Male privilege: How can I explain to a man why some women are afraid of men?

[IvyBush123]

A make friend of mine talked about male privilege a few months ago or I was trying to explain it to him - but I don’t think he got what I was trying to say.
He was walking down the street in the evening, it was getting dark and there was nobody else in the street but a unaccompanied women who hurried and gave him fearful looks.
My friend is a harmless person, very nice, would never do anything bad to a woman. He was hurt by the fact she seemed to fear him.

I tried to explain to him that most men aren’t rapist but some are and women like to be on the safe side. Don’t think he got what I was trying to say.

Interesting one, my take is that I’m not sure you can get him to understand - explanation and metaphors will not get through to people who find empathy difficult. Ive come across similar feelings of hurt and even anger in the past though, once for flinching when an ex turned round and moved his arm too quickly, and (again for putting my hands up to protect my face instinctively when my (adult) DS walked towards me when we were having a minor disagreement (exH was violent). Both were bemused and upset at me thinking they would hurt me, I was bemused at their inability to grasp that it was instinctive rather than a conscious fear of them. In fact, I’m still bemused and maybe so are they - after all, I doubt either will ever be in the situation where they ever have to fear physical attack from the slightest cue in the same way I had to, so will therefore struggle to relate.

(I) am now being targeted and abused

Omg this poster has summed up perfectly why men are afraid women will laugh at them, women are afraid men will kill them rings so true.

Is it not the case that men are more likely to be victims of violent crime? They should be more scared than we are.

Men may be more likely to be the victims of violent crime but they are also much more likely to be the perpetrators of it too, so by that logic they should perhaps be more scared of other men, yes.

IME, they should also be a lot more scared of other men laughing at them than women..

should I continue, I have no doubt I will be silenced

Well, we’ll never know now will we? But farewell Saint Hercules - thank you for your brave attempt to try and educate us all - twat!

Op, the more you type the morecyou sound like a massive handmaiden

@Graphista Telling him to dress differently? I think it would be a good idea if he choose to dress differently... but I don’t know how to tell him. I don’t know if I am in a position to tell him - the way he dresses alongside with some physical characteristics he has make him look like a thug.

But you cannot tell a person they are dressing like a thug, can you?
He likes hoodies, starter jackets, cargo pants, has a buzz cut.

I think he would get a different reaction from people if he had a men-bun and was wearing a hipster pullover and a tweed jacket.

But I am not sure how to tell him that people might think he is a thug because he chooses to dress like one... and i cannot explain while hoodies, starter jackets and so on look thuggish to me. They just do.

If he's intelligent enough to notice that a woman on a quiet street might be nervous of his presence, then he's intelligent enough to educate himself about why that might be the case.

And I really love the way that Hercules' son was noted as having protected characteristics, but the daughter was required to not be fearful...

Everyone, including Hercules MRA guy, need to go back to the beginning, find Tyneteas response - it's the 4th one down - click on the link and read the Scredinger's rapist post.

Sorry, I'm not sure how to do copy and paste, but you'll find it.

Any man who can read that thoughtfully and still not get it is probably incapable of empathy or harbouring guilt over his own past behaviour.

Your lovely friend can't help his height and strength and honestly doesn't need to change his dress and haircut. He just needs to stop focussing on his own hurt feelings and start thinking how he can behave around strangers to lessen their fear of him, and how he can use his advantages to help make the world a safer place when he's around.

For instance, if he is walking behind a lone woman, he can cross the road and either speed up to go past or drop back so as never to be the sinister footsteps keeping time with hers six feet behind. When in the company of men he can routinely challenge rape jokes and cat-calling so as to discourage street abuse. He can keep an eye out in social situations for women who appear to be being harassed and check so as to make sure they are safe.

If he scoffs at doing any of those things, I'm afraid he honestly doesn't care how women feel; only how he feels. It's in his hands whether he enhances or loses your friendship.

Will you let us know?

Schroedinger's, not whatever my early morning fingers typed!

Women are never safe, in any place at any time.

My dp doesn’t even always lock the front door.

When I lived alone I kept a hammer by the bed.

My take on it:

Every woman I have had a conversation about sexual assault or men being sexually inappropriate have first hand experience of it. The men I speak to don’t.

But I am not sure how to tell him that people might think he is a thug because he chooses to dress like one... and i cannot explain while hoodies, starter jackets and so on look thuggish to me. They just do.

And yet many many people (women as well as men) find it incredibly easy to tell women not to dress like sluts…

And because of not letting people tell me how to dress i wouldn't say your friend (who must be incredibly dense if he can't work all this out for himself) should do that.

But we are not here to educate men about the problems women have. We have enough to do to solve that ourselves. There is enough information out there already.

I agree with other posters - I wouldn't make this about his size/hair/clothing choices: I would try and explain this from a 'class' perspective.

Imagine 50% of the population was made up of gay rugby players. They are all bigger than you, & stronger than you, and they all have green hair.

