To hand child over to someone who can?

[Vengabusiscoming2019]

DD is 5. Life is horrendous with her and I'm a single parent.

Last night she came home from school and would not stop attacking her 3 year old brother. Even when I was sat in the middle of them if he so much as looked at her she was going for him. I had to call my neighbour to come get the 3 year old because I literally couldn't keep him safe from a 5 year old.

I dropped her to school this morning after being vile all morning and she leant in for a kiss and I literally couldn't bring myself to kiss her. I have to pick her up in 3 hours and I genuinely do not want to go. It's relentless and I'm broken.

Who do you call when you get to this point?

No advice, you have had lots from people who know more than me. But hang in there. Keep reaching out and accepting support. Show love. You have done well.so far and it will improve.

@Devereux1 will do - we’ve got plenty of in house research ability here, it’s so hard to find decent help from people you can trust to know what they are talking about.

This morning she went into school distraught but we had a lovely cuddle and kiss so I've left her feeling less like a monster of a mum.

I really appreciate all the advice. Lots of food for thought. I agree it's not so much knowing specifically what the issue is but having an understanding of how to deal with the issues.

I know it's hard but just try to accept her for how she is, even if that child right now is clearly struggling. Put any notion of how she should be completely out of your mind. She was never going to be that child. She is who she is right now.

Accepting that, I swear, honestly helps.

Also accepting that you are her best champion, and that even though she is testing you to the hilt you do know, deep down, what she needs. Yes 10% of the time you don't. But 90% of the time you DO.

Aw, Venga. Well done, I'm glad you're feeling a bit better.

The first thing, I would say, is considering your own needs here. You're under a huge amount of strain, trying to manage your own emotions and your children's, too. Can you make a bit of time for yourself every day, try to attend to your needs, even if it's just 20 minutes or so for a walk, something you enjoy? Call a friend, maybe write in a journal, do some gardening, something?

Good luck today

A child saw for years that the best way to get kisses, cuddles, and special treatment from mummy is to be violent and out-of-control. This message was reinforced through the abuse cycles she witnessed and then further reinforced as a response to her out-of-control behavior.

I don't think we'd be going for too many kisses and cuddles the morning after a 5 year old had bitten me and called me swear words. We'd be having strict discussions and talking about how other people do not grant affection toward people who are cruel, vicious, or violent.

Cuddles and kisses for a violent child just assure her that the best way to your heart is through cycles of outburst and make-up.

Thanks @WombOfOnesOwn just what I needed to read.

Womb is not factoring the trauma that your DD has experienced. I am so sorry that you are having such a tough time. I really hope you find the help you need.

OP have you had a chance to talk to your GP? Can they do anything to hurry along a diagnosis for you?

Hope the meeting helps. School need to push the TAF through to get you more support. Have they called in any other external agencies ? If not, why not ?

What's her academic level? Do they feel a specialist school would help ? What's her friendships like at school ?

I know it's been said more politely, but the Womb person hasn't a fucking clue.

This all sounds so familiar to me OP. You ARE allowed to stumble, you CAN'T get it right every single bloody minute, your daughter will not be worse because of one kiss.

This sounds like ASD and PTSD to me, but be reassured that either could cause this level of distress.

95% of ASD comes with high levels of anxiety.. and just being at school requires such huge reserves of self control and masking.. she is probably completely exhausted by the time she sees you.

As well as feeling utterly abandoned.

I'm so happy for you that the school has seen the other side, and that you've got a meeting.

I can barely hold it together with my two, frankly I think it's amazing you are holding it together at all.

This was just posted on the Therapeutic Parenting Facebook page and I thought it might be useful!

kimsgolding.co.uk

Daniel A. Hughes

I know someone mentioned Kim Golding previously and I also just wanted to highlight Daniel Hughes.

I don't know much about the specifics of ASD but the above authors are good on trauma and attachment.

A bit of reading might help you feel less alone, I suspect you might be surprised about how many of stories in the books you can relate to. The books are easier to read than you might think.

Womb, as has been said, isn't giving enough weight to the trauma experiences.
Kisses and cuddling your dd and making her realize that regardless of her behavior you love her and are there for her is critical for her. So fantastic that you were able to give her lots of cuddles.
Yes boundaries are important for helping your dd feel safe but that needs to be alongside her knowing you love her unconditionally because she is worthy of that.

Hi OP. Is there anywhere that offers art therapy or similar near you? Even privately. Contact womens aid and see what your options are for therapy for her. Regardless of any ASD traits, she will still need therapy after what she has experienced, so they cannot keep fobbing you off like this.

Sorry to bump but can I ask a "how worried should I be?" Question?

For remembrance day they taught DD what death was at school. She had fixated on it a bit since and has put 2 + 2 together. Last week she announced that her daddy is dead. Then yesterday she was hitting/wrestling a Santa teddy we have and goes "look mummy Santa is dead like daddy"

I feel sick but I don't know if I'm just being oversensitive?

Venga I would say that behaviour is pretty normal for her age, they often fixate on things like death and religion when it’s being taught at school. All you can do is correct her, she’s learning all the time, sometime it just takes longer for our kids (kids with additional needs) to understand what they are learning.

My nephew is the same age with no SN’s and has become fixated on God and the bible as it’s being taught to him at school, I remember my dd1 being the same at that age.

Maybe for her dead means not in my life anymore. If death was explained as someone having gone somewhere else and not coming back then that is what happened to her father.
She may just be trying to make sense of how her world has changed.
Your Ex was violent then he was gone. Santa teddy was “violent” so he should be gone too?

Venga, that's totally normal. Kids can say a lot of things that sound shocking, they usually don't have a very deep grasp of the reality of things.

For example, a neighbour recently died and my daughter (6) wrote notes to her grandparents saying she wished they weren't going to die soon. (They're not, as far as I know, but she's processing old age, death, etc).

In fact, kids often go through phases trying out these concepts and playing with them. It's how they process stuff. 'Playful parenting' is a wonderful book on how kids heal through play, by the way, another one I really recommend and foudn hugely useful. Author talks about how kids' games sometimes seem shocking to adults, but so long as nobody is being hurt or upset, it's a good thing for them to play stuff out.

It's good that she is happy to open up with you about something that has obviously trouble or upset her. Sorry that it has clearly upset you, though, too - I can imagine it could be hard. Again, you may need help to work through all this with a professional - play therapist, counsellor, etc. If you feel okay with it, I would take the opportunity to play with her and encourage her to keep playing on the subject, it's really healthy and could be very important for her.

This site may be helpful: www.playfulparenting.com/

Oh, don't worry about the death thing. It's the age when they start to understand what it means and playing at being dead or toys etc being dead is their way of trying to process it.

I wonder how they explained death to her. If they said "it means someone's not here anymore" it makes sense for her to assume her dad is dead.

Daddy isn't dead and neither is Santa. What makes you say Santa is dead?

OP

just to say that clearnightsky's advice was great. School isn't working and is putting your DD into a tailspin, so I would take her out for a period.

We got in a similar spiral and did far FAR better home schooling.

It seems scarey because its MORE time with your DD, when she is so difficult, but honestly its been easier on average than having to deal with uncontrollable outbursts on a twice daily basis.

Regarding the death thing, we also have had periods of obsession with that. The thing is not to load adult understanding onto a 5 yo. She doesn't know what she is saying or meaning. Nod and smile and ask if she is still interested in death as an idea...start a conversation, but don't assume it means the same to her as it would to you.