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AIBU?

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Original poster

To ask if you think there will be a second coming?

891 replies

LuluBellaBlue · 03/01/2020 18:29

This is inspired by the new Netflix show Messiah, about a second coming.

I really hope this doesn’t upset or offend anyone and people can share their beliefs and thoughts openly and without prejudice or judgement as I know this can be very sensitive for some people.

Following on from —binge— watching this series I did a bit of googling and it seems both Christian and Muslim regions predict this. (Not researched if any others do yet)

I’m not very well informed about different regions but the concept of this programme has really interested me, I find it fascinating that this could, maybe? actually happen!

Do you think there could be a second coming?!

(And what would it actually mean for the world? A rise in consciousness? Mass healing???)

YABU - no don't be so daft!
YANBU - yes, this could happen, why not?!

OP posts:
VeeJayBee · 07/01/2020 23:13

Oops hit post before ready...
as well as this our whole calendar is based on Jesus life and death. Read an gospel (Matthew, Mark, Luke or John) and the rest of the New Testament - its hard to argue with and people died trying to convince others of the truth that Jesus was the Son of God. The bible says that Jesus will come again, like a thief inthe night, so be ready. And my ve ready it means that we should turn away from our idols, repent and believe. “For God so loved the world, He gave his only Son, that whoever believes in Him, will not die but have eternal life.” John 3:16. So yes, huge consequences for us!!!

I’ve not seen the Netflix Messiah btw xxxx

SirChing · 07/01/2020 23:14

@ZenNudist Thank you, that's kind. It would be fab to find out which beliefs differ from the Baptist stuff. It's all a bit too fundamentalist for me TBH!

I think it's great that you had your prayers answered. Sounds like the Baptist minister was a not wrong re interceding then in that case!

@Somanysocks and @cabbageking I totally agree with you both.

@ByeMF So do most Christians so you are in good company.

@HeresMe

Well, you aren't a Christian and you haven't been on the receiving end of some absolutely rude beyond belief comments and name calling here. If a Muslim or Jewish person complained about the belligerent responses, I suspect that may make people examine their own behaviour and apologise for offence caused.

As is accepted in instances of religious abuse, sexism, homophobia or racism, It is for the person on the receiving end of the behaviour to say whether they feel bullied or not, no-one else, not even you. I am surprised that you are unaware of that and think that your opinion holds any weight whatsoever.

LOL at all religions having a common "game". Wherever do you dream that shit up?

CardinalSin · 07/01/2020 23:32

"There is a lot of factual evidence that Jesus lived and died and rose again."

Do tell...

HoneysuckleSpeck · 07/01/2020 23:37

There is a lot of factual evidence that Jesus lived and died and rose again

Nonsense.

LastTrainEast · 07/01/2020 23:50

@VeeJayBee I was led to believe as a child that they had records of his birth, the trial and execution. Imagine my surprise when it turned out those adults had deceived me and there was nothing until much later and that was hearsay.

I suspect there was a preacher of some kind that it was based on as that's how things work, but there's no evidence to support it.

FramingDevice · 07/01/2020 23:51

There’s more factual evidence for Jesus’s resurrection than what ‘universally accepted theories we all believe in’? Gravity? The earth moving around the sun?

I think you’re rather confused by the calendar — that’s an effect of Christianity, not some personal act of God!

LastTrainEast · 07/01/2020 23:57

There have been a couple of suggestions that we wouldn't question Jews or Muslims. Well on other fora I do just that. And do you know what they say? They say "you wouldn't say that to a Christian" :)

It's a good thing there are no gods as I am on the naughty list of 5 that I know of.

LastTrainEast · 08/01/2020 00:01

btw I hereby release Slipperwig into the public domain to be used for any purpose whatsoever.

SirChing · 08/01/2020 00:50

It's a good thing there are no gods as I am on the naughty list of 5 that I know of Grin As long as you aren't on Santa's, then that's all that matters!

Thing is, you haven't been rude or belligerent. You have disagreed but been lovely with it. So I can't imagine anyone feeling properly mocked by you. That's the bit that I don't think people do to other religions - openly mock.

Slipperwig sounds like a type of beetle! Fabulous word.

CardinalSin · 08/01/2020 00:58

"There is a lot of factual evidence that Jesus lived and died and rose again."

It was a statement like this that awoke my interest in the subject. For years people, teachers (who should know better), priests (who may or may not know better), and just general Christians (who obviously don't know better), just repeat this kind of phrase unquestioningly. When I decided I would like to see this "proof" that I had so frequently been told was indisputable, imagine my surprise that, wow!, it literally doesn't exist! It is all lies.

But it's become such a "truism" that even atheists on this thread state that they think he probably existed, because they have been told that there is "incontrovertible proof" all the way through their lives, by so many "respectable" people. That's why I always feel the need to point out that, no, there is literally not a single scrap of evidence that he existed (apart from the bible, which isn't exactly an unbiased historical source).

cabbageking · 08/01/2020 00:59

Jesus is written about by Jewish and Roman historians.
Tacitus records his death under Pontius Pilates rule. As does the governor of Turkey. Josephus tells of the unlawful execution of James and identifies him as the brother of Jesus who is called the Messiah.

We can be reasonably certain Jesus lived. What we can't prove is that he was the Son of God.

CardinalSin · 08/01/2020 01:03

Tacitus. Born 56 CE.

Nope, not a contemporary.

