to think this is not normal behaviour for a 9 year old?

[Yolo89]

I just picked DD up to take to a class and she is very tired from a trip to the hospital for DS last night. So tired and emotional. I didnt have as many snacks for her as usual and she wanted me to go the shop. But I had 4 other children in tow so said no. I must tell you that she still had food left - apple etc but she did not want it yet was saying she was starving. I held my ground but she yelled at me and kicked me multiple times.

Every time I take her and her friends to an after school activity, she has a meltdown like this. It is usually about not wanting to go to the activity but it always is very stressful for me.

I ended up in tears today. All the other children just walk but never my DD. If another mum walks her, obviously she is fine but never with me.

Family life is tough at the moment as DH has issues with depression and alcohol and I feel this is greatly affecting my DD. She said today 'I want to die'. I have never heard this before and I am greatly concerned.

I feel like this is very far from normal behaviour and am very worried. What should I do?

I

'Our couples counsellor says I need to give him a chance to change'.

He has had a chance to change. He is an adult man who is letting his addiction cause harm to his children.

I grew up with a violent, alcoholic father. My mother always prioritised him over us, although she always told family members and anyone who'd listen that me, my brother and my sister were her priority.

He was aggressive, violent and verbally and emotionally abusive, and my mother made no end of excuses for him. Some similar to yours; ie he has nowhere to go, he's trying, marriage is for better and for worse, he pays the bills, I love him.

My siblings and I are forever changed because of the terrible choices my parents both made, my father for indulging his addiction to alcohol and never trying to change it, and my mother for not only enabling him but for FAILING TO PROTECT US!

Please, please, please protect your children. They deserve better than this and I can guarantee you that every single day they are exposed to this will damage them.

Your daughter is crying out for help. Regardless of whether your husband is 'trying' to get help or not, his behaviour and alcoholism are hurting your children and you need to protect them. Now.

@Yolo89

Did your dh tell you about the finances yet? Did you get the credit reports?

You know where this is going, the longer you drag it out the worse it will be for all of you. He is not going to change.

You only have to read some of the posts on here from children of alcoholics to see the damage they cause and the lifelong MH problems they have from living with an unpredictable drunkard, please get your kids out of this awful situation.

longtime - no I have not. But he has just got loan from his dad to pay all of the debt off. I am going to tackle the finance issue in counselling.

I want to support him with all he is doing to get better. So I said I'd come to the Dr with him and asked if I could have full medical disclosure. Which he gave me. That night he said he felt like a child with me coming along and got angry saying why do I need to come? i cannot win. At that appointment he told me had been drinking every day. I did not know this. He expects me to yell yippee when he has not drunk for 3 days but I am so angry because I didn;t know he was drinking every day.

Every time I get cross with him, he throws something back on me to blame me or make me look like the one in the wrong. He can't own it and just say he has been a shit. He makes me feel as if I've done something terrible. I just don't know what to do or how to act. If I give him the silent treatment he will turn it on me somehow, if I am nice all the time he will think his behaviour is ok and if I am angry which I can't help, he uses this as ammunition. I feel stuck and hurt.

Thank you for the messages - I am reading them all. I am just quite distressed and it is hard to answer at the moment.

Oh Yolo I really feel for you.

You cannot use silent treatment, it is abusive and will just make it worse. It is okay to walk away to cool down from an argument and have some thinking time. You then need to engage to try to solve the issue.

If he is drinking everyday and stopped for 3 days, that is a reason to encourage him. If you have another go at him, he will probably think why bother.

If you are going to continue in this relationship, you really need to think about how you are reacting to him. It sounds like you both have a communication problem. I don't know what else to suggest except separate until your issues are dealt with so the kids don't have to witness all the rows. It is very damaging.

I'm not saying this to be mean to you, it sounds like an incredibly difficult situation, but you need to think of the impact this is having on your children first.

Sorry also meant to say maybe some individual counseling for you might be helpful and you could also try Al Anon for support.

www.al-anonuk.org.uk/about-us/

Thank you. we are both having individual counselling and conselling together. I just can't deal with the volatility and the fact he is blaming me when I get angry over stuff he has done. He tried to compare my perimenopause anger with he alcohol anger. Mine is a hormonal imbalance I am trying to control with meds. He chooses to drink. It is not in any way similar.
I can't act any way towards him as I am just cross.

I am not prioritising him at all. My children are my all. It is just a mess. He was an adorable guy I dont know what has happened.

