Not sure I want to put myself through this again AIBU?

[Countryescape]

I’ll try to keep it brief. Two years ago my parents organised and paid for an all expenses paid trip to Hawaii for my family (me, DH and two kids, my single Brother and my other brother, SIL and their two kids.

To be honest the location was amazing, but in the end we had to just make the best of it because my SIL made it unbearable. We all had to dance to her tune, she was so rude/uptight and it ruined the holiday for me as most of it seemed to be directed at me and my mum. Things she did were:

• refused to go for a walk or spa treatment or lunch with me and my mum the entire trip due to a million different ridiculous reasons.
• Dictated our eating time so we had to eat dinner at 5pm (and start preparing at 4.30pm) EVERY SINGLE NiGHT!
• Never wanted her kids to hang out with ours (too tired, need a snack, don’t like x,y,z)
• Turned down our offers to babysit so her and my brother could enjoy a night out.
• Didn’t come to the animal safari *Didnt come to the waterpark
• Didn’t come to the beach *Didnt want the kids to all have a spa together. *Rudely refused an ice cream for her kids after we had been out in the heat all day

Honestly I could go on and on.

I made such an effort to be nice, kind, accomodating and I’ve never experienced such rudeness. And she was very rude to my mum which was worse.

No one said anything at the time as it would have been even more awkward but now my dad is making noises about a group holiday again.

I will go but feel we need to lay down some ground rules as in “we are not pandering to SILs every whim!”

What do you all think?

mclover your mum sounds amazing! Surely there's a part 2 to your story.

OP your sil sounds absolutely awful, rude, obnoxious, ungrateful and spoilt. Your brother is equally daft, allowing his parents to be disrespected like that, his mum was upset and he didn't care. I understand why you'd want to go again but I'd be blanking them the whole time

She obviously didn't want to be there. She shouldn't have gone, I doubt she'd accept another holiday anyway

She sounds a right miserable fucker. I wouldn't go on holiday with her again.

How can you say that there were no expectations to do things, and at the same time say there were expectations to do some things?

5pm dinner if that's what the children are used to of course the routine should be kept. I know some children who really, really would not cope well if their routine was disrupted.

Her controlling the money, there could be very valid reasons.

Him looking to her about the ice-cream, if she's dealing with them whilst he's at work all day then he might not be sure. Depending on what else they've eaten, and how long it is until the next meal, I might say no.

You suggesting the dvd when she was dealing with the child was over-stepping. Doesn't matter that 20 minutes later she put one on. Deal with the behaviour, a bit of a time out, and then yea why not a dvd?

It wouldn't surprise me if she posted a few years ago saying it would be her holiday from hell but she's getting pressured to go.

If you lot want to do it again, ensure that she knows she can just send him and the dc's if she's not up for it.

You're very judgemental. People have different attitudes towards holidays. Your SIL was making it clear, she didn't want to do spend lots of time together but you kept asking. From her pov, you asked her to go to a spa - she said no. You then asked the children to go to a spa - she said no. You asked them to go to the water park - she said no - etc, etc. It sounds as though she was sending a clear signal and you were trying to grind her down. Lots of families spend time separately on holiday and only get together for evening meals.
It's also not easy being the IL in a family situation.

It does come across that you don't like her, OP. She's entitled to have a different idea of what is a good holiday from you and your family. From reading your initial post, your SIL was doing what works for her family - but because it was different to what you do, you took it as being directly aimed at you and your mother! Why don't you think she was doing what works for her family? Why take it so personally?

Ultimately, the rights and wrongs aside, she is your brother's choice.

You either like it or lump it. You either go on holiday with her, knowing she won't join in, or you don't.

No point taking yourself round in circles trying to work out who is in 'the wrong'.

My brother (SILa hubby) is the golden child in my dad eyes. He can do no wrong so me and my other brothers opinions are largely ignored.

That’s really sad. Maybe that does create some dynamics with your SIL if she feels that your dad thinks your brother can do no wrong. You and your mum sound like lovely holiday companions so any time you plan a little trip to Hawaii, then I’d join the queue of posters who would love to come with you.

Group holidays are so hard. I've been on many extended family holidays with dh's family and I found it so hard when my dcs were little because we weren't 'allowed' any down time and we had to eat late because it suited dh's family.
I remember dc1 (3) having a meltdown at the Hard Rock Cafe at 8.30pm - completely unsuitable time and place. I told dh this was his fault for pleasing his family not thinking of his dcs' needs. This is when he started listening to me.
Also I'd rather die than go to a spa with my mil and sil. However I'm happy to come with you in Hawaii Op!

Have you considered that she can’t tolerate the heat?

Weird responses here.

So many saying “SIL clearly doesn’t like you or your mum” .... errrrr she liked them enough to accept an all expenses paid trip?!

If someone paid for me to travel with them, I would assume it’s because they want to spend time with me, and I’d bloody well do exactly that! Or decline if I didn’t like them enough.

