To think teachers are quite well paid?

[Newyearnewnameforme]

Not intended goadily but my salary is more than most of my graduate friends.

Obviously, it isn’t Rockefeller standards but AIBU to think it’s actually OK?

*see 10

I teach in a private school and we are paid slightly more and work many, many more hours than I ever did in state school. Kids are a complete delight though and managment have your back.

It’s not a myth. Clearly it must depend on the private school (or perhaps it’s different in London).

The people I know who work in private schools earn a LOT more than they would do in the state sector. I have a friend teaching in a well known trust who’s in her fourth year of teaching and she’s on £40,000 with no additional responsibility. A few more years and she could easily be on £50k.

@ClairesKimono but you also get at least 6 weeks additional holiday a year, usually around 20-21 weeks in total (I have kids at private school).

I paid childcare in school holidays! Most nurseries charge monthly and won't let you just take time off your payments....

My DH definitely doesn't work longer hours than me kimono . His school does finish later than mine in the day but he does virtually no marking, there is no data tracking other than inputting the odd test result and his only meeting is timetabled rather than after school. It's not utopia though as he doesn't think the behaviour is that great.

And there is recently an influx of slightly overbearing managers at his place . I find his school 5 - 6 years behind in terms of 'developments' such as this.

Someone being HOD after two years is ridiculous and a really good example of what is going wrong with schools.

So much this. Where I teach there is a level of very experienced, 40+ staff who are HoDs (the odd one younger) who have earned their stripes, can teach well and manage a team. It was very refreshing after the state system of promoting the cheapest (let's face it, that is the reason that inexperienced teachers gain promotions) not the best for that post. Someone who has been teaching for two years knows very little about teaching really, let alone being a HoD.

That is interesting to see the timescales.

The daughter of a friend started as an NQT September before last (so she is now part way through her second year teaching).

She is just outside London (so I'm not sure if she gets any uplift for being close to London) and her starting salary as an NQT was £30k (it may have been 29 and something but came to basically £30k) with 16% pension contributions.

It is not representative of the whole country, but it is a really good starting salary for a newly qualified person.

@ClairesKimono but you also get at least 6 weeks additional holiday a year, usually around 20-21 weeks in total (I have kids at private school).

Yes this is true but term time is completely manic - as you must know! I am out of the house at 7am and never get in before 7pm on a normal day. Throw a parents' evening in there and it can be 10pm before I get home. My subject also means that I have extensive after school involvement too.
It is a great school and lovely job though so am not complaining necessarily - just pointing it out.

His school does finish later than mine in the day but he does virtually no marking, there is no data tracking other than inputting the odd test result

Yes - it is heavenly compared to 'weighing the pig' constantly in state schools - for no palpable improvement in results. Let teachers teach!

Or join Aldi and start on £44K with a BMW!

state system of promoting the cheapest (let's face it, that is the reason that inexperienced teachers gain promotions) not the best for that post.

I don’t think that’s why inexperienced teachers gain promotions. I think it’s because there aren’t enough experienced teachers to apply for them. They hire a 2 year teacher because it’s them or no one.

That’s one of the consequences of the mass exodus of teachers. We have one of the youngest and least paid workforces in the developed world.

www.independent.co.uk/news/education/education-news/oecd-study-uk-teachers-britain-youngest-pay-salaries-countries-a9099216.html

At the bottom of the article it says that NQT salaries will be increased to £30k by 2022, so not that long to wait folks....

@ClairesKimonk I know - but for balance it’s very relevant.

Leaving home at 7am and returning before 7pm is absolutely normal for anyone who has to do a drop off or two and commute to a city for work (and mostly works on their commute), maybe I’m institutionalised to it but I wouldn’t consider that excessive at all. And that’s usually with just 5 weeks holiday a year, not 20.

@Piggywaspushed - for 7 years between ages 4 and 12 (and for many people beyond that too) you will not be having to pay the childcare costs or use annual leave that someone in teaching has to cover the school holidays. Plus in the nursery years it means you get some blissful child free time to yours self for 13 weeks a year... I’d pay for that

It's a myth that private schools pay more.

Little do you know about it! Crikey!

Look at any of the good private schools and when they advertise jobs they say 'Our own payscale' .

They pay what they want and it's usually above state schools.

BUT the teachers work a lot harder on the whole.

