Private school or property?

[Questionwithanamechange]

Current debate with dh about what’s best for dc.

Private school is an expensive thing these days so for those who send your dc to a private school, do you think it’s worth the investment? What iyo makes it worth the cost and why?

Dh thinks private school is the only way forward for our dc as he was privately educated, but I’m not 100% convinced due to the cost. We can afford it without it affecting our lifestyle but it wouldn’t leave much to save. We have decent investments so don’t currently need to put money away for a rainy day.

However, AIBU to think that as long as we get a good state school for our dc and are prepared to pay for extra curriculars, tutoring if necessary etc., they would benefit more from getting a property? Currently it would cost 200k for each dc so with fee rises over the years, I think 250k overall is a conservative estimate. That in our area would buy a nice 2 bed flat which imo would set them up for life after uni.

I would choose property. It's going to be so hard for them to get on that ladder when they grow up. I would stick to state and top up with tutors if need be.

I think so much depends on the child and then where you live.

We’re lucky choice of awesome state schools. Been happy with both of ours. Good gcse grades and eldest good a-levels off to do what she wants at the uni of her choice. Younger DD in year 13 good predicted grades and chosen what she wants at uni. I don’t think I’d have chosen the local independent one is awesome the other is mediocre at best.

I think the networking and confidence thing very much depends on which school. and lots of Independents are no better than state schools.

I then look at my peers. I went to private school in Ireland and one year state school in England - a really shit school. My DB went to selective private school in England.

My oh state school in UK

Now comparing our lives and our friends yep some people done very well from the private schools. But so have lots of the motivated ones from my year at shit state school done very well. Plenty from the private schools not done well.

Guess what I’m trying to say it’s far more about the child and the families aspect on life than just about paying for schools.

I genuinely don’t think our DDs would have benefited any more from going to a private school then their state schools. But we’ve a really good choice of schools.

@Questionwithanamechange we are also in Essex. We plan to go with a state primary and attempt to get DC into a grammar or go private. As bad as the local secondary schools are (I've been warned by teachers who have taught here) the primary schools are actually decent. Most are rated good but a common theme is that they don't push the top achievers enough, something I plan to combat with external tutoring. If we don't get into grammars or can't afford independent then we will either move or just guide DC through a local secondary with a heavy hand.

A family member of mine is currently at a selective independent secondary schools here, but will go to a grammar for A levels because 'the teaching quality is probably better, I don't rate my teachers'. The current school has a great reputation, and gets good grades but my family member would say it's more down to the student's self motivation than the teaching quality. Of course, the grounds, resources and clubs are excellent, and it's no small thing to get into this school from a state school.

It depends on the kids and the local state and private options, we started out in state and moved them, because they were not doing at all well.

You could at least save yourself a few years of fees by moving them for upper primary or secondary.

As a general rule, the people we know who’ve had expectations of property from parents have under invested in putting effort into their lives, so if we could afford to help them with that I’d certainly be keeping quiet about it and not setting up expectations.

@ALLMYSmellySocks

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The benefit of private school in my experience is to inculcate a respect of learning, a breadth of experience (more opportunity for drama, public speaking, music, outdoor activities, more exposure via parents of other students to a variety of careers), confidence and ambition. That's not to say that couldn't be achieved in a state school depending on which school you choose.”

Don’t agree my kids have had all those opportunities both through there schools and outside of schools. It’s far more about taking opportunities offered to them. Don’t think my DD could be exposed to any more - a 19 she’s living in Africa for a year, spent two weeks are the aero engineer faculty at Delft Uni, spent time with some tech companies in AZ and CA, had a time working with orphans in Romania. Been skiing, played rugby for the county and so much more that I could list.

Had work experience at an Architects and toy company - wants to do product design engineering.

So much of this has been done thanks to our contacts and family friends some gained from private schools - but so much has been also gained from contacts through after school clubs like scouts and guides.

Maybe we’re lucky but just the opportunities through friends we’ve me in the village we live by being involved in stuff - a friends son currently working in 2 Michelin stared restaurant - through state school.

A teacher friend recently said to me that when children come to her in year 7, that she can tell within a week who will get the A’s and who will struggle.
This concerns me enormously. There are a hundred reasons for why a child may appear to be struggling/underperforming/not be interested at year 7. Dyslexia, anxiety, family problems, undiagnosed adhd/hearing/eyesight issues, immaturity, young in year are just some of the reasons. I would be concerned that a teacher who thinks it is all set at year 7 will be teaching to their perceived expectation of a child. Because basically it is bollocks to say you can tell at year 7 how a child will do.

All the teens and young people (GCSE to current first job) are achieving really well in or in the basis of state Ed. Excellent grades, smattering if 1st Class degrees, Oxbridge contenders, a struggler who took a year out and then flew...

If you live near good schools, keep monitoring those schools for continued good work, and keep your cash for property, an unforeseen calamity, targeted assistance or support as and when.

