AIBU pregnancy with an unsuitable man ALL over this site

[SiriusBlack94]

It amazes me that EVERY day there are multiple posts with...

My DH is so lazy —— I’m 30 weeks pregnant
My DH is a narcissist how can I leave him —- I have a baby on the way
I don’t love my DH anymore - but I’m 28 weeks pregnant
DH drinking all the time/doing drugs/ controlling/ doesn’t help around the house —- but I’m pregnant.

Like seriously. Why are women so casual about getting pregnant with men that aren’t suited to them or who they aren’t in a loving relationship with. I know in some cases a man can turn abusive during pregnancy but in the majority of cases it’s things like ‘my DH drinks 4 times a week’ or ‘my DH never helps around the house’ which you would’ve KNOWN but still got pregnant.

I just don’t understand it and they are then tying themselves with often multiple children to these men.

"50% pregnancies are unplanned"

Eeeeek, going to be the bearer of a controversial newsflash here... but there are other options than going through a pregnancy with an arsehole partner. I won't directly say the word that is on the tip of my tongue. But sometimes it is preferable than bringing a baby in to the world with a loser who won't support either of them.

er point is, that women go ahead and have babies with men when it is obvious!

I am challenging the assertion of the new/NCd OP.

What is "obvious" and who gets to decide? Women adapt their lives heavily when having children, men will say they expect to do the same and then don't.

20/20 hindsight doesn't constitute "hindsight".

20/20 hindsight doesn't constitute "hindsight".

Sorry - that should be *20/20 hindsight doesn't constitute "obvious".

I genuinely think some women are gluttons for punishment and some are vulnerable.

I don’t get women that have babies to men that have other kids to more than one women yet don’t see them through their own choice.

Why do they think their child will be any better cared for?

I know a woman who had 4 kids to a drug dealer, she split with them then got with another drug dealer who has 5 kids to 4 women and sees none of them and then she had a baby to him just before he got sent back to prison for the third time! Wtf is wrong with her? Why choose to have a baby to that type of ‘man’?! Stupid doesn’t even begin to cover it!

YANBU, but this thread won’t go your way.

It’s the threads where the OP is obviously on this trajectory that amaze me. They talk about a boyfriend who is lazy, spends time gaming/hobbying, abuses drugs or alcohol, doesn’t pay them enough attention and so on. But instead of leaving him, she decides another talk and another chance. Progressive stages are, we have moved in together, we are about to get married and then planning to conceive. All the same story. She gets advice on how to change him into what he should be. How it’s his problem and he needs to change.

But for me the only piece of advice is that you cant change him. You know what he is like, you have all the information. The decision is now yours and you must decide to accept this is the person you are going to live with and have children with. But with the proviso you will become more trapped and more stuck.

Have you actually read the OP?

I have.

@C8H10N4O2

And you still missed the point? Strong work.

I think a large part of the problem is there is still a stigma around abortion.
Women can't face a termination because of emotions attached to a foetus that overrides the practicality of their situation.
It doesn't help when hoards of people on this site reply to a post with cries of 'have it anyway and single parenthood be damned!' Its ok to reply to someone on here with 'it's ok not to keep it if you can't afford it and it's detrimental to your relationship or existing children'.

YANBU OP

But it's like the great Mumsnet taboo, where you get shouted down as a rule for suggesting women should stop having children with KNOWN shit fathers.

I'm in my 60's , and when I was a teen the Pill wasn't even invented yet. Contraception really needed a lot of sensible decision- making and planning in those days. Yet my friends and I managed ( in the main) to avoid pregnancy.

Now there are a multitude of methods of contraception , both permanent and temporary. You can even take a pill after the event, or have a safe abortion. Yet unplanned pregnancies seem to be very common, if MN is anything to go by.

Alot of men change when their partners are pregnant. Something to do with being overly needy selfish beings with little regard for anything except their own dicks.

If you have 4 though and your a struggling single mother then wtf wouldn’t you get contraception or make the man, who has numerous kids that he doesn’t give a fuck about, wear a condom?!

As much as some women are abused etc then let’s be honest and say lots of women are plain fucking naive and/or stupid with the opposite sex, I think there’s more women that put up with crap from men than there is men that put up with crap from us women.

@FudgeBrownie2019

Sorry, that wasn't clear. I see what you meant now.

I'm in my 60's , and when I was a teen the Pill wasn't even invented yet. Contraception really needed a lot of sensible decision- making and planning in those days. Yet my friends and I managed ( in the main) to avoid pregnancy.

Part of your point is valid. But I'm in my late 60s and went on the Pill when I was 18. Had to go to the Brook St Clinic though, not available through the GP.

Of course people hide their true selves, or perhaps it's more the case that in certain situations they become the worst versions of themselves?
Just as the tiger stalks its prey the human predator lulls the victim into a false sense of security otherwise they would never get close enough to the victim to feast on the flesh.
As for the lack of decent men ....power corrupts and men tend to be the ones with the power

Oh, and we managed to avoid pregnancy because in the main we were terrified of the stigma of being an unmarried mother.

