Private school or property?

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Current debate with dh about what’s best for dc.

Private school is an expensive thing these days so for those who send your dc to a private school, do you think it’s worth the investment? What iyo makes it worth the cost and why?

Dh thinks private school is the only way forward for our dc as he was privately educated, but I’m not 100% convinced due to the cost. We can afford it without it affecting our lifestyle but it wouldn’t leave much to save. We have decent investments so don’t currently need to put money away for a rainy day.

However, AIBU to think that as long as we get a good state school for our dc and are prepared to pay for extra curriculars, tutoring if necessary etc., they would benefit more from getting a property? Currently it would cost 200k for each dc so with fee rises over the years, I think 250k overall is a conservative estimate. That in our area would buy a nice 2 bed flat which imo would set them up for life after uni.

Thanks again for the different experiences, it really does help hearing different angles.

A few people have commented on what my teacher friend said. I summed up an hour long conversation in one sentence and didn’t do her justice at all. She is a big fan of the state system and as a secondary teacher, doesn’t think that private schools offer value for money. What she meant by “damage is done by year 7” was that, a child’s attitude to learning and education, the effort they’ll put in, parental input, their attitudes to making the most of extra curricular opportunities etc. tends to be established by the time they start secondary school. The foundations are important, especially literacy, as their ability at that age will determine how they can access the curriculum and what sets they’ll go into. She said that top set children will fly in a comprehensive, middle set children may get overlooked and left behind so here is where a private school would be more beneficial. She then said that if they’re in the bottom sets, they probably won’t be going to uni or doing a levels anyway so it’s probably not worth the cost of a private school. That was just her take on it as a state school teacher in what she says is a good school. I’m sure there will be people who don’t agree but that was just her view.

For me, my dc happiness is key. I want them to be in a nice, supportive environment. Bullying scares me as do all the mental health issues that so many teenagers seem to be experiencing.

A lot of people say that it all depends on the child, but I feel like it’s impossible to know what dc will be like at school academically until they’re in that environment. However, I feel like we need to make the decision before then. In our area, based on the reputation, I would love it if our dc got into the grammar school but that is way off still.

Fundamentally, I want them to enjoy their schooling and friendships. I am ambitious for them (so good grades and uni are what I’m hoping for) but I want them to find their own path in life and do something they love and that will give them a good life. This parenting lark is so damn hard!!

You sound like a great parent. There is nothing wrong with starting in state and moving to private if it transpires it’s likely to be a better fit for your child. (and if they have spaces). Or, if they seem to be bright and the grammar schools are good, doing it the other way around. For what it’s worth I have a top set child who did not fly in the excellent state school -academically great, mental health wise really struggling. We changed to a private school with excellent pastoral care. I think what I am trying to say is, it’s alright if you don’t have a concrete plan now and that you may need to stay flexible.

i know a lot of people who went to private school, none have been able to buy their own home as none of them have the wages to get the mortgage amount. They are waiting to inherit from their wealthy parents. Round me you need to earn 100k plus to be getting on the property ladder, a private education doesn’t guarantee that level of income, so I wouldn’t gamble it.

As I said having financial freedom as an adult to be able to have a career that doesn’t necessarily pay well but is something you enjoy Or even traveling or taking longer university or training courses, potentially being a sahp (if that’s what they want)

It opens opportunities up that even a private education just can’t guarantee .

We went the "state topped up with tutoring and extra-curricular"route. Both went to grammar school at 11 and we would have switched to private had they not passed.
Firstly if you and DH are professionals it is very likely your DCs can be tutored to pass the grammar school exams. However going down this road requires real commitment (time as well as money) and it is likely that you won't be supported by a state primary to persue this.
My DCs are 16 &13 now, if I was starting again I might just send them private to save all the years of my life I will never get back being a taxi, doing past papers and sitting or standing around watching them do sports. Had I spent those hours at work I might be more professionally sucessful, had less stress and easily paid the fees.

