Feeling disgusted by friend’s DD’s salary

[DisgustedParent]

Best friend’s DD is the same age as mine (26) and we’ve known each other since both DD’s were born. My DD went off to uni but struggled to find a job after her degree and has ended up working in a call centre (financial services) where she is paid very poorly, has to work unsociable hours and is not treated well by management at all. It’s awful to watch her struggling to get by after rent and bills, knowing that despite working long hours, she may never own a property of her own or be able to afford to do all of the things she wants to do in life. My friend knows all about DD’s struggles and my worries for her as we are very close.

Her DD went straight in to an apprenticeship after school at 16 and landed herself in a role in Data Protection. Over the years she’s completed all sorts of professional certifications in the field and worked her way up, but never did a degree. I hear today from my friend that she has just accepted a senior management data protection role at the same large financial firm where my DD works. Friend has gleefully told me that her DD will be earning an eye watering £70,000 per year along with all sorts of benefits such as home working, health insurance, allocated parking... all of which of course aren’t available to my DD despite working for the same employer.

AIBU in feeling absolutely furious about this on DD’s behalf and thinking that there is something so very wrong about a company which pays its front line workers the absolute minimum, with no benefits whatsoever, whereas those with more ‘fancy’ job roles who probably don’t do an awful lot at all (and friend’s DD at 26 is still barely old enough to be out of school!) get to swan in to the company earning an astronomical amount, with lots of benefits on top too. Friend’s DD has already bought a house, has a brand new car, is always on holiday and draped in designer clothes. Meanwhile my DD and the rest of her call centre colleagues are threatened with redundancy regularly and are frequently told that salaries will not be increased as cuts have to be made.....How can this be justified?!

It’s extremely patronising to describe a 26 year old as barely old enough to be out of school, implying that this means she doesn’t deserve a high salary. Many 26 year olds have huge amounts of responsibility at work, e.g. junior doctors.

What did you think would happen when your dd got her degree given I think it is something like 85% of university graduates never earn over the required amount (I think it is around £20,000 per year but don’t quote me) for long enough to repay the university loan.

Did your dd have any sort of idea about what she wanted to do, what career she wanted to pursue.

I think that may be the fundamental problem.

Dd 19 has been in work since she was 16.

It is something people should consider that university isn’t something that will hand you a career on £70k and apprenticeships or just going out to work is going to be more lucrative than studying for a degree in a lot of cases

Try to remember it's not a race. I'm a couple of years older than your Dd & uni was the be all and all as far as my teachers were concerned, viewed as the best thing. At some point whilst I was at uni, the apprenticeship concept really took off, especially after the recession. Quite a few us felt we'd been betrayed and sold a lie... but it's what your Dd does next that's important, work hard and the combo of degree and track record will eventually pay off. I can see what you mean, I think- your Dd got sold up the river- but she will eventually get somewhere.

Also fortune may favour this other girl atm but we have no idea where we'll all end up. Truly wish her well - because we all need good wishes on our side, then leave her to it and focus your energies on supporting your own Dd. When I was working less than fabulous jobs, I started by aiming for internal promotions, getting an idea of what I was good at within a work setting and going from there. Currently still don't earn the big bucks but always trying to improve and- most importantly- I'm happy in my area. I wish your Dd all the best.

OP, have you ever worked? The reason I ask is that your questions seem very naive.

Surely you know about scarcity of skills and how these tie into pay and benefits.

If you need to attract someone into a crucial, highly skilled job, that requires training and experience, youre not going to be able to do that if everyone else already has the same pay and perks just for answering the phone or packing orders are you?

Op, your daughter is in her twenties. She still has every opportunity to change her career. Either she can take that decision - with your support - or she can accept her badly paid lot. It is up to her.

The whole point of university is to teach analytical skills, critical thinking and self confidence so she will be able to work this out for herself.

Don’t condemn someone else just because they have had a bit of luck and made a good choice of career. In a GDPR world, competent data protection officers are like gold dust.

You are joking.

Nothing has stopped your DD from gaining extra quals in areas of shortage and bettering herself. If she can’t figure out how to do this or doesn’t have the get up and go to seek professional assistance in bettering her career path there is only one person at fault at her age.

Tbh, it is no surprise your dd is working where she is as you have clearly passed your attitude onto her. Just getting a degree does not automatically entitle you to a high paying job. I worked in graduate recruitment and the amount of graduates who assumed they'd waltz in the door and get £30k straight away was astounding. Those graduates who were successful realised that the hard work starts after graduation.

If your dd wants a good career then she needs to get off her arse and earn it. Bleating on about how unfair it all is will just create hot air and not help anyone.

I kind of understand your point of view.

For example - benefits such as home working should be made available to all staff. Some call-centre staff work from home in the UK.

I worked for a large public sector organisation. My job could be done from home very easily. Only managers were allowed this privilege. One openly boasted how he would go for long runs on his home working days. Another had four kids and could never be contacted on her 'homeworking' days. Aye, clearly not working!

I would loved to have worked one day from home. I could have put washing on etc. Done cleaning etc.

I was smart though. Took my full quota of sick days. Knew when I might be brought in for a chat. Fun days in the cinema taking advantage of my Unlimited card!

I think the 70k salary is exaggerated.

Apprenticeship programmes can be the way forward. Your dd and you didn't choose wisely and she's paying the price. Well done to the other girl. Or it could be that your dd has the same peevish,negative attitude as you in which case it's probably that that is holding her back.

