To think my child should be guaranteed a place in beavers?

[TheQueenInTheNorth]

I'm a cub leader at our local scout group and have children already spread out amongst the sections. My youngest is finally old enough to join her sibling in beavers which has been talked about by other leaders and assumed she would be starting as soon as she was of age, she has even taken part with beavers with me as I've had childcare issues. Other times I've had her with me in cubs and as she has special needs, she's been a handful with being bored in an older age group, which has made it more difficult for me in my role as a leader. I have now been told that there in no space for her in the beaver group and I can't help thinking that she should have already been on a waiting list and should have a slight advantage with her siblings being part of the group and her mother being a leader

What drs said.
Otherwise I'd walk if she couldn't get a place.

I think if you are giving your time as a leader to cubs, your daughter should be entitled to a place in whatever part of the organisation she is at the age to attend. I would tell them that it’s a deal breaker for you and that they need to look for someone else to run cubs.

I would either move to Beavers to support my child, then move up to Cubs when she does. Or they lose you. Lucky them if they can afford a volunteer who gives up weekends for the activities and prepares weekly meetings.

I know having a SEN child can be tricky. My youngest is and we've worked with our group for my child to go to Beavers, Scubs and is now in Scouts. Not without the odd drama...

And every child of the volunteers at our group jumps up the waiting list. None of us other parents have a issue with it. Benefits of hundred of hours a year volunteering.

I’m a Cub leader. Our leaders‘ children (all sections) are guaranteed a place, but they do need to be on the waiting list, so that the section leader can manage numbers/ratios, and be aware of who is due to start.

I'm just a parent helper and unofficial leader (I haven't time to do all the training and I'm a qualified teacher, fully DBS checked etc). I go to Cubs every week, I plan and lead activities, go to the planning meetings etc. My youngest is due to join Beavers next year. If I was told that he suddenly didn't have a place, despite all the conversations I've had, I would not be giving up my time every week to ensure that the Cubs still ran. As far as I know, he's on the waiting list, but "the list" seems to be a fairly informal thing. There's no official form etc.

To all those saying that you shouldn't get priority; I think you've lost sight of that fact that scouting is run by volunteers. It takes far more time than the couple of hours a week that each meeting is to make each section run smoothly and scouting as whole is extremely short on those volunteers. Parents are often quick to complain, but nowhere near as quick to help out and find solutions.

They do have a space for her, they’re choosing to put another child in HER space.

That tells you everything you need to know, surely?!

I’d move yourself & all of your kids to another group - well, actually I wouldn’t because I think they’re all pretty crap, but I think if you want to stay a part of that organisation you should.

Or have a very frank conversation with the person saying there isn’t space!!

@june2007
A few things. Your a cub leader not a beaver leader right? So that does not mean you would automatically get in or be prioritised.

Yes, in the overwhelming majority of Scout Groups, the Policy would be that the dc of ANY Leader gets priority to jump the waiting list. It is down to the individual group, but not to have that policy would be very short sighted.

2) It isn,t clear if you put her name down on a list. Have you asked when there will be space if not right now and how many infront of her on a list? My initial reply, to the inital question was to ask if her name was on the list, but, as the thread has evolved, it is clear that OP has been in regular conversation with the other Leaders about her dd starting, and, if they recently started a list and didn't have her name on it, then the Beaver Leaders / GSL / whoever is running the list, needs to have raised that with the OP at that point.

if you have the option of taking her to another section why don't you.?

Because the dd is 6, and to take her to cubs wouldn't make sense. Scouts policy is to start from the premise dc attend the section their peers attend, and there needs to be permission sought to vary this. Occasionally that might mean putting a child in a younger section, but it makes no sense to put them in an older section.

Back for good I din,t think it was clear, yes there has been conversations but it doesn,t sound like she actually officially put her name down. I never heard the thing about making sure attend same section as peers, surely if one has space and one unit doesn,t that won,t apply as it means child would miss out? But should be in right section agreed.

