11yo DD getting inappropriate messages from 12yo boy

[bonnie1981]

Need a bit of advice and no criticism please as I already feel like a really shit mum and wonder how I could have missed this.

DD is 11yo. We are in Scotland. She's in the first year of high school and is one of the youngest in her year but also one of the tallest and looks much older. This is a worry for me in terms of how she is percieved and her desire to 'keep up' with her older peers.

She says we are far too strict - we don't let her go to the houses of friends we do not know, we do not let her go into the city on the train with her friends unless an adult also there, we don't let her stay out past a certain time, we have a tracker on her phone, there are certain places she's not allowed to go and we've only recently allowed her to walk home from school.

She's doing well at school - getting good reports, getting results between 70-80% in tests, 100% for music. All homework submitted in time.

But I have felt that she's becoming more moody, more argumentative, blaming me for everything, saying she 'hates school' etc. I initially put it down to hormones, typical teenage behaviour etc. When she moaned I was too strict, I worried that maybe I was being overprotective.

It kind of came to a head last week. We had a big argument about her moodiness and snappiness. Also her eating habits - she's hardly eating anything and I was getting rather concerned. She was also mad because she wanted to go into the city (hour each way on the train) with some friend I'd never heard of before and DD has never been on a train herself before and hardly at all as we have cars. I asked DD if there was anything else going on and she lied and said no.

I asked a few times to let me see her phone and her messages because I was suspicious that maybe something else was going on. Maybe she was being bullied. Every time I asked, she would say "Oh my phone's dead" or she would say hang on, take her time which made me think, is she deleting messages. I even tried sneaking into her room whilst she was asleep to get it only to find it nowhere even though she nearly always had it on charge and in sight before.

Anyway tonight we had another argument. I said let me see your phone. Its dead etc etc. I said okay lets charge it right next to my chair. She then started to cry. Turns out she has a boyfriend! He told her not to tell her parents. Messages her saying not to hang out with x friend or y friend, do you want to skip class and even worse, he sends her sexually explicit messages! DD has not responded in a similar manner, other than a few love yous, miss you etc. She tells me she really likes him!

Obv I went ape shit. Telling DD she is 11 yo, she's not to see him or talk to him anymore, his messages are inappropriate, I will call his mum and the school if it continues, she is grounded for a month, only allowed phone whilst at school (in case of emergencies / sick etc), no more walking to or from school, homework to be done at dinner table not in her room etc.

I did get her to text the boy to get his home number before blocking him, meaning I'm able to call his mum if needs be. He did say before being blocked delete my home number so I think he's worried now.

AIBU to threaten to call his mum if he doesn't leave DD alone? Will I get into any trouble for maybe harassing him? My DH wants to call the police, but this boy is 12, is that too extreme?

I'm devastated. I did everything I could to keep DD safe got told I was overprotective, and yet this still happens. I'm worried there might be more going on that I don't know. I worry that I've let DD down. I worry what else may be to come if this is happening at just 11 yo. She comes from a good home. We've always been open and honest with her about safety, relationships, responsible behaviour etc. I never thought we'd be the kind of family that this happened to.

I'm worried that DD may get bullied now by this boy and/or his friends.

Has anyone been in a similar position and what else can I do?

Yes, it could be adoption related attachment issues, my DD1 (10) tries to control people. Either way, it's for the school and the boy's parents to handle it.

The boys behaviour needs to be addressed for sure, but also in a measured and calm way. Calling the police, at this stage, isn’t necessarily the answer at this stage. School will have a policy for this and experience, they will know from the level of explicit messages (which I’m glad you aren’t posting the details of here) what the next steps should be. If police should be involved, it will happen by virtue of their policies and safeguarding processes, not because its knee jerk. As it should be then. He is also young and needs guidance and support, not vitriol.

When I was younger, at this age (and I said 12/13 which is the age of the other kids in Ops child’s year group), we had a phrase called the four Fs, French feel finger fuck. Yes, even then at 12. I was bloody terrified and had boyfriends, feeling immense pressure but doing nothing at all, not even the first one, until I was about 14/15. A few kids did dabble in base 2/3, but no one went near 4 until 15 possibly older. One teenage pregnancy was a sad result, girl did her GCSEs heavily pregnant. There was always talk about ‘what base what base’ but I managed to sideline by a bit of lying and a bit of wriggling out of it. It was terrible, horrific pressure in retrospect, and I remember boys opening talking about what base other girls had gone to with them, and how they needed to go further. These were boys who were my friends, and we had no idea of how wrong this type of pressure is. Catholic school, no sex education to speak of and certainly no education about relationships, though this was 30 years ago and things will hopefully have changed.