I’ve paid for a friend to go on holiday with me before. I’d be gutted if she went off and did her own thing!

Say no and save the person paying’s money if you don’t want to spend time with them!!

I'm with you, OP. To be honest, I wouldn't go to Hawaii at all, as beaches, swimming, spa, board games and nails done are as far from my idea of holiday as possible. That's why I'd refuse to go completely. But if a person decides to go after all (talked into or not, doesn't matter, she could have refused) - then he/she needs to make an effort to join the group for at least SOMETHING and be civil and polite, not rude. Otherwise, why come at all?

All these posters saying she didn't want to be there, maybe all the activities suggested by OP is not to her taste, maybe she doesn't like OP, maybe she was pressured by her husband to go, etc. Come on. I don't think she was shackled and dragged there by force. She's a grown up woman and could have said no. Instead, she went on fully paid for holiday and didn't make any effort whatsoever. That's unfair on OP and the rest of people. OP and the family didn't do anything wrong, they didn't deserve such treatment.

OP, don't let her spoil your holiday next time, just do your own thing with your mum and others, let your SIL do whatever she wants alone. You are not responsible for an adult person and her time, don't pay attention to her.

It's quite possible SIL was only there to facilitate her husband and children being there. She didn't want to go but they couldn't / wouldn't go without her, so she had to go along to make her PILs' dream possible.

Mclover that's brilliant so did you go, what was SIL response and did your brother come without her?

I've been your SIL and that is because my ex in laws were/are a high conflict family who regularly row with each other, and having a none blood family member along meant they had a convenient scapegoat and someone to pick on and pull faces and roll eyes behind their back at. I drew very strict boundaries to make spending time with them bearable and these were obviously just more evidence of how awkward and selfish I was.

I'd love to hear her side of things.

I would love to hear the SIL side of the story!

She wanted to eat at 5pm, fine, you didn't have to join. My own kids would have barely finished their afternoon snack by then, no way would they have diner so early, let alone us. That's the time families with young children start going back on the beach!

She didn't want to join you, again fine, you told her your plan, then you get on with it.

It sounds like she was forced by her DH to come too and you didn't give her a minute of peace. The more you gave her "advice" on her own children, the more she backed off, sounds reasonable.

If you invite people on holiday, you are trying to give them a good time and let them do what they enjoy. you don't guilt them into having a crap time following your orders.

My guess is she couldn’t afford to offer to pay her way, so avoided all paid activities.

@Pfefferkuchen she threw a strop that we wouldn’t all eat at that time so we did it to keeep her happy. Where are you getting the “I did t give her a moments peace” from? She was t forced to do anything. We always asked her if she would like to join us because it would be rude not to. She never accepted so we said okay and went and did everything without her. I think she just really did not want to be there and made it known by being totally disengaged. Eg. no conversation, as well as not participating. My mum actually just brought it up again today and surprising her and dad said “it was obvious she didn’t want to be there and she behaved really badly” So I have no worries a joint holiday will be happening any time soon!!

God that sounds like very hard work indeed.
I would definitely not go on holiday with her again, you’ll dread it!
You’re not supposed to dress holidays!

Dread

Yup... I'm with you... Absolutely... Some time away from eachtoebr....with 3 generations and diff people... Anyone would need this...

But to accept an all expenses paid holiday... Be rude and refuse to do ANYTHING then stropping tjat a group of adults object to eating at 5pm?? (I would say... Yes of course you want to feed toddler at 5pm..lets have thr adult dinner at 7/whatever... But she threw a tantrum... Nah thats shit behaviour.

I don’t see why you couldn’t just leave her to it? Why did you let it bother you so much? I personally wouldn’t bother inviting her this time if it upsets you and your mum so much. Just say to your brother ‘X clearly didn’t enjoy her time last time and made it clear she didn’t want to be there so we will just go alone this time.’ Or if you want to invite her then do but just let her do her own thing and stop inviting her to stuff. And stop getting worked up over what she does with her own kids. It doesn’t need to affect your holiday in any way. It’s clear that she doesn’t feel particularly comfortable around your family for whatever reason, just let her do what she wants and if you’re all going to give in to her every demand (ie insanely early dinner) then that’s really your own fault. Let her eat dinner alone, stop inviting her to stuff, get on with your own holiday. Problem solved.

Sounds very controlling - does she suffer with anxiety? Could explain a lot if she did.

@Poorolddaddypig I’m not getting worked up over it. Please see my point of view. This was supposed to be a FAMILY holiday. The perfect time for cousins to spend time together. We live apart and don’t get to see them much which is a bit sad really. Honestly I wouldn’t have gone if I would have known she would veto any opportunity for our kids to spend time together. We’ve had lots of holidays before but this was a special one. If you can honestly tell me you would treat your own SIL like this and refuse to participate in any activities whatsoever, then I feel very sorry for your family.