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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Children of working mothers are more likely to mug you

363 replies

chomalungma · 04/12/2019 16:39

I know. It was 13 years ago. It's probably out of context. Sometimes you say things that rattle a few cages.

But it all builds a picture of our current Prime Minister, Boris Johnson.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/dec/04/boris-johnson-claimed-children-of-working-mothers-more-likely-to-mug-you

"“In the last 30 years an ever-growing proportion of British women have been ‘incentivised’ or socially gestapoed into the workplace, on what seems to me to be the dubious assumption that the harder a woman works the happier she will be, when I am not sure that is true of women or anyone else,” he wrote.

In the book, published before he became mayor of London, Johnson said an increasing number of female graduates tended to pair up with male graduates – a process known by economists as “assortative mating” – and that they then pool their advantages.

“The result is that in families on lower incomes the women have absolutely no choice but to work, often with adverse consequences for family life and society as a whole – in that unloved and undisciplined children are more likely to become hoodies, Neets [not in education, employment or training] and mug you on the street corner."

AIBU to think that his articles from the past reveal much about his views on women, Muslims, LGBT people....

OP posts:
formerbabe · 06/12/2019 17:36

it's a bit rich to get offended at me saying I don't want your life

That's not what you said.

Mummadeeze · 06/12/2019 17:36

From another perspective, my DD loves her after school club and extended clubs, and I love my job. Yes, I have to rush back during rush hour for an hour, yes there are days when the trains are horrendous, but it is worth it. If I dare to turn up early, she groans in disappointment because she is having so much fun at school. But then we have a lovely 15 minute walk home together where we discuss our days, thoughts, problems. It is a long day for her, but I still get quality time with her afterwards and on weekends and in my five week holiday to bring her up to be a good person rather than a mugger! Honestly, I think Boris’s article is a bit insulting, a bit judgemental and out of touch with most people’s real lives.

Findumdum1 · 06/12/2019 17:36

All of your ideas on how to do the school run with a long commute basically involve someone else doing the school run for you or someone else looking after your children before or after school.

No, they really don't. My youngest goes to ASC until 5 about twice a month, that's it. He moans when I come to pick him up and asks to stay until 6. When they were younger they went to a childminder 4 afternoons a week, at the height of my childcare needs. All my children have always all been taken to school by one of their parents until they reached secondary school, where they are now on the same train as their parent but wouldn't be seen dead in the same carriage :)

Mummadeeze · 06/12/2019 17:40

And a massive contributing factor for young people becoming muggers is the closure of loads of services for youths, the cutbacks in the police and austerity making people try and fight their way out of poverty.

mbosnz · 06/12/2019 17:42

I don't get offended at people saying they wouldn't want my life! My life isn't for everybody - hell, some days I don't want it! It can be very boring and tedious being home all day, doing all the domestic drudge work.

Being a SAHP for some is a dream, for some it's a case of being careful what you wish for, and for some it's the missing circle of Dante's Hell.

Some people are a lot better at dealing with the stress and the juggle of being a WOHP, or have better resources, or support systems that they can draw upon, and are therefore much better able to make it work for them. Some couples have far more involved and supportive partners, making it very much a team effort, and kids that are more robust and able to deal with longer days.

It's swings and roundabouts. The vast majority of us are doing the very best we can with what we've got, and our children show this - and that's regardless of whether they've a full-time SAHP.

mbosnz · 06/12/2019 17:43

And a massive contributing factor for young people becoming muggers is the closure of loads of services for youths, the cutbacks in the police and austerity making people try and fight their way out of poverty.

100% totally agree.

formerbabe · 06/12/2019 17:44

I don't get offended at people saying they wouldn't want my life

She didn't say that and I wouldn't be offended either.

She said my life didn't sound that great...that's pretty rude.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 17:45

My days when DC does a club aren't that different from the days he doesn't

Club day

Finish between 5-6 depending upon what activity it is. We change it each term & the competition is strong to get a place but have tried drama, coding, sewing, gymnastics, football, art, craft so far. I also love that it means the weekends are free from clubs. If it goes on till 6 they have some hot food & fruit. We are home 10 mins later as we live around the corner. Potentially have some more food, play & then bath, book & bed by 7.30. I prefer to do homework in the morning as it's a way to fill the time between 7 (or earlier, grrr) & 8.40.