I tell you this Op to reassure you that, well before the days of social media, this stuff went on. Hormones are rampaging through their growing bodies. Reacting to those hormones, whether instigating or responding to approaches, isn’t of itself ‘wrong’ unless it oversteps the mark as it has done with you OP, into controlling behaviour and subterfuge. I reiterate again the importance of dialling back any perceived ‘punishment’ and creating exact,y the same effect with support and love. you don’t need to ground her to protect her by reiterating your rules for safety (which I agree with by the way). But in making this situation one where she is punished, you are doing exactly what the courts and media do to the adult victims of harassment - Making it harder to come clean than keep quiet. And that is the exact opposite of what you are hoping to achieve.

I don't think you are too strict or too overprotective. My daughter is the same age. She does have a boyfriend, but they are very innocent in it in comparison to what you have said. Ie they find holding hands exciting and that's about as far as it's gone. They message each other a lot but it's all just about games on Roblox or meeting up at the park.
I'm 100% confident that it's all age appropriate and I'm happy with it.

But this is a difficult one as the boy is probably full of hormones and experimenting etc as to how much he could get away with. I had similar when I was that kind of age, but we never actually did anything (and didn't have picture messages etc in those days but texts had just about been invented, for 15p per message lol).

I really don't know what to suggest. I wouldn't punish your daughter though, you want her to be able to talk to you. The boy being caught out, might well he enough to put a stop to it.

Has she reached puberty yet? My daughter hasn't and is still repulsed by the idea of sex or anything related to it.

'Attitudes like yours are why we have so many teenagers who lack respect, smoke, drink, take drugs and get pregnant! Parents aren't supposed to be "cool friends" FFS!'

Nope I would attribute parents that over react and damage their relationship with there kids to contribute to these issues.

OP said she 'went ape shit obvs'. Why would you react like that? You will push her away and you will have no idea what she is up to because she will be so secretive. This is a tricky time and you have to keep the lines of communication open.

Why have you punished her - what exactly has she done wrong? By all means do what you need to do to manage the issue with the boyfriend but why does that involve punishment for DD - what will that achieve?

Have you spoken to her calmly about the line he's crossed and why you are concerned? It not trying to be cool ensuring your daughter feels heard and respected.

I have 14yo and 12yo boys and would want to know if my sons had done this (tbh I like to know who they are in contact with anyway). So you WNBU to contact the parents (but please without screaming or accusations. Young boys are only children too and they get exposed to all sorts of stuff, if not directly, then through friends and the general culture. They're as out of their depth as the girls, often).

But there's a lot in your OP that rings alarm bells for me wrt your parenting style. You are keeping your dd on a very tight leash, clearly because you are afraid for her, but also because (I think) you think she will (only) be safe if you keep her away from the Horrid Stuff. The restrictions on her physically negotiating the world by herself are particularly concerning IMO. From personal experience, this doesn't work. The child, when older, ends up clueless and defenceless. Also, this was a wrong response: '‘ Obv I went ape shit. Telling DD she is 11 yo, she's not to see him or talk to him anymore, his messages are inappropriate, I will call his mum and the school if it continues, she is grounded for a month, only allowed phone whilst at school (in case of emergencies / sick etc), no more walking to or from school, homework to be done at dinner table not in her room etc.' It read to me almost as if you feel she herself has been somehow sullied. Such a draconian response says 'instead of stepping in where we are needed and helping you manage this so if/when it happens in the future you have self-efficacy', you are saying 'I am angry with you, I am increasing the control and observation around you' (which it counter-productive because it's actually withdrawing from her the sense of self-efficacy and maturity she will need if she is to deal with this sort of thing in the future). This will lead to her telling you nothing when something worse happens, which, sadly, it may.

Again, I have personal experience of this sort of parenting, of the attitudes that underlie it, and bells are ringing for me.

I don't agree with all your rules, but they're your rules for your family and I actually don't think they're the main issue.

Once you give your child a phone, that's when you set rules in stone(only changing as they get older)
You have all passwords. You can check it randomly. If it's 'dead' then you'll charge it to check on it. Kept downstairs at bedtime. She doesn't like it? She can have an old one just for emergencies. Anything inappropriate you will deal with as you see fit.
That's non-negotiable.

You sound like a great mum and I think your rules are totally appropriate. Maybe keep phone with you at night time? I’d definitely call the boy’s parents and not wait.

@CatteStreet

Well put and food for thought

@bonnie1981 I'm another one for saying to tell the school. There may be more going on with regards to the boy, the school will no doubt have a profile, and can provide support for both him and your daughter. They can look out for their interactions and also support your DD if things do turn nasty. If you don't tell them, they won't know to keep an eye out.

As for your reaction, I think you've reacted in shock. Today it's time to calm and talk it through. I have explained to mine in the past (I have two young teens) that I wouldn't be doing my parent job well if I didn't at all times consider their safety and what I felt was their best interests. I love them and want the best for them. We can then agree from there what to do - a joint decision so they buy into it and feel part of it.

