To think that Turkeys Voted for Christmas?

[StormzysHat]

NC. This could appear goady but honestly it's a genuine confusion to me.

According to what we are led to believe by the media / some people on MN, "northerners" (as a generic group) voted for Conservatives because they are disadvantaged and fed up with the north south divide among other reasons.

How come disadvantaged Londoners voted Labour? I work in support sector and many people in my care will be in shelters this Christmas, and others rely on food banks. They were saddened and disheartened by Labour's loss and felt the Conservatives in no way represent them. This is on top of the Tory devised hostile environment and Windrush scandal making peoples' lives hell.

I understand that people are / have been pissed off and wanted to have their voices heard. But WHY would the very communities ravaged by the Tories in the 80's vote for them?

Why is it that Corbyn who lives in a very modest way, in Upper Holloway and who went to grammar school is seen as less acceptable than an old Etonian millionaire proven liar? How can Boris Jonson be seen as someone who can help the north south divide or to champion the working class FFS??

I completely accept Corbyn's leadership has been poor and don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan. BUT, given the alternative, I can't understand HOW working class people could vote for Johnson?

AIBU to think the turkeys just voted for Christmas?

@MidnightCircus thanks, and I'm sorry that my turkeys phrase implied I was name calling. Not the most diplomatic choice. Thank goodness I'm not a politician!

@Leighhalfpennysthigh

I will never understand why people in vulnerable positions, financially or whatever, voted Tory

But people on this thread are very clearly explaining it to you.

In a nutshell - as a necessary generalisation - its because they thought that the NHS wasn't going to be in a great state when Corbyn's "revolution" decimated the economy. A 4 day working week and free broadband for all was not considered to be a recipe for strong public services.

Hence the real fury of long term Labour voters who felt that they were not left with a choice but to vote Tory.

They didn't vote for Johnson - they voted against Corbyn.

They need to regain trust none of the current leadership candidates will do that in my opinion, especially not when they are touting the disastrous Emily Thornberry as a potential. The torys have a massive chance to cement themselves a whole new voter base but if they dont they will be punished for it and if a credible labour alternative is there i and others would vote for them again. One thing i noted many saying is they felt Labour spoke at them rather than to or for them, something Boris seemed to tap into on his tour round the country.

There are reasons why they voted and I'm trying to understand those. Labour need to understand those reasons if we are actually going to improve things
A bloody respectful view and I wish more felt like that. It actually scares me how fascist some Labour voters sound simply because (shock, horrow), people hold a different opinion. Political parties having such a cult like hold over people is worrying. That's never gone well in the past

Sorry I didn't mean to post a picture of my geese.
It was supposed to be a photo of my pet Turkey Trevor.
He most certainly won't be getting cooked at Christmas .
Neither will the geese but Jeremy's goose is cooked.
He should resign ASAP and fade into the background and retire to his allotment.

Lets make this absolutely clear to mumsnetters

Corbyn is a MARXIST, HE WOULD MAKE EVERYBODY POOR. HE WANTS EVERYBODY TO RELY ON THE STATE AND ONLY HE AND HIS COHORTS DECIDES WHO LIVES WELL.

THAT IS MOMENTUM AS WELL.

THAT IS MARXISM.

Now relax, every idiot that voted for Corbyn has been lucky he did not get in. Thank your lucky stars that smarter people didn’t vote this nasty man in.

@R1R2 would Lisa Nandy appeal to you in theory? I agree it shouldn't be Emily Thornberry. Or even Kier Starmer, even though I personally like him, but he's too London I guess.

Oh and The NHS will be in an amazing state when these muppets privatise it. Will the wonderful Tories be such a lark when you’re paying £2,000 for a life saving operation.

One other thing Corbyn completely missed is alot of ex mining areas dont just blame the tories for what happened they have no regard for militant trade unions and thats exactly what momentum reminded them of right down to the abuse anyone who went against them got only this time instead of being called scabs its tory scum.

They believe what they read in the sun or the mirror, or what they see on facebook

The Sun - yes, I'll give you that one. People who read the sun ARE thick and happily gobble up what's printed in the paper.

But The Mirror is VERY heavily pro-corbyn, so you can't have that one I'm afraid.

The Sun is the reason there are working class Tories.

As if the conservatives are for the working class. The fact some people think they are is laughable. Let alone people living in the most deprived areas, decimated by Tory rule. Beggars belief.

They voted for Brexit again. It was essentially a second referendum - the first time Cameron said ‘vote for me and I will give you a referendum ‘ and he did. Now Boris is saying ‘vote for me, I will give you a hard Brexit’. That’s as complex as it gets.

The same people make veiled inferences to ‘dodgy foreigners hanging around’ ‘foreign looking bloke hanging around park’, rant about how impossible it is to see a GP, and are scathing towards police (and the laws they don’t agree with) all over local FB groups.

I live in a teeny village, not far from a couple of typical post-manufacturing depression - nail bars, tattoo parlours and charity shops. Only restaurant is a Weatherspoons. The local FB pages are festooned with frothing celebration, mocking JC and ‘now we can have our country back’.

Things will never be the same.

Because even though I work for the NHS, went to uni for 5 years I just understand who I should vote for? Maybe I can't use my mind thoughts? I voted for the one with the blonde hair... Was that wrong?

Fuck off

Oh get over it for God's sake.

@TheGirlFromStoryville

Tribal politics really annoys me tbh, voting the same as your parents, grandparents etc just because.
The danger for Labour is that tribalism gave them many safe seats but that link has now been broken.