My teaching career was 50-50 private and state.
In the private school I supervised prep 2 nights a week ( till 8pm) and we taught on Saturday mornings too. I also did a once a month weekend duty on Sat or Sunday ( it was also a boarding school.)

March I said that I never return before 7pm. I suppose a 12 hour day is more normal these days but it is not ideal if you want any sort of work/life balance. And I am very often much later.
I am also guessng that people who 'commute to the city' may be earning far in excess of what a teacher earns?
My Head told me that teaching at my school was 'a way of life' not a job. He wasn't wrong!

I am sure I read some time back that in the vast majority of cases, a teacher's income is a 2nd salary (with a spouse earning more.)

Also, the majority of teachers are women who go back into teaching part time when they have children.

There are exceptions of course, no one denies that.

For the hours that are worked, and the long holidays, it's not terrible pay. If a teacher earns around £40K It's on a par with pharmacists, physios, nurses, who have progressed beyond the most basic pay scale but the teachers get long holidays.

I think what strikes me is there is a huge variation in the hours that teachers put in.

Some do a huge amount of marking and prep (I used to with my subject and the syllabus changed every year too so masses of prep in holidays)

Others leave school almost the moment the day's over and do little at home in the evening.

One thing that drove me out of teaching was the staff room moral- or lack of it. So many staff hated their jobs but didn't know what else to do.

I think if we are to stop teachers leaving the profession so soon they need a lot more 'fly on the wall' experiences before signing up for training. The problem seems to be the reality of teaching compared to their expectations of the job!

@MarchBorn
10. Teachers are not exceptional in working beyond their contracted hours and in weekends / holidays, it happens everywhere, especially at this pay scale.

My dh earns well over 50k and doesn’t work beyond his contracted hours (in fact he only “works” 6 months of the year!) He doesn’t even get phone calls when he is off!! And that is a UK based company with UK pay.

I’ve done teachers pay for years (in the North). Apart from the NQT most of the teaching staff were on much higher scales. Lots of the teachers had TLRs. It would be unusual for a teacher who had taught for a couple of years to be on less than £40k.
Teach a subject like science and you can move up fast because they are desperate to keep you. Not unusual to become second within 2-3 years (and often they do very little work for it).

There were quite a number of young teachers now who make their way to SLT VERY quickly. There are Deputy Heads who are 30 earning £70k.

As for the long hours, it’s not always true. There are teachers in at 6.30am everyday and there are ones running in 10 minutes before the bell.
It very much depends on what subject you are teaching and who else is in your department.

This is for a trust though so things can be slightly different.

moral- LOL- (maybe that too) MORALE

My dh earns well over 50k and doesn’t work beyond his contracted hours (in fact he only “works” 6 months of the year!)

so what is he doing for the other 6 months? Is he air traffic control or something?

I actually remember someone saying that on my PGCE Jingling - “its a useful second income.” For my part, I married a poor man so it needed to be the main income for us.

As for the long hours, it’s not always true. There are teachers in at 6.30am everyday and there are ones running in 10 minutes before the bell.
It very much depends on what subject you are teaching and who else is in your department.

Oh yawn. You are one of those. You do know that those running in 10 mins before the bell will have done their work at home as the work doesn’t just magically happen for some - like me, they may have to drop off their children to breakfast club which opens at 7:30 and have no choice but to rush in shortly before the first bell (my school starts at 8:05, for example) but I will have been working till 10 or 11 the night before when they are in bed.
Look, I’m not moaning about doing that and I am grateful I have a job I can do around my family but it hugely pisses me off when people like you assume only those that are physically in school on site, are the ones working hard

And regarding your anecdotes, you will be working in a school that probably has such a high turnover of staff due to being a stressful place to work, hence the regular openings of roles on a yearly basis and the fact only ‘young’ staff are willing to take them on...

I said and meant “a city” not “the city” because we are not talking about people on much higher salaries.

Also, the majority of teachers are women who go back into teaching part time when they have children.

The proportion of part time workers in teaching is lower than nationally which is odd given that teaching is majority female.

Treating part timers like shit (or not allowing it) is a big issue in the retention crisis. The group most likely to quit teaching is women in their 30s.

No, it isn't well paid. I have looked into teaching as a career change, as I often feel that I missed my true vacation. Sadly, as the main breadwinner for our family, I just can't afford to do it.

Ihatesundays so you work in the payroll dept but are an expert on who does what teaching wise where you work?