My ds was a bit like this. Hangry, mildly violent to me or destructive to the house or himself. Said worrying things like your dd.

It was always the same pattern that would kick off the tantrum. I try and avoid repeating the pattern. If he starts I force him to eat a banana. Low blood sugar has a lot to do with it. Food and hugs and telling him I love him works better than getting into crazy shouting matches. I also linked punishment to behaviour afterwards. So not at the time of the row as it caused escalation and melt down. Certain things like playdates or treats were later refused e.g 'oh no you can't watch tv tonight because you screamed at me and refused to practice piano last night', or 'you are clearly too tired from all these activities so we are not going to favourite activity this week.'

Perhaps find a day where she can stay home with you, miss the school and you can just sit under the blanket in front of tv and reconnect.
She sounds exhausted, i’d also bring healthy snacks for her after school- low blood sugar can cause bad temper (it affects me that way).
She is also nearing puberty so all sounds normal, except the comment about wanting to die. Reconnect, give her some down time and gently explore what’s behind it...

Every time I get cross with him, he throws something back on me to blame me or make me look like the one in the wrong. He can't own it and just say he has been a shit. He makes me feel as if I've done something terrible. I just don't know what to do or how to act. If I give him the silent treatment he will turn it on me somehow, if I am nice all the time he will think his behaviour is ok and if I am angry which I can't help, he uses this as ammunition. I feel stuck and hurt.

Honestly, that sounds like borderline emotional abuse to me and you shouldn’t have to put up with it.

My brother is an alcoholic and is currently doing the step down thing because he’s finally realized that his life’s gone to shit and he needs to actually do something to fix it (something he had to learn the hard way for himself and I’m still not convinced he has). His behaviour both before the programme and whilst on it is exactly the same as you’ve described from your husband.

Basically it’s projection. Everything is everyone else’s fault. His life is crap because of everyone else (mostly the people trying to help him) nothing to do with the drink. His anger and temper tantrums are because someone provoked him (aka wouldn’t buy him his booze) or he’s not angry and he’s not shouting, everyone else is.

My brother is really good at convincing everyone that he’s trying to change. In reality all he does is throw out the sound bites he thinks people want to hear and goes on drinking when he thinks no-one’s looking. He’s had so much support and he just leeches and leeches and then throws it back in our faces. For some people, it’s not until they experience the actual consequences of their actions and hit rock bottom that they will actually be willing to change.

I understand the desire to help your husband, but you do not have to put up with being abused by him or having him project all of his issues and problems onto you. He is a grown adult who is responsible for his own decisions and the consequences of those decisions.

If he genuinely wants to change he might succeed with support, but unless he truly wants to he’s not going to and all the support in the world will not make a difference. Unless he is genuine about fixing his addiction, he will take, take, take and give nothing but empty promises back. And the more chances you give him, no matter how much you try to shield your children, it’s going to damage them and it’s going to hurt you too. You cannot protect them from this while he is still actively drinking and living in your home.

I know he is your husband, and by all means give him that chance (I don’t know if this is the first time he’s tried to come off or how long he’s had the problem for), but set your boundaries and remember this: the welfare and mental health of you and your children is not worth less than his. Give him his chance, but if he will not change and cannot be trusted to change, do not let him ruin the lives of you and your children. Even a temporary parting of ways will be better than trying to struggle on and pretend everything is fine.

She sounds tired and stressed and overwhelmed and too young to articulate how she feels.
I have a 9 year old dd, it can be very challenging without the difficulties at home. Apparently kids get a huge hormone surge at this age too, I started my periods at 9.
She needs kindness, time , listening and love. It’s not easy for you if you’re having a hard time but try and remember how little she is and how confusing adult stuff is. It’s a headfuck for grown ups but at least we have some experience and wisdom

I agree with a previous poster ref hangry and blood sugar too

Leave your husband. Care for your child. Seriously I have been there as a child, get her out now before her childhood problems become adult problems.

You say it’s when you have other kids with you but she is ok when she is with other mothers, could it be that for some reasons she resents other kids being with you?

Poor you, OP and your poor children. My teenage dd used to spend hours fighting on the phone with her then bf and I found it horribly stressful. How much worse it must be for a child listening to their parents fighting.