Good luck going forward, whatever you decide to do.

but you let your 11-yr-old have access to a mobile without supervision.

This is a good point, I do think 11 is far too young for this.

@bonnie1981 I do feel for you, it's a tough situation, and sometimes we feel we're doing the right thing when we're just pushing them further away.

Thank you Nanny

You need to go to the school. But your reaction, your tracking of her, not all but some of the rules you have. You’re creating an environment for your daughter to lie in. If this is how you've reacted now, what happens when she is 16, and god forbid something else happens? She will not feel able to come to you. Don’t alienate yourself from her - you sound like a great mum so just keep the communication going.

You sound like you’ve got her on complete lockdown so I’m not surprised she’s being secretive. I found it was hard to know whether there was issue with something or whether it’s normal teenage moodiness. Her being stroppy and thinking you’re the worst mother in the world is very normal teenage stuff. It’s a difficult time to navigate as a parent and a careful balance between giving them a bit more freedom and keeping them safe.

If the messages are sexual I would report to the school and also the Police. It’s highly likely he will be messaging other girls too. Take that responsibility for sorting it away from your daughter. I warning from the Police, even in the form of ‘a little chat’ will show the boy that you’re serious. What I definitely wouldn’t do is ask her what she wants to happen as others have suggested. She’s too young to make that decision. She’s not able to safeguard herself at that age.

In relation to your daughter going into town why don’t you start by going on the train with her yourself so she gets use to it. You could then let her go with her friends but maybe also drive into town yourself so you’re nearby as reassurance for her and yourself also.

We had a rule where our daughter wasn’t allowed to take her phone to bed with her. She left it on charge outside her room. This was to ensure she wasn’t messing on it whilst she should be sleeping.

I think too many people on here are being harsh to the OP, give her a break and give her held rather than judging her please. No one knows what they do unless they were in the same position has her.

Op I have a 12 year old dd, and she has a similar life, she is the school year above your dd, but younger in the year. She doesn’t have a mobile yet, we are getting for her one soon, but she hasn’t wanted one until very recently .
I would definitely call the boy’s parents. I would say, from how you have described the messages, that he has probably been watching porn, he is 12, his parents surely want to know about that ?
Unimaginable to me that an eleven year old girl could be getting explicit messages, this is the damage that porn culture does to children.
DH was talking about having a “girlfriend” when he was 13 or 14. He would hold her hand, that was it !

and give her held rather than judging her

Most people are offering help. Most people (who have been there, done that, think she handled this badly and are pointing out to her what she needs to do differently.

How would YOU offer help, @Ilikemyteaweak?

As they go to the same school, I would start there.

I agree with those who have said that the punishment is way too harsh and won't encourage her to open up to you in future.

There is nothing wrong with admitting to her that the punishment was too harsh and explaining why you over reacted (lying to you/need her to be honest/want to ensure she is safe)

What I found with my children over the years, is they really respond when the parent can admit they got it wrong. I regularly apologise to my children for overreacting, or not listening properly.

It builds a two way respect. You MUST respect your child as their own person if you expect them to trust you.

@bonnie1981 - you sound like a nightmare and are going to have much bigger issues if you continue they way you are from the tone of your messages.

For this situation I’d be speaking to the School in the first instance and maybe boys parents. Police is a joke unless he turns out be older than claiming.

I’d also be apologising to DD for being a nut job. DDs just going to get better at hiding shit.

I would definitely speak to the boys parents. YANBU DD is only 1, she's a child.

11!

FWIW, OP, I think you sound like a great mum who knows their daughter well and understands their daughter and her limitations and supports her well with appropriate boundaries and consequences.

She has got into a situation and not handled it well and has lied. She is likely flattered by the attention and then it has become overwhelming and controlling and it has been difficult to admit it is an issue for her, too, since she lied about it at the start.

Hope it gets sorted over a hot choccie

"I was making 4hr train journeys & flights across Europe by myself at 11 (forces boarding school child) - with no mobile phone."

You did, however, have someone responsible for you and looking out for you if you were with the British forces, unless it was a very long time ago. There is no way you were allowed to roam across Europe completely alone, which is what you imply.
(Also a forces child).

Seems like lots of rules but very little communication.

It seems odd to me that you're very protective yet you haven't checked your dd's phone for over a month despite having a feeling something wasn't right.

Although on the face of it your rules seems reasonable if a little strict you come across as very judgemental. An overly strict parent does not prevent teenage pregnancy or unemployment.

Your dd is obviously aware of your outlook and views and feels unable to come to you for advice as you'll "go ape". This is what I'd be focusing on rather than punishment.

Going to the police is over the top considering they're the same age and you've no idea if your dd has also been sending him explicit messages.

You're acting as if this is an older boy in which case of course the police would be the right option.