You honestly don't think there is tribalism in the conservatives? That people born of privilege associate with privileged people, and vote for privilege parties? There is as much tribalism and 'my parents voted conservative, and their parents did, so I do too' in the conservative side, and many of their seats are very safe because they always vote for the conservatives. So I am not sure what point you are making, but the blue ribbon conservative seats that are very safe are that way because everyone follows the conservative tribalism in that area, so it cancels out your point.

Like apps, I thought this was about Brexit, too. But in actual numbers, "Nearly 52 per cent supported parties in favour of a second referendum, compared with 47 per cent who supported Brexit-backing parties, such as the Tories, the DUP and Mr Farage’s outfit."
This is according to this article: www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/general-election-results-pr-alternative-voting-system-tories-labour-hung-a9246661.html

I dont know much about Lisa but from a quick google she seems a very principled lady and quite in touch with her local community but whoever takes the job they need to also be able to unite the party. Hopefully when the full candidate list is known and they have all set out their stall be can revisit this part of the conversation.

I voted Tory and I think that I was a turkey voting for Christmas. As a family we're in the £80, 000+ group that would have paid a bit more tax under Labour. BUT we'd have got free prescriptions (saving DH his £100+ prepayment card a year and my occasional £9+), we'd have got free broadband (saving £20+ a month) DD would save £27 000 + in tuition fees if she decides to go to Uni in a few years time. We'd get free dental check ups (saving £100+ a year maybe?) and probably the biggest thing, MIL with her worsening dementia would have got free social care despite PILs being quite wealthy. So hey, DH's inheritance would be protected.

But my view is that as we can afford those things we should pay for them (particularly the social care issue, why should we inherit money and expect younger poorer people to cough up the money for that?) so that taxes can go to people who need them. Labour were going to give a lot of extra money to people like us who really did not need it. So yes call me a stupid turkey if you like, it's better than being called a Tory cunt.

Apps should be Previous Posters

What’s funny and not a little tragic is that not only did the turkeys vote for Christmas they’re crowing over it too.

Ok user has just demonstrated that it's not just the lefties who are capable of assuming the stupidity of anyone who doesn't agree with them.

StormzysHat I don't know if it's worth wasting 5 minutes of my life on you but...here goes.

My parents are northern and so am I. I was brought up in a flat with an outside loo- that's a 'netty' if you are up north.

They voted Tory all their lives despite may I add my dad and my grandad working in the shipyards in the 1920s, 30s and 40s. My dad went to night school for 7 years on top of 12 hr shifts in the shipyards to get a degree by the time he was 28.

The reason they vot Tory is:

They were intelligent to understand that socialism levels down and keeps the poor poor.
That you can't make the poor rich by taxing the rich.
It has failed the world over.
It takes away ambition and aspiration.
It does not support business.
It is extreme, bigoted and bullying.

On the other hand, Tory aims are to support businesses and help people become millionaires because it is only these people's taxes that can pay for the genuinely needy and support them through taxation.

Does that help?

waspnest

You were never going to get that stuff from labour because it was not a fulfillable promise

What’s funny and not a little tragic is that not only did the turkeys vote for Christmas they’re crowing over it too.
Crowing? Nah, that's chickens. Turkeys gobble. Maybe you meant to say the chickens voted for the roasting pan?

One of the many reasons the Torys will never get into Liverpool is that nobody touches the sun no matter which team you support.

Can we fucking stop calling northerns stupid?

The north, for the most part, voted to leave the EU. They voted to leave the EU, not because they’re thick or because they’re racist. Yes, there are racist northerns but there are also racist southerners. I would argue that my area in Cambridgeshire (which also voted to leave), voted due to racism. Whereas my northern hometown saw their roads crumbling, industries leaving the north, lack of opportunities (which is why I don’t live up there now), public services struggling and would hear money about how much money the EU needed. There is funding from the EU but this is so south-centric. Like the rest of fucking investment in the UK.

Conservatives had a clear policy on Brexit, which labour did not have. The north voted to leave the EU because they didn’t see that investment being repaid in northern towns. Labour’s policies were so London-centric, the north effectively told labour to stop taking them for granted and expecting their votes. Labour didn’t work for the north’s vote thinking it could always rely on the working class vote. They haven’t bothered to understand why the north voted to leave and why that might be the biggest issue for them at the moment.

My family voted Tory (before everyone accuses me of being a selfish prick too as usual, I didn’t). My family are far from stupid. My mum is a floating voter, she did the research and felt if she voted labour she’d be making herself, me and my husband redundant under labour. She works in consultancy and does a lot of work with water companies and railways, I work for a water company and my husband works in accountancy. My dad made a similar decision. He works in property and the uncertainty of Brexit has stalled his industry, he wants to at least start dealing with the expected fallout. My brother works in construction and my dad decided not to make two of his children redundant through labours actions. Both my parents understand that the NHS is suffering, schools are suffering. They know a lot of teachers and NHS workers. They’re not fucking blind to the issues of the country or fucking stupid. Shock, horror - they don’t even read the sun or the mirror or daily mail. They also know that any investment will be centred on the south than the north as usual. Neither of my parents have any objections to paying more taxes but they do have objections to policies that will make their whole family redundant. By the way, one parent voted leave and one voted remain, so it’s not just about Brexit, although it played a role for the majority of working class across the country.

My grandad who worked as a tradesperson his entire life, didn’t vote for Corbyn because he thought he was a cunt.

The south, as per usual, took the north for granted. The north isn’t stupid and is fucking fed up of being treated as such by southern pricks. Again, didn’t vote Tory (or labour) so there’s no need to yell how much of a selfish prick I am, like usually happens.