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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Man in ladies toilets

140 replies

Beansprout30 · 28/12/2019 21:15

Twice now I have been in the ladies toilets and there has been a male in there. First time I walked in with my three year old daughter and there was a guy washing his hands just leaving. I just ignored him and carried on but felt very uncomfortable. Second time was yesterday, came out of the cubicle and a man and his female partner, plus young child (not a newborn baby) were changing child’s nappy. At the time I thought what the heck, mum obviously needs a hand, but now I think why didn’t they just use the single disabled/baby change toilet. Why did he need to come into the ladies?
Is this becoming normal?! And aibu to ask how you would have reacted to males being in the ladies public toilets?

OP posts:
GirlDownUnder · 29/12/2019 07:57

In universities, soon to be everywhere. Apparently it’s because your loo at home is gender neutral (mixed sex) so what’s the big deal...?

Man in ladies toilets
donquixotedelamancha · 29/12/2019 07:59

That’s not the point and under the equality act biological women have a legal right to have their privacy and dignity if a place has been designated for women only.

Yes, but having the legal right doesn't mean organisations must use it. For example Marks and Spencer's facilities are explicitly mixed sex- you can self ID to use whichever you prefer.

The whole point of 'gender' self-ID is to get round to sex discrimination restrictions of the equality act.

Penis-havers are now allowed in all female public spaces because you mustn't assume gender

Nope, lots of organisations hold the line, which is why it's really important they get told when this occurs. If no-one speaks up we just get told problems don't happen.

Back to the point: YANBU, OP. Contact staff next time.

GirlDownUnder · 29/12/2019 08:01

Ozgirl75 helloooo
I’m in South Australia and it’s a little warm Xmas Grin and yes, lots of family rooms here which include nice seating for breastfeeding, resting, etc.

GrannyBags · 29/12/2019 08:06

I haven’t seen this but I do have a friend who looks a bit masculine and she was asked why she is in the ladies. She is female, always has been and I was irate on her behalf. She was less bothered as it has happened before.

Hellofromtheotherside2020 · 29/12/2019 08:06

Some of the family toilet areas also have mini soft play areas!!! It's so crazy! It's like a whole little world I didn't know existed! 😂

Genzeee · 29/12/2019 08:08

This sounds like a thread to get the frothers out. Haven’t had one for a while

BlueEyedPersephone · 29/12/2019 08:09

Totally agree with over a certain age but think that the age in some locations is older than 8 or 9 as there is no way my ds age 8 is using a motorway service toilet area on his own. I don't feel they are safe.

Hellofromtheotherside2020 · 29/12/2019 08:09

In universities, soon to be everywhere. Apparently it’s because your loo at home is gender neutral (mixed sex) so what’s the big deal...?

Can't believe the irony of that poster you've shared! And thanks for sharing it ♥ They have a right to use facilities they feel safe in?!? Erm, what about our rights, or do they matter less?

GirlDownUnder · 29/12/2019 08:10

This sounds like a thread to get the frothers out.

If you think this is goady or a troll, report don’t hunt.

GirlDownUnder · 29/12/2019 08:13

Erm, what about our rights, or do they matter less?

Sadly, I think you’ve answered your own question Sad

(To be fully transparent, that poster is being used in uni’s in the UK)

hazeyjane · 29/12/2019 08:19

A few times in the pub I used to work in, blokes would stagger into the ladies, there would usually be a loud scream of "FUCK OFF" and the landlady would give them very short shrift (I wonder if she would now?)

The baby changing thing happened in a toilet in a wildlife park I went in with dd1, a man and his wife changing a baby. At the time it annoyed me, but I didn't say anything and neither did anyone else, which annoys me now even more.

The dds are now of an age where they would go to the toilet on their own, they would both, but dd1 especially, would be incredibly uncomfortable (and vulnerable) if they went into a toilet and a man was in there.

Original poster
Beansprout30 · 29/12/2019 08:20

I am absolutely not a troll, this happened, and I’m interested to see how others would have dealt with it. Should I have said something or just walked out?!