Gosh I haven’t rtft but I’m with you OP. I think because I’ve worked with people who are on that salary and seem to have got there through their own arrogance and not much competence or application. I’m not sure how many companies, and society, justify the inequality in salary. Lots of people work very hard indeed, poorly paid and high paid. To get paid triple a low paid worker how much harder must you have to work?

I know this will be about responsibility level too but depends what type of industry and what the risk is. I know a DPO of an organisation of 50k staff that didn’t quite get that (local govt, but lots of data including sensitive data).

DP officers imhe write a few policies, essentially the same between organisations, and report what they deem appropriate to DPO. But the real work of ensuring staff and procedures comply is done by front line managers.

To get paid triple a low paid worker how much harder must you have to work?

Have a go and find out?

I used to have a decent salary and I did work hard. To the point I was getting Ill with stress and gave it all up to work for just over minimum wage. So I do know!

When I was on the high salary there were some people who worked as hard as me, and others that really didn’t.

It astonishes me that some people still don’t realise that reward is fundamentally about supply and demand. Are these the same people who are all outraged when holidays are more expensive in school holidays?

Surely people know it's not about how "hard" you work? It's about the level of responsibility, the skill set required etc.

My cleaner works just as hard as any doctor. She's not paid the same for the exact same reason the ops daughter is not on the same package as the friends daughter.

DS went to uni got his degree and ended up working in a cinema for a while before he managed to get a job in the insurance industry (absolutely zero relation to his degree) DD (some sensory difficulties, struggled to keep up) left school with 3 GCSEs, got a job in a naice department store and worked her way up to supervisory role. Both on similar wages, neither bitter at the others route into work. But then I never badgered either of them to go to uni and I have a feeling that if this is t a reverse the OP probably insisted her DD went the trad route!

Yes there’s supply and demand but the level of inequality in this country (and some of the rest of the world) is grotesque. Supply and demand infers that these jobs only attract the best of people from around the world and you have to pay for that, but often the people in these jobs are home grown and don’t have the depth and breadth of experience to warrant that sort of salary.

The friend's daughter has landed in a field of work there is huge demand for at the moment. As jobs such as this were unheard of a few years ago it's hard to plan for it.
But DD needs to have a rethink -what can she make moves to get into.

Then we pay the people who look after our children at nursery minimum wage, and corporate types (some of which swan around doing lunches and very little else) get massively more.

I’m not saying all high earners don’t work that hard, or aren’t worth their salt, but DP is one of these that seems to be very overpaid at the moment.

DP officers imhe write a few policies, essentially the same between organisations, and report what they deem appropriate to DPO. But the real work of ensuring staff and procedures comply is done by front line managers.

You’re talking awful bollocks snowy

Jobs and set ups will vary widely across organisations.

However companies that will shell out £70k salaries for ppl to fuck all are vanishingly rare.

And yes, I agree we should pay the likes of nursery staff more. But that needs to come from higher taxes, which there’s little appetite for.

YABVU. Why doesn't your dd retrain? Of course she'll be a low earner forever working in a call centre. Friends dd is being rewarded for years of relevant on the job training.

With the higher fees I would counsel my kids to only do a degree if they are aware of the future job prospects and are sure they want to.

Otherwise I would advise them to take few years out working to figure out what they want to do.

I did a several years study and several years working in a job then completely switched career in 30s to get a better work life balance and something to suit my personality. So there is plenty of time to change and look around! Maybe look for things where you can learn online/at night. There are book-keeping courses and other ones recognised by industry. Keep an eye on job websites to see what people look for. Tech sector is quite good for work life balance.

We don't live in a communist state OP. If you want the high pay and perks you have to work your way up to get them. You don't get them handed to you on a plate. Nothing is stopping your daughter from achieving the same pay and benefits but she has to make it happen.

I find your post incredibly mean spirited, especially at this time of year.

It astonishes me that some people still don’t realise that reward is fundamentally about supply and demand. Are these the same people who are all outraged when holidays are more expensive in school holidays?

YES!
One of my favourite arguments on MN is the ‘Physical hard work= Financial reward’.

High Earner: ‘I work really hard for my (reasonably high) salary.’

low wage worker: ‘Well I ‘work hard’ too so I should earn more’.

‘Hard work’ isn’t just getting up at X am and going to a job. It starts at school, it’s choosing hard subjects others don’t want to do, courses that are highly in demand and lead to high paying professions.
The most successful people I know as adults missed out on an awful lot of fun and ‘worked hard’ from their early teens.

I have a (high) first class degree from a decent uni. I ‘work hard’ and earn a reasonable wage (£25-30k).

I’m sat here watching my DH, who has been awake since 4:30 am, revising science/maths which looks more like a foreign language tbh. All before he heads into work for a 13 hour day of life saving surgery 👍🏻

He earns more than me....how unfair 🙄

This is so insanely unreasonable I just hope it is a reverse. Mind you even if it is there is someone out there being utterly ridiculous.

Girl A - works her arse for 10yrs, earning professional qualifications along the way as well as working, progresses up firm, gets job commensurate with her experience and qualifications (and is clearly good at what she does).

Girl B - goes to university, gets starter job (no experience, working ethic as yet untested) at the same company. Girl B’s parent thinks it is unfair Girl A has better pay and perks.

WHAT?!!