Laurence Fox on Question Time

[SuckingDieselFella]

It isn't ok to try and shut anyone up with remarks about their skin colour. It doesn't matter if that skin colour is white, black or green with purple spots.

His fellow actors have been told to "denounce" him. It looks like he can wave goodbye to his career. What lovely tolerant people the ultra woke are.
www.thestage.co.uk/news/2020/laurence-fox-labelled-a-disgrace-to-industry-following-question-time-race-row/

As far as I can tell there are very few cases (if any) of overt racism towards Meghan in the media, so a lot of the evidence for racism comes down to subjective interpretation.

There are certainly enough instances to make it difficult to gloss over.

The Compton references, use of the words ‘Uppity’ and ‘Exotic’, the Baker tweet, the word ‘niggle’ right beside a photo of her. Plus many examples on comment sites that get deleted. The couple have also got racist hate mail direct to their home.

It’s playing a part. It would be disingenuous to say it isn’t. How much of a part is very hard to say.

I am sure you would soon notice if someone was only in their pants

Sagrada yes I do, I wish more people did. Recently Someone told my eyebrows looked very tidy and had I put gel on them.

Comments on a royal thread about wisps of MM hair showing during her wedding. There’s such a thing as being too observant.

Could you say what your boss was wearing yesterday? I couldn’t.

“ I am sure you would soon notice if someone was only in their pants”

Yes. But that’s not in the same league 😂

Also in London, you wouldn’t think much of a person just in pants, you’d groan internally and keep walking.

What have your eyebrows got to do with anything?
Personally I prefer to walk around with my eyes open, if you mean you don't judge people then that's fine, but to claim you dong notice anything, ever is frankly unbelievable.

Don't* not dong! The pants imagery was enough.

Sagrada “ if you mean you don't judge people then that's fine, but to claim you dong notice anything, ever is frankly unbelievable.”

Oh I don’t notice much stuff that everyone else does. Also total face blindness, forget names, take a range of medications.

But do I judge people? HELL YES. Mostly by what they do.

So you are just oblivious to things in general, then. That's not specifically what we're talking about here.

The laugh is that white people on these threads (and in RL) are telling black people that their experience is "wrong" if they aren't on board with the victimised mindset.

Actually it's no laugh - it's at best condescending and at worse very harmful, if you are constantly telling people they have been subjected to prejudice.

If your dc had a disability, would you be banging on the whole time, "You are in a wheelchair. People will be staring at you. All people see is a wheelchair. I think that person offended you - you must be offended, otherwise you're letting the disabled side down." Can you imagine?

I am not advocating for one second that people should always turn the other cheek and that racism does not exist. Of course it does. But the "racist hunting" by some self-appointed arbiters of what constitutes racism - and I contend by people who probably have never even met a BAME person - is distasteful.

What about white Jews? They experience huge amounts of racism and prejudice in this country (much of it institutionalised!). No "white privilege" for them!

Do white Jews have a more difficult time than black or Asian Jews. Does a white Jew ever have the problems they face due to anti semitism made worse by the colour of their skin? If the answer to that is NO, then white Jews absolutely benefit from white privilege.

As I said before on this thread. White privilege is just not having your life being made more difficult because of the colour of your skin. That's all it is. A white Jew with terminal cancer and no money living on the streets still benefits from white privilege. A black Jew with the same problems would have the added issue of being black.

@LaurieMarlow Seeing racism where it doesn't exist is more fuel for the far right. Nobody apart from the woke police on twitter thought the word "uppity" was racist. It's used to describe anyone who tries to escape the confines of their gender and class.

Megan Markle has had an easy ride compared with any other woman who has married into the royal family. Until recently Kate Middleton had to put up with abuse on a daily basis. First she was Waity Katie then she was Duchess Dolittle when she was taking time off to look after her young children. Every aspect of her appearance is criticised in minute detail. Any other woman would have had a nervous breakdown long ago. Her entire family have been torn to shreds - her sister, her mum, her brother, even her uncle Gary and his Casa de Bang Bang. The underlying tone is that Kate comes from common roots and isn't good enough to be royal.

The difference between Megan and other wives is that they ignored it. They didn't sue the press over negative coverage or ask friends to speak on their behalf. And they certainly didn't stand in the middle of South Africa, a country where many people can't feed their kids properly or pay for medicine, and say that nobody has asked whether she's all right.

I literally can't believe she did that. A victim? No way.

Irma

“ Actually it's no laugh - it's at best condescending and at worse very harmful, if you are constantly telling people they have been subjected to prejudice.”

Yes, that’s how I feel.

@Lifecraft " A white Jew with terminal cancer and no money living on the streets still benefits from white privilege. A black Jew with the same problems would have the added issue of being black."

Are you stark raving bonkers?