OP posts:
FrancisCrawford · 29/12/2019 08:21

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Yetanotherwinter · 29/12/2019 08:30

I’ve never seen it myself but I wouldn’t be happy. It’s a poor do when you can’t even go for a wee in private.

kristallen · 29/12/2019 08:34

Should I have said something or just walked out?!
Well I don't think you should have had to say anything - they both should have apologised straightaway. The thing is, openly challenging people who you don't know can result in a quite unpleasant experience and not one you'd comfortable or even safe in, so for safety reasons, just walking out is better.

But it demonstrates EXACTLY why men being in women's single sex spaces for any reason is problematic. If a man really needs to be, being apologetic saying he just leaving etc makes a massive difference to pretending he's not there when he obviously is, or that he has a right to be when he obviously doesn't.

Ozgirl75 · 29/12/2019 08:36

Yes, handy family rooms when I had a baby and a 2 year old as he would have a little play while I fed the baby. He was a runner too so I could fence him in one place!

Whocutdownthecherrytree · 29/12/2019 08:37

My sister was born female, she identifies as female, she’s gay and dresses fairly masculine. She has been so traumatised by women abusing her for being a man in a woman’s public toilets she no longer uses them. Can you even imagine what that must be like? It has been horrible for her. So my advice is never assume, be kind and respectful. Most people just try to do the right thing.

Timmythatyou · 29/12/2019 08:38

I have never seen this and do t know any man who would walk into the ladies like that. The bloke with the baby still Shouldn’t have come in but you can see how that happened.
Dunno about the other one but you absolutely sure it wasn’t a butch woman? I have a friend who is a 40 something woman who looks like a young man to some people and she gets challenged in the ladies frequently until they look beyond the hair, clothes, slim figure.

Marriedtoapenguin · 29/12/2019 08:39

Back in the day when it was assumed that men never changed a baby I used a ladies toilet. Got a staff member to make sure it was empty and changed baby like a F1 pitstop. Other than that, hell no. It's the ladies toilet. The clue is in the title.

With regard to the trans issue, is it just me or do the loudest voices on this want to have the rights of women regardless of the effect on women without actually removing their male appendages?

A PP said something about waiting for a 6foot4 trans winning Wimbledon. I'm more waiting for the first trans sports winner to retire and then suddenly decide to revert gender.

Timmythatyou · 29/12/2019 08:43

As to what would have done - not sure. With the woman/ man/ baby I might have said ‘ Excuse me but this is the ladies a could you leave’ except probably not as it would t have bothered me under the circs maybe?
With the other - deffo a man?? Not a butch woman?? If I was absolutely certain it was a bloke and not a woman or trans woman then I would say ‘This is the ladies’ or gone to get staff if that’s appropriate at the place.
Still - and I live in a big, gay city where people are much more fluid about these kinds of things, and we have a lot more mixed koi spaces now which can cause confusion, I have NEVER see a man in the ladies. I think you just got unlucky.

parrotonmyshoulder · 29/12/2019 08:45

My ten year old DD just told me about a man making a weird comment to her while she was waiting for her grandma outside a cafe loo last week. She dealt with it fine but I asked her what she would have done next if he hadn’t gone. She said, ‘oh I wasn’t worried as I could have just gone into the ladies’ loo. He couldn’t have followed me in there’.

Timmythatyou · 29/12/2019 08:49

parrotonmyshoulder - sexual predators aren’t and. Ever have been stopped by a picture of a lady wearing a skirt on a loo door unfortunately.
I’d explain to DD that she needs to seek help immediately if she feels threatened from staff, or another woman if possible.

LadyAllegraImelda · 29/12/2019 08:51

Never encountered this and don't know anyone who has

parrotonmyshoulder · 29/12/2019 08:51

Yes, I did explain that. Obviously.

81Byerley · 29/12/2019 08:59

In France years ago a lot of toilets were unisex, and I had to walk past men standing at urinals to get to the cubicles. I personally don't have a problem with it. My daughter, as a teenager, in a club, looked at the queue for the ladies, then at the men happily going in and out of the gents, and said to the girl in front of her "Sod this, coming with me?" They walked into the gents, calling "Excuse us, gents" as they walked past the shocked men at the urinals, and went into a cubicle (together). No problems, and nobody remarked on it. I thought it was sensible.