To contemplate reporting someone for possible benefit fraud? WWYD?

[WWYDhey]

So there’s this girl I know. Not a close friend but someone I know and would say hi to in the street. We are Facebook friends. I know a bit about her through mutual friends.

She is claiming as a single parent of two kids but her boyfriend lives with her. Full time. They have actually just become engaged and she is pregnant. He has 3 kids to someone else with which he sees 2 of them every other week.

He is ‘unemployed’ but I believe he works full time for cash in hand. (Some kind of joinery or building work)

What has made me consider reporting her (if that’s something you can even do??) is that she spends all her ‘free’ money on weekly hair up appointments, professional make up done. New nails etc (we all know this as she documents everything on Facebook) always out at restaurants and nights out. Almost like she is bragging.
Doesn’t look like she spends much on her kids. They always look a bit scruffy and bored in her photos. (Think tops that look too small or worn out)

And now that she’s pregnant she’s uploading loads of expensive purchases for the baby (ted baker everything, massive pram ordained in Jewell’s)

Now I know some of the replies I will get here will be along the lines of ‘what’s it got to do with you how she spends her money’

• well yes it has nothing to do with me but it is really irritating that I work full time with kids and pay a lot in tax and have to scrimp and save. I don’t get all of the luxuries she does. Yet ina round about way I contribute to it.

‘How do you know she’s on benefits’ our mutual friend knows she is for certain. Plus she works 18 hours per week in a cafe so it’s not rocket science.

So would you report someone claiming as a single parent when she isn’t?

YABU- Dont report her and don’t give it another thought

YANBU- Do report her

If so how would you report anonymously?

I wouldn't hesitate. Those saying mind your own business, is an attitude I've never understood. What people do with money they've earned is absolutely nothing to do with anyone else (bar for illegal activity etc).

When people are screwing the system to get money that is put aside to help those in most need then absolutely it's our business. Money is finite, and you wouldn't take the 'mind your own business approach' if it got to the stage where you needed the help to buy food and heat your home, but it wasn't available because it was being spent on holidays/ in salons or whatever.

I'd report her without a second thought.

I would report if I knew anyone committing benefit fraud and / or tax fraud

• it's often both, if they are working cash in hand

However, I wouldn't assume fraud just because of their standard of living,
because that person might not mention all their legitimate sources of income, such as maintenannce

I wouldn't report if I only suspected, because of the guilty until proved innocent policy of stopping benefits while investigations are ongoing

• that policy must change, both for natural justice and so that more people are willing to report benefit fraud

@OldQueen1969

🙌🏼 thank you.

I got investigated a few years ago when I was doing absolutely nothing wrong. It nearly destroyed me.

I've had people query how I can afford my horse when I don't work. Well it's because I don't buy designer clothes or shoes or bags like they do. DH has a small part time wage, we get topped up by tax credits. How we choose to spend that money is up to us.

It's interesting to see the comments are largely mind your own business but the voting poll is very different.

I don't see why benefits would automatically be stopped while investigations take place.

Whether you see or not isn't really relevant. It happens.

If someone is reported for claiming to be living on their own when they are actually with someone surely the benefits office only have to look at the claimant and if they are claiming to be a couple then no further action needs to be taken.

This makes no sense. You are talking about someone closing to be on their own and then saying if they are calling to be a couple no further action, surely it's either one or the other.

You can do whatever you like of course, but there will many people who think you unreasonable regardless of your reasons.

Even the people that work within the government seem to be committing some kind of fraud. I personally wouldn't worry yourself or make it your problem.

I love that we've been convinced that the other poor folk are the problem.

People like her are a minor irritation in the grand scheme of things IF she's committed fraud and that's an IF. Short of inspecting her bank dealings and what not you don't know. She could just be getting herself in debt.

Corporations who don't pay tax and tax avoidance schemes are the problem not other poor people.

If she is constantly posting about her lifestyle you won't be the only one to have noticed that's she's living it up on the state!
I wouldn't worry about reporting her because if you don't someone else will.

Report them if it makes you feel better
If they are genuine then it won’t cause them a problem
Own it - that you are doing it out of jealousy though - not trying to save taxes etc

I would put your energies to your own family I wouldnt consume anymore energy on the matter. If she gets reported your life won't change but the children's may.

I was reported once for benefit fraud (apparently) would’ve been an issue but I wasn’t claiming anything other than working tax credit which I was entitled to!

Please please be sure of your facts before reporting.

I worked as Carer for a lady who was reported maliciously. Her housing benefit was stopped along with a couple of other things,

It took MONTHS to sort out the housing benefit issue as all the while she didn’t get housing benefit they were charging rent and sending threatening letters. It did get sorted out eventually and all back dated etc but the anxiety and stress it caused already unwell lady was horrific.

You can’t tell anything much from Facebook

I can’t believe the amount of people saying “it’s none of your business”.

Benefit fraud is a crime. It absolutely is your business.