Alot of men change when their partners are pregnant.

As discussed at length above. She’s not talking about them. Why do people bother to post without even reading and comprehending the OP never mind anything else?

YABU

I can see how it happens. When I was in my 20's I was put under a lot of pressure by a lot of people (my boyfriend, my mom, my sisters, my friends even my work colleagues) to have babies.

I ignored everybody (including my boyfriend who desperately wanted a baby) in order to achieve my goal of university + career..

I pursued my career and by the time I was ready to have babies, I wasn't physically able to pregnant.

If things had been different, I know for a fact I would have had two maybe three kids with a narcissistic and abusive partner (my boyfriend turned into an abusive arsehole).

And you still missed the point? Strong work

Or you could actually read my post.

I think threads and posts like that are so sad

I might be naive but I genuinely don’t believe that the majority of women who have children with abusive or useless men do so deliberately or knowingly. Of course there are some but that in itself might well be because of abusive or experienced in their lives that have led to low self worth or poor decision making: it is a complex issue.

The vulnerability during pregnancy continues into motherhood as they are bonded permanently to the abuser whether they stay or leave.

It’s very easy to feel exasperated until or if you stand in those shoes. Things I have had to endure for becoming a mother to an abusive man’s children are life limiting and life wrecking. I love my children dearly but had I known what I was bringing them into or indeed had I kept any control of my life I would not do it again. Principally for them.

I was an educated independent woman and I thought I was smart enough to make the right choices for myself. Abuse distorts and blurs things and it is a systematic form of torture peppered with enough to make you hope against hope sadly.

If people are so invested in the dynamics of this context of decision making then instead of bemoaning the fact it happens why don’t they invest some of the superiority and perception into overhauling the society and justice system that enables and minimises this......
Then it things got better it would be perhaps more justifiable to tar and feather these stupid women like me

I do not think it's feminist or empowering women to blame women for staying with feckless or abusive men.

Imo the feminist empowering response is to show empathy to the situation that led them there and encourage them to leave.

A woman is not less worthy of sympathy or support because it took her 10 years and three kids to realise she's being abused. Threads like this imply she is.

The guy I know who I’ve mentioned with the unwanted kids, unwanted on his behalf, lives in the same area as all his kids and all his girlfriends live in the same area too so they have brothers and sisters that they don’t know and they may well walk past them in the street!

His new girlfriend lives in area too and it’s common knowledge what he is all about, he doesn’t have a house either and lives with his mum (he is 39) so he constantly has a girlfriend because he needs a place where he can take drugs without his mum going nuts!

The only half decent thing about him is when he moves in with girlfriends then he gives them decent housekeeping cash...but from the sale of heroin

I can see how it happens. When I was in my 20's I was put under a lot of pressure by a lot of people (my boyfriend, my mom, my sisters, my friends even my work colleagues) to have babies

Well quite. There are lots of factors to consider. The pressures on women to be in relationships and have children, the way women are judged and raised in patriarchal society, the factors which result in so many men being appalling partners and fathers.

But no, lets blame women for it all and assume large numbers of women are electing to have children with useless men knowing they will be abused or badly treated. Much better than expecting anything of men.

Well firstly women ymusually expect men to change and help when their is a child brought into the situation that they were half responsible for making. Some do, most don't.
Also it is extremely difficult to find a man who does their fair share of things around the house, or childcare. An awful lot of men still seem to have this inbuilt belief that women should be the main care givers and housekeepers.

I've not RTFT but I don't think the OP is being unreasonable.
I think there are people who change - we all know that pregnancy is a trigger for abuse to start in some relationships where previously things seemed fine. I would argue that in MOST of those cases the man was selfish and self-centred even before that but not necessarily in a "red flag" way. (And some selfish people turn into good parents so it's not always one that's easy to spot).
But I also think that there are very many women who get into relationships and start families where the issues are very clear from the start. I work in healthcare and see large numbers of young women on relationships with men who drink, gamble, do drugs, can't keep jobs, treat them like s**t... And yet these young women stay with their men and often have children with them. It's like they think they don't deserve more; I often ask them why and they look at me as though I'm an alien. "But he says he loves me" is a common theme.
I feel often as though feminism might as well not have happened when I met some of these young women, many of whom are also being "forced" to do things they don't want to do like anal sex. When I see them I say "you know that if you don't want to do this you can say no, right?" and it's all "but he wants to and we're in a relationship and he wouldn't be happy". I try and explain consent and respect and it doesn't appear to have much effect.
My own children are older teenagers in a very "middle class" selective school and they and their friends are passionate feminists and I look at the people I see at work and wonder what went wrong in society that there's such a discrepancy.
(I'm not saying that abuse is a class issue. It really isn't and I've seen plenty.
But low expectations and acceptance of rubbish from the beginning of a relationship does often seem to be).