones, retrospectively.

I do feel angry when I think of those people who voted to leave who have access to EU citizenship for themselves, but who voted to take it away from everyone else. It's hard not to see that as selfish. And also when I think of the leave campaign and the papers with some of their agendas.

I find it hard to understand why people voted to leave and the one person I quite like who voted that way evades the subject. People I dislike who voted leave have dropped me and I don't miss them.

I would like to post a piece on the negotiations for the trade agreement that begin later this year and are due to end in December. I find this piece scary because it shows exactly what the UK team are up against trade deal

My partner is from the EU and we had plans for when we retire that included me living with him 3 weeks out of 4 then coming back to the UK for a week to do my voluntary things and see any grandchildren that had come along by then. If his country goes back to the old visa system, I will have some sort of only being there 90 days out of every 180 arrangement. That's a whole load of plans upset and a life we might have had gone. My DS2 also had plans to work in a European city on a casual basis for a year after his studies finish to broaden his life. Might not be so easy now.

I keep being told we will have a 'rocky few years'. Or it will be 'bumpy' for a while. But no one will tell me what this means or exactly how long the bumpiness will last. Jacob Rees Mogg suggested 50 years until the UK sees any benefits. I'm not sure I'll live to see them, in that case!

I don't think I can forgive them. I met lots of people who voted leave on various campaign stalls and with few exceptions, they were ill-informed, sometimes hilariously, and rude. The people who had voted leave but who wanted to debate were lovely, I have to say, and we had some interesting chats. So maybe I'll cling to those memories of leavers.

Peregina

I speak fluent French. I do not trust Google to translate. Why do people sit the Chartered Institute of Linguists translation exams if it was that easy?

This is England. Not fucking Poland.

We neither want nor need your forgiveness.

This.

We are leaving!

@MissGuernsey we all know that. What does leaving mean though

The bottom line is that the middle classes are bitter that all the privilege and opportunities they benefit from are being curtailed by ‘thick’, ‘racists chavs’ from shithole areas that didn’t reap any benefit of EU membership. If the lovely, morally superior remainers had shared a bit of the wealth and privilege a few decades earlier this might never have happened

DH and i are social housing tenants who voted Remain. so where do we fit in then

I work in coal face NHS. Leafy Hampshire.

Don't any of you Tory voting Leavers dare look imploringly at me when the HCP attending you is so heavily accented that I struggle to understand them, let alone you.

Don't gasp as I exit the room as I don't want to stand in court beside them. Not my circus.

You voted out the EU staff, so now managers with targets to meet have employed these replacements.

Own this.

So basically, because you didn’t get your own way, you are going to ignore more than half the population.
That group of people is a mix of good and bad, just like any other group, and include lovely people, funny witty creative people. People who mend your heating when it fails or look after your sick child or create fantastic art or run the local church food bank.
You are denying yourself all that richness because they dare to hold a different view on one single aspect of life.

Do give your head a wobble!

A good part of the housing crisis has been caused by developers pulling down social housing and replacing it with "affordable" housing

The Elephant and Castle neighbourhood is being physically, socially and ethnically transformed. This started with the demolition of the Heygate estate, a classic for stigmatised perceptions of council housing and the people who live in it. As the local 35% Campaign has meticulously documented, a succession of promises to Heygate residents were broken to arrive at a situation where 1,214 council homes were demolished, to be replaced with 2,704 new homes, of which only 82 (3%) are for social rent. The HA partner was London and Quadrant. To be eligible for the cheapest one-bedroom home built by them on the Heygate site, people needed a minimum household income of £57,500. The average household income in that part of Southwark is £24,324

That is one example I have many more.

mint those wonderful people are those who may well be forced to leave, fixing your heating, looking after your child.

Agreed op. @muruem I will not get over it. It's a national disaster. The referendum was a knife edge result, and was won unfairly through lies and propaganda. Leaving the eu has a huge impact on my personal and family situation too. I am unable to stop being angry.

This sums it up for almost everyone I know. Substitute angry with sad or frustrated for some. Staggered at the lies and manipulation of data used by the Brexiteers and the gullibility of the misguided majority who swallowed it, without doing their own research, and did their bidding.

Miljea
What on earth are you going on about? 'Heavily accented?' The NHS already has many adept African, Philippino, Indian, Pakistani etc health professionals. Are you making reference to them?