Sounds like the old we are not going to say it's the child special needs that are the issue so we are going to make up some batshit crap about waiting lists. I am not saying this is fed what it is but it is so common that suddenly normal conventions are suddenly changed but someone the parent of the child with SN is the only person who seems unaware and therefore unable to remedy the situation in time.
It is a form of gaslighting many parents of special needs children get.
having never previously realised as a leader you needed to do this and probably didn't with your older children, I do strongly suspect this is the issue. If you mention that you where not told of the change there will be awkward looks and oh yes we changed the rules a while back you must have been away. Fast forward a few months when they admit a child who is the child of a brand new leader and they have forgotten what was said to you.

Special needs parenting is social death by a thousand cuts and it is cruel and unnecessary.

A/ You can either accept it and ask for her to be put on the waiting list, cue lots of other excuses why she can't join just yet. Some will be said as though it's in her best interest not to join.
B/ Kick up an almighty fuss (we all have to become that parent at points) but to be honest I don't think this is the right time for this. if you do A and/or C, and they fail then do B, as sometimes having been treated so awfully so often we can sometimes be triggered too early and it's not good for anyone.
C/ ask for a meeting with whoever is in Charge and also flag to the scouting association or whatever they are called quoting the Equality Act disability provision and their own policies (if they have them) on special needs and leaders children being admitted as priority.
D/ only do this is really needed leave as a leader citing that you cannot continue to do this role when your own child is excluded as you can't continue to find childcare whilst you carry out this voluntary role.

I don't think @june2007 understands the words "section" as applied to Scouting, nor "peers".
Section = cubs vs Beavers etc.
Peers = children of the same age.

Op I would walk if I was in your position. It sounds like they are making excuses not to take your child because of her needs. I don't think they will find it too easy to replace you rather than giving your child a spot. Very bad form if you ask me. Maybe they don't believe that you will walk. Of course they are not going to admit the real reason but from what you say it does appear to be the case.

I still haven't had a reply from the gsl, I am considering moving my girls to rainbows and brownies instead as I don't think I would feel comfortable in the group moving forward and I'm taking the silence as a sign that they aren't too bothered whether I stay or not. I did think about changing to another beaver and cub group but as the boys are at an age where they will soon be leaving I may as well give guides a go instead

Or just tell your boys to say they are girls and you can all join Guiding?

This sounds like a miscommunication OP. I’d wait until you’ve had a chat to the GSL about things. It could just be mismanagement of the waiting list or a misunderstanding and they’ve offered the places out without remembering your DD was meant to start.

If you only messaged the leader last night you may not get a reply until monday or they may want to talk face to face. My kids have significant sen and I went with them to beavers and acted as a 1:2 capacity with them as wouldnt expect the leaders to deal with spitting and meltdowns

And it amounted to discrimination.

Actually no one can say that. It didn't get to court as they settled. A court may well have found there were no reasonable adjustments that could be made to accommodate this young person and therefore excluding him was legitimate.

They may well have been nasty lazy leaders who couldn't be arsed to put processes in place of course.

I agree that she should be fast-tracked, perhaps they are just ticking boxes? - Who told you she could join in January?
Pop her on the waiting list now and then email everyone you can think of to ask if she can get a priority place.

I hope that by now the GSL has replied along the lines of "thanks for letting me know about this, I'll look into it ASAP".

Nope no reply still

That's aw to have not acknowledged your message and your issue, they should be treating you much better.
When are you or your children due back?

that's awful

That’s such a shame. As someone who hasn’t been able to get my kids I to beavers due to waiting lists I still think leaders children’s should skip the queue.

Oh dear. ☹️

I'd give it until tomorrow. Many people are just getting back into a routine. GSL probably needs to get in touch with Beaver leader, in an attempt to sort something out before getting back to you. Maybe it's no news is good news.

It sounds like you did not put her on the list. I think she absolutely has priority but they are not mind readers. I would have a chat and ask if she can have the next available place - if not then I would be pretty annoyed to the point of not wanting to volunteer. Leaders are absolutely gems who put up with so much and do so much - it has to be a perk your child gets priority.