Josephus. Born earlier - 37 CE (still not contemporary), but the TF is a patent forgery (traced easily to Bishop Eusebius), and the other reference is to Jesus, son of Damneus. Still desperately claimed as "proof" by Christians who have nothing contemporary to go on, so grab at the slightest hope of a mention, however dubious.

HeresMe · 08/01/2020 01:08

LOL at all religions having a common "game". Wherever do you dream that shit up?

They do have a common game Jews Christians and Muslims have a common god.

Religions have spent a while at top of the pile, they need to learn a bit of humility.

I keep saying there is no point in God as he doesn't do anything, but that's all sort of the plan apparently so what's point(non of next life stuff) worst plan ever just excuse after excuse why he is so useless, free will is just a excuse., You notice I keep saying excuse a lot as that is all religion has to offer excuses.

Loopyloopy · 08/01/2020 01:18

As an atheist, people's belief in the second coming terrifies me. It absolves us of our responsibility to look after ourselves and our planet.

Walkingdeadfangirl · 08/01/2020 01:29

That's why I always feel the need to point out that, no, there is literally not a single scrap of evidence that he existed

You are right but whether or not someone, in the entirety of history, was ever called Jesus is almost irrelevant and not worth wasting time arguing. Which is why atheists dont bother denying it.

The more important and easier to determine fact is whether or not a supernatural demi-god called Jesus existed. Which is probably the much more important detail and much more possible to determine.

SirChing · 08/01/2020 01:32

@HeresMe If you say so

@Loopyloopy Aside from Scott Morrison and some fundamentalists in the US, I don't know of any Christians who think that. We have to look after our world as we don't know when the end will be, and it's our and our children's home. People Like those I have mentioned, who do feel absolved of responsibility or even welcome things like climate change to try to bring on the end times, are blatantly abusing the planet and going against what the Bible says. It's a totally unChristian approach.

cabbageking · 08/01/2020 01:36

Contemporary would be the writers of the Gospels and Pauls letters which you don't accept. Matthew being completed 41c.

The Aramaic inscription on one side of the ossuary. Scholars acknowledged its reading: “James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus?
It was rare to name a brother as usually just the father was needed. used by the Jews 00 to 70ce.

speakout · 08/01/2020 06:50

Loopyloopy

I know of this too.

My sister sees the earth's problems as part of god's end game, so doesn't think we should fight it. ( She is in Australia).
My mother's church - in the UK- ( completely different flavour of christianity) encourages this line of thought too.

SirChing how can you say it is "unchristian"? these events are fortold in the bible. Man has been given dominion over the earth, and god told men to "subdue" the earth.

Skyejuly · 08/01/2020 06:55

So 'God' would let disbelievers suffer? That does not sound like something I would support.

SirChing · 08/01/2020 07:30

how can you say it is "unchristian"?

Easily. It is unChristian because the End Times happens when God decided, and we have a duty to look after the Earth in the interim.

We May be in End Times right now, we may not. The earth might seem like the Magic Kingdom now in comparison to how bad it may get in the future. We don't know. As only God knows and hasn't let us know, surely we have a responsibility to act with as much love and compassion for the planet as we can in the interim?

Trying to hurry the process along is actually acting like God in a way, because it's trying to bring something about that only he has control over. And that is a big no no.

SirChing · 08/01/2020 07:33

Subduing/taming the Earth so that we can make the Earth a good place for all of us to live is very different from willing on its destruction!

hairyxmasturkey · 08/01/2020 08:15

No definitely not. I literally cannot get my head around how anyone could believe this stuff.

speakball · 08/01/2020 08:23

My sister sees the earth's problems as part of god's end game, so doesn't think we should fight it

You read any Sam Harris? He covers this issue in one of his books.

Somanysocks · 08/01/2020 08:38

As an atheist, people's belief in the second coming terrifies me. It absolves us of our responsibility to look after ourselves and our planet.

No it doesn't

Madhairday · 08/01/2020 08:45

there is literally not a single scrap of evidence that he existed (apart from the bible, which isn't exactly an unbiased historical source)

You do keep repeating this, Cardinal, as if the repetition of it makes it so. But I'm afraid the fact is that the vast majority of NT scholars - of faith and not - agree that the evidence shows Jesus existed and was killed under Pilate. It is plain enough. You discount Tacitus and Josephus, yet 'contemporary' reports - especially about unknowns, not kings or rulers, would be very rare in the ancient world. The fact that we have near contemporary reports is something far more substantial than 'something Christians desperately cling to' - we are looking at historical documents. We are looking at a Roman historian who was known to be anal about sources. We are looking at a Jewish historian who referred to Jesus twice (the James reference is of the brother of Jesus called Christ, and this is fairly much undisputed except among some fringe scholars, and you simply cannot discount the TF because of the interpolation when Josephan scholars have proven that the core of the text is Josephan and are able to show very clearly the lines of the interpolation - what remains still talks of Jesus life, ministry and death.)

I know well the claims of Jesus-mythers and know well the majority opinion, and any google will show anyone here what that is - and I'm afraid it's simply not the position you assert, however much you repeat it. The fact is that we have good robust historical evidence for the life, ministry and death of Jesus.

You cannot discount the gospels and epistles due to bias. Most ancient historical records show bias of one sort or another, whether to empires or kings or to matters of faith. It does not make them historically unviable, it makes them useful as historical documents that hold a bias and therefore must be examined in terms of that bias. And when we do that we find all sorts of authentic historical details that cannot be explained by made-up stories weaved decades or centuries later, especially not in terms of writing in antiquity.