To change who I'm voting for based on one news story?

[ShouldIStayOrShouldIRun]

This one ->

www.itv.com/news/2019-11-27/jeremy-corbyn-says-uncensored-documents-show-nhs-is-part-of-toxic-post-brexit-trade-talks-with-us/

I had already decided to vote for the conservatives, mainly because I couldn't bring myself to vote for any of the others who seem hell bent on gleefully ripping up womens rights. I've always voted so abstaining/spoiling wasn't an option.

But after reading/watching the above I think I am going to switch to voting labour. We are a disabled family, and could never afford to pay for healthcare (and I doubt insurance would touch us with a barge pole).

I don't like Momentum/Corbyn really but I'd rather complain and fight for my right to a single sex ward than not be able to use one at all

Re: brexit I voted remain in the last referendum but to be honest just have fatigue about the whole thing, so I'm not basing my vote on any of that. (Though seems a second vote isn't that terrible an idea).

Just posting because I can't see anything on here about this yet and I've gone from feeling quietly confident that Conservatives would win to feeling nervous about it now. Anyone else?

Take note and learn from past mistakes

You are being disingenuous to suggest otherwise. It took 11 years of a conservative government to get the country back on track, and now it is all at risk again.

Numbers aren’t your strong point are they @Considermesometimes? We’ve had a Tory government for less than ten years, in which time borrowing has almost doubled.

Your insistence on denying the cause of the recession following a global financial crisis is embarrassing.

1970s lets think back....

Under Labour this was the reality:

We only had 3 days of work because we didn't have enough electricity due to black outs - most weeks we had two whole days with no electricity
We were bankrupt as a country
Hospitals were forced to work with candlelight and batteries
Schools were closed
People literally did starve in a proper sense
Jobs were scarce
People were striking all of the time because conditions were so dire with not even the basics
Inflation exploded and every day items became impossible to source or to buy

And also calls this 'brilliant'?????????????????????

It was called the "Winter of Discontent" in 1978-79 and it was horrendous for those of us that lived through it.

You vote for Corbyn you take us back to that in a nutshell.

Three day week and power cuts were under Heath’s leadership - just saying.

Corbyn has been quite frank about his desire to take us all back to the hellhole that was the 70's, and yet for some reason some people are refusing to believe him.

What is the old saying on here, when someone shows you who they are.....

I believe that they aren't selling the NHS outright but they've been slowly privatising provision. When I recently had an operation I was offered the option 1 NHS hospital appointment and two private. And I also think that they will definitely change the way we negotiate medicines prices with farmacetic companies and the way patents are kept. These companies are so powerful. UK is not this massive market with so many bargaing tools to keep US interests in check in a trade deal.

"45 Labour elected
47 Britain Bankrupt"

What are you talking about? In 1945 the UK was in astronomical debt to the US, after necessary borrowing to fight the 2nd World War.

Various Tory politicians have been very open in the past about their plans to privatise the nhs. It was hardly a secret

of course we young generation have lived under a labour government - what do you call Blair and Brown?

New Labour, Red Conservatives, Labour Lite.

The 90s was a time when you could barely slip a cigarette paper between the L and C parties!

JCs lot are more akin - or actually several large strides to the left of - the Labour of the 70s. That wretched experience is what so many of us remember and have no desire to return to.

Rubbish!

Here we are wiki link:

Labour government, 1974–1979
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Harold Wilson led the Government from 1974–1976 and was succeeded by James Callaghan.

Callaghan led the Government from 1976. He was defeated at the 1979 general election.
The Labour Party governed the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland from 1974 to 1979. During this period, Harold Wilson and James Callaghan were successively appointed as Prime Minister of the United Kingdom by Queen Elizabeth II. The end of the Callaghan ministry was presaged by the Winter of Discontent, a period of serious industrial discontent.
This was followed by the election of Conservative leader Margaret Thatcher in 1979.

