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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU or is this child abuse?

142 replies

StressedDuck · 30/12/2019 17:23

Basically a lot has gone on between me and my ex with our 2 yr old son. I’m pretty sure my ex and his gf emotionally abuse my son but I’m not sure how serious it is and if everything I think is abuse actually is counted as abuse.
I’ll start off with his gf. Shes been around from the beginning and the whole time she been throwing things around our son, like her phone or charger, and shouting and causing arguments with my ex about the tiniest things in front of my son. She’s also calling herself mummy to my son and controls when I can see him. She also verbally abuses me and puts me down in front of my son.
Now I will get to my ex. He’s had custody of my son since he was 6 months. I voluntarily gave him custody because I was struggling and I thought it was what was best at the time. Ever since then he has told me multiple lies to get things the way he wants and attempts to manipulate me. He also verbally abuses me and my partner and has threatened to hit my partner before. He makes rules he wants me to stick to and if I dont, I dont get to see my son. I asked him if I could take my son to my stepdads for boxing day or my family gathering on new years (different parts of the family) so he can see his family and get xmas presents but he declined, saying they dont make any effort the rest of the year, but they wont want to talk to my ex and they never know when i have him so its difficult for them to see him. A few days before xmas I asked him to give me an hour with my son at my house (which breaks one of his rules) so he could open his xmas presents from me. He said no but I had had enough of playing by his rules so I just took my son, which I know wasn’t the best decision but an hour for my son to open his presents isnt unreasonable. He is now saying he wants to remove my parental responsibility because I ‘tried to kidnap him’ (which I cant do when hes my child) and has thrown a lot of verbal abuse at me, which is making me worry for my safety as well as my sons. During this he also asked me for my address because he said the health visitor is updating her records,which I’m pretty sure is a lie since I’m not the resident parent. So he just wants my address (I just moved a few months ago) which is scaring me and my partner a bit.
I know I didn’t go into too much detail, but can all this be counted as emotional abuse? And is it bad enough to contact a child support line to ask their advice?

OP posts:
FrivolousPancake · 30/12/2019 18:21

I agree with @Greysparkles

There’s clearly more to this?

puds11 · 30/12/2019 18:24

@HanginWithMyGnomies pretty sure you can kidnap your own child especially if you don’t have custody of the child.

Crispyturtle · 30/12/2019 18:25

You took your child without his knowledge to your home address, which you won’t let him have. Sorry OP this is completely out of order and if I were the resident parent in this I would be taking steps to reduce your contact to supervised only in a contact centre.

PixieDustt · 30/12/2019 18:29

I don't agree with her calling herself mummy, no.
But there is more to this surely?
You can kidnap your own child.

FrivolousPancake · 30/12/2019 18:32

I don't agree with her calling herself mummy, no.

Generally I would agree (enthusiastically) but for all we know this woman could have actually been doing all the “mummy” work from 6months. It’s all very unclear but I’d be very interested in hearing the other side.

Original poster
StressedDuck · 30/12/2019 18:33

Can everyone stop focusing on me taking my son please. I said I was a bad idea and I know that but I was desperate and I was going to take him back after an hour. I’m not giving him my address because he’s verbally abusive to me and has threatened my bf. My bf has been attacked in the past so he’s worried my ex might abuse him. I’m not giving my address to someone who could hurt me or my bf. I’m just trying to figure out what i can do to protect myself and my child.

OP posts:
FrivolousPancake · 30/12/2019 18:37

I’m not giving my address to someone who could hurt me or my bf.

But you’re happy for someone capable of violence have full custody of your child?

Eiffel85 · 30/12/2019 18:39

So you’re not giving him the address because if your boyfriend’s fears? What if that means he says you can’t see your child any more? I wouldn’t be inclined to hand over my son to someone if I didn’t know their address.

GiveHerHellFromUs · 30/12/2019 18:39

I'm sorry but you have to give him your address if you want your child to spend time there, or even if you want unsupervised contact.

Presumably you have his address.

You need to go to court and get a proper court order but you also need to be respectful of the fact that for 18 months your child's dad has been RP, along with his girlfriend.

How often do you have contact with your son, and do you pay maintenance?

Also, how do you know about the arguments/throwing things?

Christmadtree · 30/12/2019 18:44

It doesn't sound ideal but also doesn't sound like abuse. Your behaviour has not been great by your own admission, so can understand your ex wanting address details and to set boundaries as it doesn't sound like he trusts you with your dc.

Original poster
StressedDuck · 30/12/2019 18:46

I dont want him to have custody any more. When I gave him custody i didnt know what his gf was like, and I thought he would think of whats best for our son. He wasnt that violent when i was with him so how am meant to know he would threaten my bf? I’m going to talk to a solicitor and go to court for full custody but i still dont need to give him my address if im concerned for my safety.