Every school is different, state independent, and it would be useful to go to open events at as many as you can over at least a couple of years to get a good. Idea of what each might have to offer and which you feel would suit your child. I imagine you will be putting each forward for the 11+ for the Grammar schools in your area, as well as entrance exams for independents when the time comes? Then see what places are offered, and go from there?
That's what we would have done if we were in your position, but sadly we had no choice - it would be a small village college with increasingly limited resources & behaviour issues, or academic independent with a broad curriculum and great extra curricular and facilities. We've found the soft skills not examined are greatly valued in our independent school - critical thinking, researching and debating, leadership skills, the pupils feeling valued. Again, not what we found in state system available to us.
Eldest went to state primary and had an ok experience, then on to highly academic independent, and is very happy. Much more so than her counterparts who did not.
Youngest had awful experience in state primary and we had to take her out and she's now in a wonderful prep school where she is thriving after developing deep anxiety. She will go on to independent secondary, without question, unless we move somewhere there is better state provision. For us it wasn't a case of b&w state vs independent, but looking more closely at the individual schools and what they each had to offer.

If you're in a grammar area that changes everything as an academic child in a grammar school may be better off than in a private. If they failed the 11+ however they would likely be in a sink school and would be vastly better off in a private.

If your primary concern is happiness then I would suggest you seek a less good private school or take a serious look at the state sector.

We moved house so our DC could attend good state schools, primary and secondary. We then spent lots of money on many amazing holidays, days out every weekend, and unlimited clubs and experiences for our DC.
My SIL sent her DC to private schools from about age 2 and really skimped on holidays. Our DC ended up with slightly higher A level grades than their cousins and all the DC ended up at similar good universities.

It’s a tricky one, we moved to a nice state school area but the school that was supposed to be small and caring became massively oversubscribed, lots of teachers left over the course of a few years and it was a completely different school.

If you have an excellent small state primary school nearby then I would go down the state primary to public secondary route then good savings can be made for the first 6 years.. Then if your children need the money you've saved towards house deposits you have a win win situation.

On paper I did just fine at a very average state comprehensive. All A*s and As at GCSE, three As at A level, Russell Group university. Have worked in a professional role since I graduated and was able to buy in London (outer suburbs, but still...) without parental help. My husband's story is very similar.

In spite of this we are considering private education for our own children. I don't think it's as simple as "bright children will be fine wherever they go". I want my children to be able to reach their full potential, not just "be fine". And education is about so much more than just exam results.

It was very obvious which of my university contemporaries had been to private school. They had confidence, and an ability to express and justify their opinion in a way the state schoolers mostly didn't. I've observed the same in my career.

OP I think I might live in the same town as you! If so my children go to the bigger prep on the main road. Neither my husband nor myself were privately educated however it was something we can offer our children without it impacting on our quality of life so was a no brained for us at the primary level. We are very happy with our decision. The smaller class sizes, the specialist teachers (eg French, pe, science etc) and the enrichment activities are the key things for us but what we like the most is that it feels like a very nurturing, supportive environment. We are currently debating whether to continue with private education at secondary level and I think we almost certainly will. However if it impacted dramatically on our quality of life we wouldn’t. Tough call! If you are talking about the same schools feel free to pm me.

The idea that bullies are made to leave private school is a complete myth, don’t let that reason be part of your decision.

You’d THINK that private schools would simply remove bullies/kids with nasty behaviour, in a way that state schools cannot. But that is simply not true. The parents of a bully are still paying customers, and be treated as such. I know a few kids at private schools who are bullied badly. One was a victim of serious racial abuse and the bully was expelled for 1 day and that was that.

Just don’t fall for the rose tinted vision of a class full of nice (“naice” even ) kids all super keen to learn, with an amazing teacher....

Private schools are sometimes less stringent about qualifications of teachers they recruit

Also, drugs are an issue in state but equally or worse in private schools (private kids have more access to money, are targeted for that reason)

And sport! Oh, the cricket and rugby and hockey and netball, amazing opportunities to play at a competitive level.... if you get selected, that is. And forget about it if you are dyspraxic, asthmatic Or just plain old bad at sports. (That is based on my personal experience and may not apply to all private schools). You can get carried away with the opportunities your kid may never actually get!