Stop lying also

Echoing what @Justwantapeacefullife says - I have a chronic autoimmune illness, and rely on the NHS to stay alive. Just one of the medications I take is £5 a tablet privately, and I need at least 2 a day! I could literally not afford to live if we did not have the NHS (private insurance won’t cover me as it is a chronic illness) I hear horror stories from people in other countries, the US in particular, not being covered, not able to afford meds, and near death or dying as a result. I will be voting labour

I’m not going to tell you who to vote for. It’s your decision and you have to be comfortable with the decision you make. I myself haven’t yet decided who to vote for (although I was never convinced by Labour and won’t be voting for Corbyns ‘get us into more debt’ plans).

But I wouldn’t make a decision based on one news story that isn’t even factually true.

The document involved has not stated anywhere that the Tories are going to sell off the NHS. Corbyn has basically taken elements of that document and twisted it for his own agenda. He’s never quoted directly from it.

Yes it was made available to the media for all to read, but not before Corbyn put his own spin on it and planted the seeds of doubt.

My advice? Look at your local candidates and what they’re saying they’ll do for your community and what your key priorities are. If you feel Labour is right for you then vote Labour. If you’re not convinced then look at the other options.

You have said the 1970s was brilliant also how can anyone seriously think of you as credible now?

It was the bleakest decade in our history after the world wars, and you are just about to vote to go there all over again!!

Jesus Christ.

It is moments like this when you realise our schools have failed our country massively, particularly when it comes to remembering history and the ACTUAL facts.

Ami I too have that, I am assuming you are referring to biologics? I will be voting for the conservatives I have now decided, because I don't think labour will be able to fund or afford my medication when they crash the economy. My treatment cost 12,000 a year and there is no way I could afford it, so I need a strong government that can be trusted to provide this for me.

Corbyn is a very scary prospect.

When I was in New York recently I went to buy a pack of ibuprofen, it was 8 dollars! Needless to say I put up with my knee pain. It's so obvious what the Tories plan to do with the NHS and Trump will be looking for the best possible deal for the US in his election year. I'm definitely voting Labour, I'm too scared not to!

The Tory party borrows the most.

'The Tories have borrowed 67.5% of UK national debt since 1946.'

'..In that time according to the House of Commons Library net total government borrowing has been £1,618 billion: £155 billion of borrowing predated that period, most paying for WW2.

Of that sum 67.5%, or £1.092 billion was borrowed by the Tories. 32.5% or £526 billion was borrowed by Labour.

The Tories have been in office for longer, of course. Restated per year the Tories have borrowed £24.3 billion a year on average in historic prices.

Labour has borrowed £18.8 billion a year on average.

Labour repaid debt in 7 years. The Tories in just 4.

In current prices Labour has borrowed approximately £28 billion a year and the Tories £33.6 billion.

The Tories are always the party that borrows most.

www.taxresearch.org.uk/Blog/2019/11/13/the-tories-have-borrowed-67-5-of-uk-national-debt-since-1946/

YANBU.

YANBU if you value our nhs you should vote labour, or just not conservative put it that way. Things are going to get even uglier and Boris Johnson should not be trusted

My local candidates are shite
This is the very first time that I really do not know what to do .
Ive had to put sentiment aside and still Im not sure.
I really am.thinking of the future of all children.
Most of my colleagues feel this way .My son is in university wanting to vote his unsure of what to do.
My daughter on the other hand is sticking to her normal not really thinking deeply .

*You have said the 1970s was brilliant also how can anyone seriously think of you as credible now?

It was the bleakest decade in our history after the world wars, and you are just about to vote to go there all over again!!

Jesus Christ.

It is moments like this when you realise our schools have failed our country massively, particularly when it comes to remembering history and the ACTUAL facts*

How would the grammar school I attended improve my memory? I was 17 at the beginning of the 70s, my son was born in 75, we had the longest hottest summer ever recorded in 76 - of course I remember it as brilliant.

Good thing my parents can’t hear you describe it as the bleakest period since the war. They lived through both and they were doing nicely throughout the 70s too.

Who do you think you’re fooling with all this melodrama and hyperbole? We’re going to find out what bleak really means if Johnson gets his way.

