Challenge 25 ID policy.

[Wayland1]

Hello,

What do you think of the policy that requires shops to ask for ID from anybody who looks like they are under the age of 25 when they buy age-restricted products?

It's stupid because all people have to do to get around it is to just put the money on the counter and walk out with the item they are buying. But the notices are still nonetheless very unpleasant to have to look at.

What do you think?

@BlaueLaguene I clearly know this. I work for the biggest energy drink company in the world.

My point stands, I'd rather be inconvienced than a 14yr old get an energy drink.

Also, the challenge 25 is used across the board because it's easy.

But yes, the employee needed training.

If you actually work in customer services, you should know that the key principle is that "customer is always right", even if they're not. And if for some reason you cannot serve them, you apologise. There is no excuse to be rude and make arsey comments.

I never apologised for having to ID. I just said that is the policy I am unable to serve you and then if they looked very young they would have to be removed from the venue.
It's not my fault. It's not my problem. It's the law.

If you actually work in customer services, you should know that the key principle is that "customer is always right", even if they're not. And if for some reason you cannot serve them, you apologise. There is no excuse to be rude and make arsey comments.

I don't apologise, apologies suggest you've done something wrong and I'm not. I don't ID on a whim, I'm sensible about it, and more so I know I can defend the decision I make to licencing/the police if I need to. Nor am I rude. I'll say something along the lines of "Unfortunately with no ID I can't serve you alcohol, would you like anything else?"
If I'm then met with abuse and rudeness I will then say that unless they stop shouting/threatening/swearing at me etc I won't serve them at all and they will be asked to leave. It is not 'just part of the job' and I'm not being treated like that by a customer because they try and bully me into potentially breaking the law.
For the more persistent ones who are pleasant and try persuasion, I just repeat "Unfortunately with no ID I can't serve you alcohol, would you like anything else?" Usually several different ways. You're right, there is no need to be rude about it, and that cuts both ways but the reaction of some people is so over the top it's ridiculous. We're selling a legally restricted substance that's a leisure thing, not oxygen.

People who have had too much already need more careful handling - drunk people don't make the best decisions and have lowered inhibition so are more likely to say/do something they normally wouldn't.
A quiet "I'm not really happy to serve you any more alcohol at the moment, but would you like anything else?" Is better than "You're drunk I'm not serving you" obviously. But most people will argue the toss - loudly - and then accuse me of embarrassing them. I've done all sorts so people don't 'lose face' for being refused (and for people who don't want their friends to know they're not drinking) like an alcohol free lager in a branded glass, or making a coke look like it's the mixer in a vodka in a tall glass, serving a lemonade or tonic in a goblet with all the trimmings of a gin.
But at least half the time I'm met with hassle, in all honesty I don't really care if you want to drink yourself silly - but the law holds me responsible if you do and as I'm the one carrying the potential concequences then I make the decision.

I wish people used common sense with this policy. Asking for ID from someone who could be 25 at the oldest and is probably younger - fine. Asking for ID from someone who could be 25 at the youngest - absurd. I'm 33. I accept that it's hard to judge age and that someone might think I look a bit younger than I am. There's absolutely no chance that I'm actually an old-looking 17-year-old who can't legally buy alcohol.

I actually have a photo ID card which I carry with me. Once, I was asked for ID buying alcohol, and this card was refused because 'it's not a passport or driving license.' So in effect this cashier thought that there was a possibility that I was a 17-year-old with a fake photo ID claiming I was 32. That I found ridiculous and insulting.

I also don't understand the refusal of sale to adults who have children with them. It's perfectly legal to purchase alcohol and give a bit to your 17-year-old (or, indeed, your 5-year-old!) at home. I also think that there's a real moral panic around alcohol, and young people more generally, which just didn't exist 20 years ago. I had the occasional can of cider at 13, and plenty of energy drinks. I bought my own paracetamol and cough medicine when I needed it. It was fine. I also used to do the weekly shopping for my disabled grandmother, including buying her cigarettes - in that case, the shop owner knew both me and her, and that it was a regular occurrence.

I actually have a photo ID card which I carry with me. Once, I was asked for ID buying alcohol, and this card was refused because 'it's not a passport or driving license.'

There's a strict list of acceptable IDs for Challenge 25, not all photo IDs are on that list. So the cashier was just following guidelines. Not ridiculous or insulting.Just their job.

There's a strict list of acceptable IDs for Challenge 25, not all photo IDs are on that list. So the cashier was just following guidelines. Not ridiculous or insulting.Just their job.

My ID card has been accepted at every other shop where I've been asked, and by other cashiers in the shop where it was refused, before and since. Even if they thought it wasn't on the list surely a bit of common sense and discretion ought to be used. It proves that I'm not under 18, or even under 25, so the Challenge 25 policy was wrongly applied in my case (although, as I said, I understand that age can be hard to judge). Refusing a sale to someone who is clearly and provably well over legal age because of 'following guidelines' is a bit ridiculous, sorry.

Miriel take your ID everywhere with you. Simple. Because if there is a smidgin of doubt in my head I ID. I don't care how the customer feels. They can be insulted. And then they can either be insulted and show me their ID or they can be insulted as they're shown out the the venue.

I give zero shits. I don't work on the bars anymore but am I hell risking my wage for someone to have a drink.

stilldoesntknowwhatshappening If you'd read my second paragraph, you'd see that I do!

Unfortunately rules need to be followed. I expect the cashier hates not being able to use their common sense but if it’s not on the list of that particular shop’s acceptable IDs then there’s nothing they can do.