Finish at 3.30

Tend to go to the park or have a play date or play at home with sibling or do a craft together. Dinner & then some more play & then then bath, book & bed by 7.30.

It's not that different.

mbosnz · 06/12/2019 17:46

She said my life didn't sound that great...that's pretty rude.

Well, to her, it doesn't.

You've made it pretty clear that you don't think the life of a WOHP sounds that great to you.

Bumpitybumper · 06/12/2019 17:46

@Findumdum1
So basically you had a job that allowed you to start much later than 9 and then used external childcare for school pickup and the period of time before you could get them when they were younger.

What would you have done if your job hadn't allowed you to start later in the morning and your commute was closer to two hours? Do you accept that some families would rather not use wraparound care for their children?

I accept your situation and values meant that the scenario you outlined worked for you and your family, however can you accept that families with SAHPs aren't too dense to identify the alternatives available and that maybe we have different views about what is best for our children which would make what you did unappealing.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 17:49

begging favours from family and friends

Seriously? I will say it again @formerbabe why are you so angry?

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 17:50

Loads of people routinely commute into london for an hour or more and do the school run where I am. It's perfectly doable with breakfast club/other partner wfh that day/childminder/afterschool clubs etc

I completely agree @Findumdum1. I think @Bumpitybumper said she didn't like wrap around care.

CosmoK · 06/12/2019 17:50

formerbabe I don't think you're in a position to call people rude after your earlier post...... according to you those women who choose to work even though they don't financially need to, are choosing their jobs over their children.
That was pretty rude.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 17:53

In school holidays my DC would have to go to a holiday club from 8.O0-6.00 minimum. That wouldn't be much of a rest during the summer for them.

For 6 whole weeks?! I don't know anyone who's done that, most people have annual leave of some sort.

formerbabe · 06/12/2019 17:55

according to you those women who choose to work even though they don't financially need to, are choosing their jobs over their children

They're choosing to work rather than be at home with their children.

That's not my opinion. That's a fact.

formerbabe · 06/12/2019 17:56

For 6 whole weeks?! I don't know anyone who's done that, most people have annual leave of some sort

Yes that also needs to cover the remaining eight weeks holiday...

CosmoK · 06/12/2019 17:57

What about dad's...are they choosing work over children too?

BatleyTownswomensGuild · 06/12/2019 17:57

The man is a total waste of an expensive education. A complete dickhead.

If people hate what he says, they have the opportunity to express that view next Thursday. Please use your vote.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 17:58

It's swings and roundabouts. The vast majority of us are doing the very best we can with what we've got, and our children show this - and that's regardless of whether they've a full-time SAHP.

Exactly.

mbosnz · 06/12/2019 17:59

They're choosing to work rather than be at home with their children.

And that can be a far better solution for a family, than a frustrated, bored, miserable, and embittered parent who is unlikely to actively and positively engage with the children while they actively resent being stuck at home with them.

TheNavigator · 06/12/2019 18:01

I am in my 50s and the product of a working mum - I've never mugged anyone, but I guess there is still time.

It is so depressing, women who want more than kitchen, kids, cooking will always be demonised - who knew we were responsible for property prices? No doubt the global economic crash and climate change can be blamed on us too. It's always the mothers fault.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 18:10

@formerbabe I notice you only reply to some of my posts 🤔

I have already mentioned that in my world most people have flexibility & can work remotely. Plus there is the option of unpaid leave or buying holiday so most parents can juggle the holidays with flexibility, annual leave & a couple of weeks of clubs.

I'm TTO but go in on the odd day to catch up on filing etc. I still use the school camp that runs for 2 weeks. DC1 sometimes prefers trips to the Velodrome & Cinema with a load of his peers as opposed to one younger sibling.

CosmoK · 06/12/2019 18:15

Regarding annual leave. Lots of people make this work. I get 37 days plus bank holidays and almost 2 weeks at Xmas. DH gets 35 plus the same at Xmas and bank holidays. We can make it work with minimal holiday clubs and childcare. I accept we're very lucky but we're not the only ones in this situation.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 18:21

DH gets about 6.5 weeks off, which the .5 is used over Christmas to get 2 weeks off. Half terms he tends to wfh for a few days & or will just make up the time by working 2 really long days.

cukooboo · 06/12/2019 18:23

posted too soon.

That leaves him 6 weeks to spread across Easter & the Summer