I'm from a lifelong Labour background and have never voted Tory. My husband has cancer and we are hugely grateful to the NHS.
However, I cannot stomach Corbyn for the anti-Semitism and his plans on the economy, which I am afraid will wreck it. Also on Brexit, he wants to leave but won't admit it, while I am a remainer.
I think Boris is awful but I just don't think it's accurate to paint the Tories as trying to dismantle the NHS even if only because they know it would work against them on their own self-interested terms. I think it's scaremongering to suggest things like women will be charged for skin to skin after having a baby. The Tories know full well that there are very few people in the country able to afford private healthcare and that attacking the NHS will be a huge vote loser - as this thread proves. That's why I don't believe they are stupid enough to try it. And why Boris is being filmed in every hospital he can find, to stress they are not going to sell off the NHS. For what it's worth they are promising funding of £33.9bn for the NHS by 2023-24. As I understand it, the papers Corbyn brandishes are not about selling off the NHS but about US drug pricing. I check out quite a bit of stuff on the FullFact website which seems to be quite objective. It says the claims about this are quite extreme. fullfact.org/health/500-million-nhs-drug-prices/
I haven't made up my mind who to vote for this time, because it is such an awful choice, probably Lib Dem. YANBU for making up your mind on any basis you choose, that's democracy, but- and this will obviously be an unpopular view on the thread - these particular claims by Corbyn on the NHS
would not make me personally vote Labour, I don't think they hold water.

Trixie Mixie wrote " I cannot stomach Corbyn for the anti-Semitism"

'A list of fifty occasions on which Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn stood with Jewish people in the UK and other countries has been published by his supporters.
Corbyn has already received extensive support from Orthodox Jewish leaders. Thirty-four leading rabbis signed a letter praising Labour’s “respected leader” and describing attacks on him as “irresponsible”. The letter was attacked as a fake by Corbyn’s critics, who were later forced to withdraw the claim when evidence was revealed by the SKWAWKBOX that they were aware of its authenticity.
A letter by Jewish citizens published by the Sunday Times was similarly attacked.

The list... lays out some of Corbyn’s recorded solidarity with Jewish people over a period of more than four decades:

Corbyn organised the Apr. 1977 defence of Jewish populated Wood Green from a Neo-Nazi march

EDM3933 7 Nov. 1990: Corbyn signs motion condemning the rise of antisemitism

EDM634, 11 Apr. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion condemning David Irving for being a Holocaust Denier

EDM1124, 6 Nov. 2000: Jeremy Corbyn praised the ‘British Schindler’, Bill Barazetti, for his WW2 kindertransport

EDM742, 28 Jan. 2002: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion praising football clubs for commemorating Holocaust Day

EDM1233 30 Apr. 2002: Corbyn was a primary sponsor on a motion condemning antisemitism

11 May 2002: Jeremy led a clean up of Finsbury Park Synagogue after an anti-Semitic attack

EDM1691, 23 July 2002: Corbyn condemned attacks on a synagogue in Swansea

EDM123 26 Nov. 2003: Corbyn officially condemns attacks on 2 Istanbul synagogues
EDM298, 16 Dec. 2003: Jeremy Corbyn signs motion commemorating International Holocaust Day
2004: Jeremy condemned news that anti-Semitic hate crimes had risen for yet another year
EDM461, 21 Jan. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned the French government’s moves to ban the Jewish Kippa in French Schools
EDM717, 26 Feb. 2004: Jeremy signed a motion praising Simon Wiesenthal for bringing Nazi perpetrators of the Holocaust to justice
EDM1613, 8 Sept. 2004: Corbyn co-sponsored a bill expressing fears for the future of the United Synagogue Pension Scheme
EDM1699, 11 Oct. 2004: Jeremy Corbyn condemned arbitrary attacks on civilians in Israel and Palestine
EDM482, 12 Jan. 2005: Jeremy Corbyn signs a motion commemorating International Holocaust Day

Continues on the Link
www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/fifty-times-jeremy-corbyn-stood-with-jewish-people/

Black people are criminals, Muslim are terrorists, single mothers are incompetent these are the beliefs Boris openly verbalised. The lies he's been caught saying are too many to many to list. So Y definitely NBU. Maybe a bit for considering voting for him. He says the NHS is not for sale. Who trusts him to be telling the truth!?

If the NHS is important to you, I must say I'm a bit surprised you didn't take an interest over the last nine years.

You have heard of Jeremy Hunt?

@Nearly47
Quite. Boris will do well out of selling off the NHS. Poorer and unhealthier people will die. What do you think he cares about?