OP posts:
GiveHerHellFromUs · 30/12/2019 18:50

You're not going to get full custody. You have your child up and he's not in danger (unless you can prove they've abused him - in which case you should have already contacted SS to get him removed).

notapizzaeater · 30/12/2019 18:52

Have you asked about joint custody ? I doubt he will give you full custody (nor a judge at this point)

FrivolousPancake · 30/12/2019 18:52

Ffs forget about your boyfriend for a minute.

Do you feel satisfied that whatever issues caused you to give your ex full custody are resolved? Have you been seeing your DS on a regular basis and paying maintenance for him?

hidinginthenightgarden · 30/12/2019 18:52

Definitley time to get a formal custody arrangement. I think you should request 50/50 even if you don't want that much as it could be whittled down due to your ex currently having full custody. Best to go in high to start and get what you want/can cope with.

darthbreakz · 30/12/2019 18:56

He wasn't that violent? Was he just a bit violent then?

He does sound awful and abusive and controlling - why won't he let you take your child to your house? What's that about?

I agree that you need to get yourself legal support. Abusive people tend to abuse or manipulate everyone, so without any more info, I'd be concerned about your child too.

Any idea what your child wants to happen?

Noideasorry · 30/12/2019 18:59

If you are both on the birth certificate then you both have parental responsibility unless ordered otherwise by a court.

If you take your son while with him to your house, you legally can. If your ex called the police, they would not attend unless there was an immediate threat to your son. If your ex said there was and you were a threat and the police then did a welfare check, if when on that check they had no safeguarding concerns they would not force the other parent to return the child. They would advise dad to contact a solicitor. They will not just rip a kid out of a parents arms who has shared responsibility without there being a threat to that child present. They would direct both parents to engage a solicitor and take it up in court.

I don't think people realise but when both parents have parental responsibility and an agreement amongst themselves, either parent at any time can decide not to return the children, and as long as no immediate safeguarding concerns the police would direct the parents to solicitors / the courts to resolve the situation.

You do not have to give your address, it's nothing to do with the other parent. Just as technically your ex does not need to give you his address. Neither parent gets to dictate what the other parent gets to do with the children while the children are in a particular parents care.

PolloDePrimavera · 30/12/2019 19:00

How do you know how the girlfriend has behaved?
You need go be transparent with your ex, you need to be reasonable and responsible. Was threatening your bf not a police matter? What had happened to prompt that?

Noideasorry · 30/12/2019 19:01

Did you ever give custody via a court? Or was it between you both?

If between you both, nothing is stopping you from having your child as much or as little as you want despite what he says.

Original poster
StressedDuck · 30/12/2019 19:02

He doesnt want me having our son at my house because he doesnt think i can manage by myself and I’ll end up hirting him or something, and cus i live with my bf and my ex doesnt want him around our son. He has no reason other than being over protective for this. My bf wouldnt hurt him and is good with kids.

OP posts:
Hobsbawm · 30/12/2019 19:03

There's some inaccurate and poor advice on here.

Contact Women's Aid ASAP.

What you describe is psychological and emotional abuse of you and your son (exposing a child to abuse of other adults is abuse for the child). Some of what you describe is absolutely classic behaviour. Try looking up the Freedom Programme's description of 'The Dominator'. I wonder how long it's been going on and what lead you to believe your son was better off with your dad. Your ex is using your son as a tool to abuse you with. Please contact Women's aid and get some support.

I se

Noideasorry · 30/12/2019 19:07

If you both have parental responsibility he does not get to stipulate where you can or can't have your child unless there is social services or court involvement.

The abusive aspect you're experiencing at his hands is a different part of the situation to what I am advising you on.

Yetanotherwinter · 30/12/2019 19:07

You can actually abduct your own child if you don’t have parental responsibility.
@ohprettybaby you’re wrong about the emotional abuse. If a child is witnessing screaming, shouting and things being thrown then that in itself is emotionally abusive to the child. It’s extremely damaging for child to witness this kind of behaviour.
OP the best thing you can do is go and get some legal advice.

Allycat1989 · 30/12/2019 19:10

Is there a contact order in place or is this just an arrangement the two of you set up? If this is a court order and he is refusing contact that a court has ruled on then he is in breach of a court order. If there is no court order then you 100% need to get one, they will assess if he is even capable of looking after your son and they will look into your concerns regarding his gf. He does sound like he's being controlling and using your son as an emotional weapon against you. He should only be refusing contact if it's a welfare concern and even then he should be doing with social services support. In the new year go to citizens advice bureau and get a lawyer, I'm pretty sure you can still get legal aid for family court.

Sotiredofthislife · 30/12/2019 19:11

I think it is reasonable for the resident parent to want the address of the NR parent if the child is spending time there

It is quite clear the man is abusive. The OP has claimed she and her partner are scared of him knowing where they live.

OP - please see a solicitor and get this all sorted through the courts so he can’t keep playing these games. You may or may not be compelled to hand over your address but if he is abusive, withold your address until a judge orders otherwise.

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