Miriel then what's the problem? People are doing their jobs.

Unfortunately rules need to be followed. I expect the cashier hates not being able to use their common sense but if it’s not on the list of that particular shop’s acceptable IDs then there’s nothing they can do.

Are there any official rules that you must ID every single customer? Or you can't sell to an adult if another adult doesn't have and ID? Or that you can't sell things to adults who bring kids to shops? Also snide comments about somebody's looks are totally uncalled for.

The rule is if you have any suspicion that the individual appears under 25 you ID.
If that person can show Valid IF you must refuse service and note it.
It then doesn't matter if you think they look over 18 once you've asked and they can't produce it's a solid no.
It also applies if you think the adult may supply a minor with alcohol.

I guess it depends on what shop it is @FishCanFly.
I don’t know if any shops that ID every single customer that would be really strange.

There are idiots in retail.just as any other walk of life. Those who don't understand the rules of challenge 25 or who are just stupid or goady.

You decide if a person looks over 25 or not.
If they do then you don't I.d. them.
If you don't think.they are over 25 you ask for I.d.
If the I.d. is one of the methods your shop approves you put in the d.o.b into the till and it will accept the sale if it's ok.
If it's not the till will not allow the sale.
If they have no i.d. then the sale still. wont to through as you have started the challenge in the till.

It's not the cashiers fault if you cannot buy alcohol under the correct procedure.

Not selling it because you have a child or the other adult doesn't also have I.d. and they are obviously over 18 is just beingn petty or misunderstanding the rules. You can complain and the cashier should have retraining. Their reasons have to be sensible, and reasonable and as per the rules. Unfortunately once challenged and failed the manager cannot authorise the sale there and then.
There are some people who take it too far I have no idea why and it makes a mockery of the rules we have to adhere to. There is obviously no need for aggression or stupid remarks when challenging. Thankfully i have never had a bad response from a customer yet.

If I didn't sell alcohol to everyone who had to take thier kids shopping I would decline about 70% of sales!
The amount of money purely on drink that went through the tills in the run up to Xmas and NY at my place was staggering! Many parents do shopping in evenings or straight after school pick up with kids in tow. I wouldn't be popular with the manager if I declined them all!

OP WHAT IS WRONG WITH THE POSTERS??
I’ve read the whole thread to find out why they’re so unpleasant but it’s all nonsense!

You decide if a person looks over 25 or not.

Which is a subjective judgement, surely ? So one person might think "they look 26 years old" and another might think "They look 24 years old".

That's before you add the hilarity of people wearing niqabs

Well common sense means the vast majority of people do look thier age. I am not going to I.d. someone who is obviously a pensioner! I used to look younger than I was but not young enough these days to get I.d'd😁 if you look 30, 40+ obviously I wont I.d. you it's just stupid and a waste of my time going through all the palavar. We are not all petty jobsworths on power trips as people love to think about retail staff.

Some people however are 'young looking' and we have to I.d. them. I am not being caught out by a 'plant' and risk my job.

We didn't make the law but we have to abide by it.

I also don't understand the refusal of sale to adults who have children with them. It's perfectly legal to purchase alcohol and give a bit to your 17-year-old (or, indeed, your 5-year-old!) at home

Yes. And it's also like the case of the girl of 19 who was refused the sale of painkillers, she was with her dad who was going to buy them instead and the sales assistant refused "because he was going to give them to her" So how on earth do you buy Calpol for a child?

A couple of years ago I was in a German supermarket and a girl was buying cigarettes. She didn't have ID, but her friend did, so the sales assistant sold them to her instead. I'm not sure why this is deemed an issue in the UK - I actually thought cigarette sale laws were an EU thing but when I was there just a couple of days ago they had open cigarette displays right by the tills!

I'm not aware that legislation sets out what ID is acceptable to buy age-restricted items.

But as I said above, I have a bigger issue with the stupidity of my local Waitrose, who employs under 18s on the cigarette/lottery counter. Yes they can sell lottery tickets but they can't sell cigarettes. I once bought a bottle of wine and took it to them thinking they must be 18 or over. and they weren't. When I said to the supervisor it made no sense to have under 18s serving on a counter for age restricted items, she just didn't get it. But there again, Waitrose seem to think you go shopping as a social activity and therefore are happy to hang around 10 minutes for a supervisor, whereas I just want to get in and out with my purchases.

I'm not aware that legislation sets out what ID is acceptable to buy age-restricted items

although I see Sainsburys has its own list on its website. No idea how they decide what to accept and what not to accept.

It may not be legislation but our company only accept passport, driving license of pass hologram photo ID.
Nothing else.

Ours takes passport, driving licence with photo and hologram and several other photo/holo IDs like Young Scott Cards.

A couple of years ago I was in a German supermarket and a girl was buying cigarettes. She didn't have ID, but her friend did, so the sales assistant sold them to her instead. I'm not sure why this is deemed an issue in the UK

Because there is a specific offence of procuring items for people under age in the UK. So a shop assistant serving someone who then gives the items to children can be prosecuted if the could "reasonably" have foreseen it.

I actually thought cigarette sale laws were an EU thing but when I was there just a couple of days ago they had open cigarette displays right by the tills!

Despite a load of old tosh, very few UK laws were imposed by the EU. We managed to make them up all by ourselves.

This is what's acceptable

Challenge 25 is a retailing strategy that encourages anyone who is over 18 but looks under 25 to carry acceptable ID (a card bearing the PASS hologram, a photographic driving license or a passport) if they wish to buy alcohol.