Your husband is being a typical alcoholic. Everything is everyone else's fault. I don't think you should stay with him. Maybe you could go to AlAnon and learn some more about this problem

If I was hungry & someone offered me an apple would be shitty too

People who keep their kids in these situations always seem to insist they aren’t affected & stress that their kids are their “whole world” “reason for being” or “whole existence”.... but I suspect in reality it’s having kids & having this idealised vision of a family that they really love & cling to, refusing to let go even when their kids Will be happier long term if you leave.

If you didn’t have a great family, or feel like family fills a void in your life then you will understandably cling to unhealthy people, even at you & your kids detriment, because you perceive the loss of family & a parental figure, a “broken home” as being worse than having a toxic family environment.

In short, they can’t see the forest for the trees due to their own Hangups about family.

Don't give him the silent treatment. I never did that with my husband. But honestly the way he is demanding praise for not drinking and blaming you and equating your menopausal symptoms to his addiction- not hopeful. He doesn't want to do the hard work of getting sober. You may well need to give him the divorce treatment.

I know you love him. I loved mine too, until I realised he was no longer the wonderful man I married but an angry drunk. No point beating yourself up about why - you have to deal with it.

PM me if you need to talk.

"However the people stating that the husband should be kicked out and that you are putting your husband before your child clearly live in a universe where they’ve never lived with an addict."

Of course everyone understands that it is better for him not to be kicked out

However, his aggressive, abusive behaviour is harming your DC

You should put them first

However the people stating that the husband should be kicked out and that you are putting your husband before your child clearly live in a universe where they’ve never lived with an addict.

My grandfather was an alcoholic and I saw first hand the impact it had on my dad and his sister. My nan made excuse after excuse for him - he was "trying to cut down", he "was getting help", he was "going through a hard time" - there was always a reason why he couldn't stop and why she wouldn't leave.

She destroyed her relationship with both her children and neither attended her funeral. She failed to protect them from an unwell man - who, yes, was suffering from addiction, but who was also abusive and unpleasant as a result.

It's always sad when parents suffer from an addiction of some kind but that doesn't mean they're entitled to be unpleasant around their children. If he can't or won't get help, then OP has a responsibility to keep her kids safe - and if that means he finds somewhere else to go, then that's what needs to happen.

You can't put a grown man above your dependent children without it having some kind of impact.

fernandoanddenise, I think you've gone to the heart of the matter, difficult as it is.The home situation really needs addressed.Its very sad to imagine your child who has probably held it together for the day in school not being able to continue to function normally like the others and progress on to after school activities.Being a bit of a nutrition fanatic I'd be concerned about her using snacks to overcome her mood swings etc. You're in a difficult place and I wish you well.

slippery don’t be so ridiculous. This child’s home life is awful, and sounds very frightening for her. She’s acting that out. She can’t just ‘pack it in’.

Kassia - yes he is basically projecting. Every time I say something, he in some way puts it back on me. He just cannot say 'yes I am having problems etc' He will only say it if I force it. He can;t ever say I am sorry you are going through hell because of me. He just brings up all the things I do wrong in the relationship. He just will not own it. ONly if pushed will he admit.

I was up until 3am bawling last night as I feel so pained. I said I feel so alone. I said I am not having a great time and need you to support me as well. not just tell me you are trying. What about me?

Then he messaged today and tells me he is not exactly having a great time and maybe I should get a counsellor. Which I have anyway. But I said you do realise I am happy apart from this situation? Ie it is all you and not me. The alcohol has done such damage. He has not drunk in 5 days so he thinks he is trying and therefore everything should be ok. So he cant understand why I am in emotional pain about all of this. It is utterly unfair and draining. I feel lost.

He has all the personality flaws of an alcoholic.

I know devote atheists find it hard to join AA but really it does address these issues, not just the drinking. But it takes years.

This is an abusive relationship, OP. He may once have been a lovely man but he is anything but lovely now. Even if you didn't have any children I would say leave him.

Thanks all for the message.

Pointy - thanks for your message. So he hasn;t drunk for 5 days or so and he wonders why i am so upset still. I am just waiting for the next episode as it will happen.

So he is trying to get sober. But the pain in the process is quite unbearable. How long do I stick it out? He is patting himself on the back for this week no end. But I can't feel overjoyed. I just don't want to put children through all this.

I got really angry with him last week as I just can;t remain calm all the time. I just cannot remain calm all the time. I can't. What should I do?

Coyocan - what exactly about it is abusive? The way he is treating me.
He says I treat him badly, micromanaging his life. It all stems from him being depressed and not doing enough or being lazy with the children.