The reaction is the same one that you get on feminist issues like sexual assault and domestic abuse. There are always posters who throw in the fact that men can go through the same experiences. No one is disputing that but it doesn't change the fact that you won't see any men carrying rape alarms.

It's an attempt to minimise the disadvantages that women face every day. I suspect that's what it makes POC feel when someone jumps in and says that white people face prejudice too. Of course they do, and not just Jews, as Irish people have faced discrimination, too. But they're not made to feel that way because of their skin colour.

Nobody apart from the woke police on twitter thought the word "uppity" was racist.

Well that’s bollocks and a quick google will tell you why.

@Lifecraft " *A white Jew with terminal cancer and no money living on the streets still benefits from white privilege. A black Jew with the same problems would have the added issue of being black."

@SuckingDieselFella
No, I'm just explaining to you what white privilege actually means. If you don't want to hear, or understand it, that's fine. Remain uneducated. It's no skin off my nose.

@Lifecraft " *A white Jew with terminal cancer and no money living on the streets still benefits from white privilege. A black Jew with the same problems would have the added issue of being black."

@SuckingDieselFella Are you stark raving bonkers?

No, I'm just explaining to you what white privilege actually means. If you don't want to hear, or understand it, that's fine. Remain uneducated. It's no skin off my nose.

Irma no, I can't imagine that. I can't imagine saying to a black woman 'you're black. Everyone's looking at you because you're black. All they see is colour, they're obsessed with colour, you're a victim'. That is extremely distasteful! No wonder you find it to be so.
My whole point is that I don't deny white privilege, and I bloody well wouldn't try to deny white male privilege, and that only people of colour can be in a position to speak for their own experiences, as I wouldn't know, because of my white privilege. I still won't tolerate racism. No one should.

@Lizzie0869
"I suspect that's what it makes POC feel"

Have you actually asked any "POC"? Do you even know any "POC" well?

Or have you decided on their behalf how they should think and feel?

I have relatives by marriage who are from a Caribbean background and I would never dream of speaking on their behalf. It's an offensive thing to do. And its a very clear example of exercising white privilege.

Megan Markle has had an easy ride compared with any other woman who has married into the royal family

And that’s also utter bollocks.

However I agree that every woman who married into the royal family has had a tough time to varying degrees. That doesn’t mean it’s ok or shouldn’t be challenged.

I don’t think anyone should have to put up with the media publishing lies to make them look bad. Here’s some context for you.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.elle.com/uk/life-and-culture/culture/amp29840214/meghan-markle-court-documents/

"I would LOVE some real examples of racism by posters here.
In real life I do not know of anyone who has suffered from outright racism"

I've an English dad, (Christian) Arab mum

At school, I was the first ever non-white child there
The other kids used to surround me and yell "wog"

One of the teachers was a racist who would smack me if I didn't smile at her - "being sullen" - and smack me if I did - "being cheeky"
She once completely invented a story to get me sent to the head for caning - fortunately he saw through it, but said it was a misunderstanding.

Of course any of them could have had suffered from being poor or having a very sick relative
But they didn't have everyone surrounding them at school to yell "wog"

I received only v occasional racist abuse once I became an mc professional - and that would be in the street from strangers.
I am in a field of science that has a shortage of people, so I was in demand and valued.

I received imo the same amount of sexism, also groping etc as a white woman

There is certainly class and sex privilege in the UK, which can easily top white privilege

It is really ignorant not to be able to see that many women have suffered from male violence or sexism and that many whites also suffer poverty
But just as ignorant not to see that many BAME people suffer racism

I posted this yesterday, but no one seems to have read it, so I'll say it again. Because most people on this thread seem to have no idea what white privilege actually is.

It isn't saying white people cannot have crap lives. It isn't saying some white people aren't discriminated against, maybe because they are disabled, or gay. It isn't saying all white people are racist. It isn't saying all white people have an easy life, or white people don't have struggles. It isn't saying white people cannot be oppressed, as they might be if they are poor.

It's just saying, whatever issues a white person might face, their life isn't made any harder by the colour of their skin.

That is all it is. Nothing more than that.

There are certainly enough instances to make it difficult to gloss over.

The Compton references, use of the words ‘Uppity’ and ‘Exotic’, the Baker tweet, the word ‘niggle’ right beside a photo of her.

Well, I may be flamed for saying this, but it's a pretty small number of instances, isn't it? Obviously none of it should have happened (although in some cases there is debate around what intent there was), but it hardly seems like the alleged torrent of racist media coverage. It seems more like people were expecting the coverage to be racist and have jumped on the relatively small number of examples where that happened (or appeared to happen).

Dozens and dozens of entire threads just on here, have been pulled because they were full of racism directed at Meghan. Why deny it?