Spend their childhoods enjoying life with them rather than stress about school fees.

Home support and outlook is a key defining factor.

Oh, and there is no evidence that smaller class sizes are more effective per se.

I think it also depends on your area and what your local state are like. If you have super selective grammars and a bright child perhaps private school not worth it.
Dh was keen on ours going to private as he did.
To be honest a lot of state people have nicer cars and holidays than us (but I dont know if they are saving for kids flats too!)

Research shows that parental support is the most important factor determining academic success. So going private probably won't affect a level grades. But there's obviously a lot more to education than grades. Being happy at school is the most important thing.

It's down to the individual child, my sister went to private school and is a bus driver and perfectly happy.

Private education does mean the child will go on to things great

Another family member went to council school and left with 7 advanced higher A grade, which is almost unheard of.

I think parents should fund their kids through university before paying for private school. wtf does this have to do with anything?

@memberofseven

Especially as there is a clear funding process for university and 83% graduates aren’t expert to pay back the full amount and it’s not treated as debt in the same way as a mortgage. But lots of people don’t seem to want to understand the system

My neighbour’s DC went to private school. They’re grown up now (same age as me and DH) and have the same bog standard jobs and houses as we do. So it hasn’t benefited them. Other than having a nicer experience during their school years.

DillBaby - the nicer experience is the whole point

I was privately educated. I’ve got more out of it than what my parents taught paid for it. If I was given a choice between my education and the money my parents paid for it in a lump sum I’d pick the education no question. My education has given me to skills to multiply the money it cost many times over bits it’s also given me broader horizons and emotional strengths. The most valuable thing that got from my education though was not having any excuses. I can’t make any excuses for underperforming so I don’t.

Private school. As a state school kid and one who works in schools, definitely private education from the outset.

Even the best grammar can become an absolute dump in ten years. The number of outstanding schools that are now losing that, right down to the point of being deemed inadequate and closing, following actually being inspected, demonstrates that quite clearly.

In that length of time, it's not unreasonable to think that between the two of you, you will have increased your income and assets significantly and would be able to afford both private education and, upon the children leaving home, being able to purchase additional property once they graduate, have moved around a bit and now want to put down some roots.

@lovelyupnorth

Think you didn't read to the end of my comment - I specifically said the same might be true in a state school- in general it isn't though (and isn't always true in private schools). Private schools do in general have better resources, smaller class sizes, a higher proportion of kids from households where education is valued. Depending on the child there's an advantage to having more experiences within school because kids don't have time to do an enormous amount outside of school (that said some kids have hobbies that don't happen inside any school so won't benefit from whatever the school offers) and especially at secondary level they'll be more influenced by their peer group. There's just an advantage to doing more exercise in school and being exposed to music. The smaller class sizes is an advantage. In my area the teachers in private schools are on average more highly qualified and all are educated beyond degree level (I'm sure there are state schools where this is the case too).

We have a BTL flat with kids in good state schools. No guarantee they would do well at a private school or even if they did, would go into a high earning profession. Both kids are more arty - can’t see them as lawyers or bankers!

Property is more guaranteed. It is 2 bed so they could live there together or we would sell and divide equity for 2 deposits when they needed individual properties.

Property is, we feel, a better return on our investment and kids will have security.

Research shows that parental support is the most important factor determining academic success. So going private probably won't affect a level grades
I was going to say that all the things suggested above that kids get from private school that they don't get in state schools, my kids got to benefit of outside of school. If parents can pay for private school, they can afford to pay for outside of school.

You need to choose a school that is right for your child and where they will be happy, they vary tremendously.

Near where I live there are very good grammar schools and a couple of good private schools (one was a grammar school many years ago which became independent).

If I still had a child of school age I would do research on all of the schools and go to every open day. You're bound to know parents of some children already at the schools who will be able to give you some information.

Good luck.

If you have good primaries and state grammars then I'm not sure what the benefit of private is?

We have a fab local primary where classes are small. Secondaries look quite scary, though.

Of course you can have opportunities out of school but realistically there won't be time for a kid to take up drama opportunities, music opportunities, language studies and sporting opportunities outside of school without it eating into their time relaxing, socialising and doing homework.

While parental support is a huge factor in academic success the school the child attends will also be hugely important. Of course it will impact their A-level grades. For most kids it will also impact their level of ambition.

I don’t think I’ll feel my kids have failed if they choose bus driving after paying for education, if that is their free and informed choice. The point of education is to give you the ability to determine the path that’s right for you.

Mine couldn’t have done all the extra stuff outside of school as they need downtime at weekends and in holidays so it made sense for the school to do more heavy lifting, you can pay for extra lessons but you have to facilitate it as well as finding the money.

We did private prep due to state allocation then onto selective state grammar.

Absolutely delighted we fell into the decision, it has already been worth it for us because of the amazing experience and education DD had.