Would these same people “mind their own business” if they saw a house being burgled, or someone being mugged?

@Pantalaimon88

Yes but she doesn't know that anything is awry, she's listened to gossip and speculation and is considering reporting somebody with no evidence.

If you know for certain someone is receiving benefits fraudulently then yes you should definitely report them. If you’re not sure then leave it until you are.

If they are genuine then it won’t cause them a problem

Do you honestly believe that? Is having your benefits stopped for in an indefinite period while investigations occur not a problem? Of course it causes a problem whether they’re guilty or not.

Of course you report her! She's taking money from people who actually need it. This is why people are fucked off with the benefits system. Truly vulnerable people miss out because people get hard nosed and exacerbated with the whole thing.

I don't see why benefits would automatically be stopped while investigations take place.

But they are. One might argue that they're stopped because if you find out about fraud you have to try to stop it immediately. One could argue that it's so that there is less to pay back if fraud has been committed. But the reality is that it just makes the whole system harder and more frightening to use, and that is quite deliberate. Benefits are stopped as a way of wielding power over the poor. It's an appalling system and personally I wouldn't contribute to it by reporting someone. Yes fraud is bad. Let the DWP find out about fraudulent claims - don't make your neighbours live in fear of you.

Perhaps if corporations paid tax properly and that money was spent on the NHS then things would be better. But the NHS is deliberately being run into the ground.

Anyway report her if you must. I don't believe half of what you say and you sound either dense or mean-spirited to think your "friend" is the reason our country has failed.

Absolutely @longtimelurkerhelen

I have a degenerative condition is one of the reasons I get benefits, on days when I have to “get shit done” I do extra stretches and dose up on painkillers to be able to do whatever it is and I’m basically buggered for next 2-3 days, but I’ve had neighbours and others make digs about what they’ve seen me doing so I “can’t really be disabled”, I occasionally need to use a stick or even 2, the nature of the condition and how I am is such I’ve been told to resist using mobility aids for as long as possible as maintaining the strength of muscles will keep me mobile for longer but this has led to certain ignorant twats thinking and even saying that when I use something I’m “putting it on”

But my main issues are mh yet so so many people still refuse to accept how debilitating they can be, I’ve not been able to leave my home in nearly 2 years, it can take me up to 90 mins to complete a visit to the loo I’m hardly living it up!!

There’s an awful lot of, often wilful, ignorance around variable and invisible conditions AND on how the benefits system works, one of these threads the supposedly “fraudulent” claimant was getting DLA but the op thought “fraud” because they were working! When DLA is not a means tested benefit and can be claimed by the employed.

“This country could be a better and kinder place” definitely! It’s terrifying the way things are going especially for those of us already struggling.

Lynsey91 you clearly have never had ANY dealings with dwp, I hope for your sake you never need to as I think you’d be massively shocked by how it all actually works. Benefits are automatically stopped basically for no reason other than they can! Investigations may not even start for several months and can and do involve them going through your entire life with a fine tooth comb, they can and do inspect your home without notice to see if there’s any men’s “stuff” present (if you’re claiming as a single mum), they can request years of bank statements, receipts, proof of residence, proof of costs for things like if you’ve had a holiday, your medical records, full employment records etc

A friend of mine had a similar situation to a pp where they were reported for not being a single mum because the reporter mistook the nearly adult son for a partner.

@oldqueen1969 excellent post thank you

Would these same people “mind their own business” if they saw a house being burgled, or someone being mugged?

Well they would be seeing a crime in action which is not really the same as pulling conclusions from Facebook is it?

do you have proof that if someone is reported all their benefits are stopped while they are investigated?

www.gov.uk/benefit-fraud

If your ESA claim is stopped, then your other benefits are stopped automatically. You have to visit the office and show proof to get them reinstated.
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/while-youre-getting-esa/esa-money-and-benefits-during-reconsideration/

The Citizens Advice Bureau recommend you use a food bank, but you can only use a food bank once every 2 weeks.
If you need a referral to use the food bank, you'll have to get one every time you use the food bank, many people can only get the referral from their GP.

From 2016;
More than 85% of public tips on benefit 'frauds' are false
Figures obtained by the Observer show that in the 1m alleged cases of benefit fraud put forward by the public, about 890,000 showed no fraud had taken place
www.theguardian.com/society/2016/feb/27/false-benefit-fraud-allegations

From 2018
Benefit fraud 'witch-hunt': 280,000 public tip-offs led to no action taken due to lack of evidence
Exclusive: New figures obtained by The Independent have led to critics suggesting members of the public should not have a role in identifying and investigating fraud within the welfare state

Malicious reports cost more than benefit fraud.

Well I don't know what you should do & personally it's not good to be putting herself in the position of letting everyone know her financial business via Facebook, I can imagine you feel like she's rubbing your nose in it somewhat.
But there is an anonymous fraudster line you can call just Google it. Personally I would leave it to karma