Of those, a proportion don't behave well - they hassle other guys in the street; they try and chat them up when they're not interested; they assault them; they comment on how well filled their jeans are as they pass by; they grab bums in crowded bars; they rape.

You've not been raped personally, but you've had low-key day to day annoyances from these guys, and you know people who have been raped or seriously assaulted.

Its late and you're coming back from work on a quiet road. A large man with green hair comes towards you. What would you do?

Coincidentally (or not, Facebook may be stalking me all over the internet) this is the first post I saw when I went onto Facebook. Man doesn't understand why a woman he doesn't know won't give him her address, gets offended, explains he won't rape her, co to yes to explain how she's a slut who would enjoy being raped by him. The comments on the post are full of women describing their similar experiences.

www.thepoke.co.uk/2019/07/12/guy-doesnt-understand-why-women-are-scared-of-men-and-is-perfect-example-why-women-are-scared-of-men/

Ask your friend how he would feel if he was walking down a street alone and a big dog starts walking behind him.

Logically he knows that statistically a dog is unlikely to attack him, and hes never actually been attacked by a dog on the street before, so he doesn't have previous experience to make him fearful of the dog. He might even have a pet dog at home, and he knows loads of nice friendly dogs, but this is a strange dog and he is alone with no one to help him if the dog attacks.

Instinctually, way down in his lizard brain, he will know that the dog is faster and stronger than him and could hurt or kill him if it wanted to. Instinct tells him to fear strange dogs.

He will have a very difficult time overriding this basic fear of something faster, stronger and predatory, no matter how much he tells himself that it's a friendly dog, because for tens of thousands of years his ancestors lived with the certain knowledge that dogs can and will kill them.

Women feel the same towards men. We have tens of thousands of years of instinctual learning to back up our fear. No matter how many nice men we meet, we know that there are bad ones out there.

Meercatsarecats

“Then he should be angry with the men who are giving his class a bad name not the women who are fearful”.

This, in spades.

I had a similar conversation with somebody a few months ago. He had a slightly odd manner about him which he intended as friendly, but some women had found it threatening, and sadly, he had been on the receiving end of threatening behaviour from some fathers/boyfriends as a result. I don't know this fellow very well so we didn't get into a lot of depth, but I tried to explain delicately that whereas he knows he wouldn't be a danger to anyone, other people don't know that, especially those women who may have had bad experiences with strange men. He just could not grasp that just because he knew he wasn't going to harm them, others could not just peep inside his head and know it too... . He said ask anyone who knows him. Well yeah, because that random woman in the street is bound to know someone who knows you well enough to ask them and also to trust the answer

I think a lot of people live mostly inside their own heads.

Annie, another one who needs to read Schrödinger's rapist, I reckon! Though whether he'd get it...

What is it with some men thinking all women are psychic? If we could read minds, no woman would ever be raped or marry an abuser! How does he explain that bad stuff still happened despite our superpower?

Don't bother wasting your time explaining anything to him. He is an entitled arsehole who believes an other human should prioritise his hurt feelings over their risk of a vile, life threatening assault.
He's not a 'lovely friend's he's a fucking abomination.

@NearlyGranny they think 'not all men are like that' so while I have never met a woman who hasn't had 'an experience', these types of men think it's basically one bloke with an all zones travel card going round harassing, catcalling, murdering, raping, groping and sexually harassing women.

My first 'experience' was at 8 years old and it certainly didn't end there, so yes, I am wary of men. Much the same as someone bitten by a dog is wary of dogs. I'm not going to apologise for trying to keep myself safe so I don't hurt the feelings of men, I assume the 'good' ones understand because every man I personally know and who I believe to be 'good' does get it.

Sorry, that should be 'lovely friend'.

for some female, they are exactly the same as expectations and demands for males, but some posters like to be born victims. FFS!

I was wary of men when walking home before and after I was raped in an alley, by a man I knew and trusted!

Tell me again how I like being a victim....

I think the issue is that very few men are rapists. Wven if we say 1 in 10 women have experienced sexual assault, and I have no idea how valid that number, is this is not being carried out by 1 in 10 men. It's being carried out by the small percentage of men who engage in that behaviour.

When men make similar sweeping generalisations about women, people rightly dismiss those concerns. As an example the #metoo movement started, there were was a survey suggesting that men were less likely to interact with female colleagues in general and on a private basis to avoid accusations of unverifiable inappropriate behaviour affecting their career. The whole notion was pilloried even though we know that men have had their lives severely negatively affected by accusations that were unverified, unverifiable and sometimes outright false.

Personally, people should be free to do whatever they feel to feel safe. I wouldn't begrudge anyone for crossing the street to avoid me. It doesn't affect my life at all. That's what is really be curious about in OP's case.

Can you show him this thread and ask him who he thinks makes the better point - StreetwiseHercules or literally everyone else?

I don't know if it'll help him at all, but it will certainly let you know whether it's worth continuing to engage with him on the subject.