Private school can be a good option, the better option in some cases, but don’t buy into all the hype

I think it really depends on where you live

If we lived closer to the excellent state school ds would have gone there

The options he has for state (apart from one academy that is very difficult for get into and need a talent) is poor

If bullies are doing well academically they will not be made to leave the school. Children who are disrupting classes and have poor results will often be quickly asked to leave - private schools are lucrative businesses

@Lippy1234 if that strategy (moving next to an excellent school) works depends entirely on where you live . for us, houses close enough to excellent schools go for about 80k more than similar houses (so about 1 child’s school fees through primary). With one OFSTED review, that money can be gone (not even a decent education), plus schools can be very volatile in terms of quality. its a very risky strategy

Whether it's better to pay for primary or secondary again depends on the child and the schools.

The state school y7s might soon catch up with private peers, but that's not going to help if they're sitting the 11+ in y6. Not a problem if your dc are exceptionally bright, or you're ok with hours of tutoring out of school.

I'd also say that ime issues were picked up on, and acted upon at the private primary that went under the radar at state, and were only discovered at independent secondary. Bright dc are very good at masking difficulties, and a stretched state school doesn't have the resources to notice/ investigate/support sen in bright, well adjusted dc that are hitting targets.

That said, I don't think dd would be any different if she'd gone to the nice state primary. I think in your shoes I'd opt for state initially, and then review it at 7 when you have more idea about whether grammar is an option, and if so whether he'll benefit from prep school in the run up to 11+

Personally, for us at the moment, we are choosing the property route. Lucky enough to have one we rent out which will eventually be used to set the DC with a deposit at least.

I do believe that a lot of education / drive to learn and believe in the value of education comes from home. And we decided that it was more important that the DC have friends closer to home than have to be driven or bussed to private school. My feeling is that it is more important to be at a school close to home with the ability to pay for extracurricular activities where they can meet a a wide variety of people and experience lots of different things. Plus we could afford tutoring if needs be for GCSE / A levels. But, my opinion is purely based on my children and their ability / personalities.

Re: buying property in catchment, we chose our closest primary although there were others in the town which could have also been "catchment" . At the time, the school my dc go to was "good" but the lowest rated out of our 4 nearest school. Now, a few years on, it has switched and is now one of the highest rated in the county. So moving for the right catchment is absolutely a gamble.

Property

My DH was privately educated and I went to the state grammar. Our children were privately educated and if I had the time again I would move house to the catchment of a good state school. Our children left the house at 7am and returned at 6.30pm and had school on Saturday mornings and matches on the Sunday afternoon. I must have driven thousands of miles collecting after matches, rehearsals.
sleepovers etc

Invest in your kids and send them to private school so that they can grow up and be successful and buy their own property.

i know a lot of people who went to private school, none have been able to buy their own home as none of them have the wages to get the mortgage amount.

Whether or not you're making this up is irrelevant. On average students who have been to private school earn significantly higher than state school students. This is correlation with no proof of causation but you can't possibly claim that after private school you'll be unlikely to be able to buy a home - the majority of ex private school students do own houses by the time they're 30. Since private school costs around £200k (even taking into account a 5% annual increase) if you live in an expensive part of the country that won't equate to a large (or any type of) house anyway.

@RunningAwaywiththeCircus In grammar areas there tends to be that effect. Unless it's a very prestigious boarding school which can attract students nationally and internationally the privates tend to loose a lot of high ability to grammars (academic kids often prefer a grammar in those cases).

On average students who have been to private school earn significantly higher than state school students.

Thats only true in high status jobs. Generally the cost outweighs the potential future earnings.

Again, missing the point. Children aren’t a very good ROI full stop, if you sat down and did the maths you’d actually have to be mental to have one