In ending a friendship for this?

[hadromum]

DH, DS and I went to a friends house last night. They have kids too.

When we went to leave the husband picked up ds (6) and tossed him around a bit to say goodbye. He didn't mean it in an unkind way but DS got upset.

I took ds in to another room to give him a cuddle, husband came in to say 'sorry' to ds but told him he needed to toughen up/man up and stop being such a baby.

He's upset ds before, made the odd comment about him being spoilt and soft. We'd not seen them for a few months the last time it happened. Clearly seeing them last night was a huge error of judgment on my part.

When he's made comments before dh and I have never said anything. He's a very domineering man. He shouts his wife and kids down constantly. He hits his kids for misbehaving. His daughter once snuck downstairs when she was meant to be in bed and he made her hold her hands out and hit them as hard as he could. In front of us. She started crying and he did it again.

Last night I'd had enough. I told him ds didn't need to man up and toughen up, he's a just turned 6 little boy. That he needed to back off and I didn't want him saying things like that anymore. He was very drunk if that makes any difference.

He started yelling at me (dh had taken ds out) and I told him he was just a bully. If people didn't agree with him he just scares them in to being quiet. And I was done with it.

So then he put his hand on my face and pushed me pretty hard and I stumbled back. I'm very ashamed to say that at that point I lost my temper completely and yelled at him. So I don't drip feed later- I've been in an abusive relationship before and rightly or wrongly that's probably why I lost my temper and yelled at him. It was absolute shock of someone (almost worse in a way as it was a friend) being psychical.

We've continued to be around them as we live close together in a remote community so are around them almost daily. There's no escaping it. And I'm really good friends with his wife.

Am I over reacting in being so upset?

And to just want to not socialise with them ever again?

He texted Dh later just 'sorry'. Typical that the misogynist felt the need to say sorry to dh and not me. I've not heard from him or his wife, I'm pretty shocked I've not had an apology from her today, not that it's her that should be apologising but if dh had done something like that I'd be reaching out. I'm guessing she's probably siding with him.

Obviously dh thinks it was terrible but he doesn't understand why I'm so upset. I'm being silly probably but it's really shaken me up. I'm in my 40s. I'm a Mum. Obviously that doesn't mean these things should happen any less to anyone but I thought those kinds of toxic and unpleasant situations were a thing of the past.

You need to report his assault on you to the police and his assault on his daughter to social services and/or the police. By doing that you are getting on record that he is abusive which will help your friend. Report then stay the hell away.

If they’re always together and as you said earlier she can never see you alone then realistically, what support do you think you’ve been to her? That’s not a criticism btw but you seem to be telling yourself that somehow being friends with this couple is doing something positive for her. It’s not.

The best thing you could do to support her and her children would be to report him for assault and alert the school to the behaviours you’ve witnessed. Not that she’ll thank you for that!

To just carry on socialising with them as a couple would mean brushing this incident under the carpet and that would make you complicit in minimising his behaviour. Would you want your own dc to see you and his dad do that?

My now ex friend had a volitile dh. Their ds used to wet himself when he shouted at him - usually pinned to a wall age 7+.
My dc were never around him once I had clicked he was abusive.
I even reported him to a Dog charity and had their ddog removed. I hung on to the friendship in the hope of being there for her. He did move out but she continued to dance to his tune. I accepted I could do no more as tbh it was affecting my mh.
Sadly we haven't been friends for 4 years now. You have to put your family first op. But I wouldn't bank on your dh dumping the bastard.
Which would make me question my own relationship...

Social services won't do a thing. I have friends that work for them. They're so overstretched and underfunded. They're not even taking up cases of terrible abuse. Two of my friends have left because they just can't cope with the job anymore.

YANBU, I wouldn't speak to them ever again. Good for you for standing up to the vile bully!

Absolutely report him to the Police for assaulting you, also let them know you have domestic violence concerns about how he treats his wife and children too and that he has access to weapons and gets drunk.

I would do this primarily for the rest of the family, his wife and children need to be on the radar of child protection services and law enforcement.

Appalling man.

Well you don't know until you try do you. I think you owe it to the child to report. If SS don't do anything then that's not on you.

I would be inclined to report to the police (without attempting to press charges) because I would lay money on him being physically abusive to his wife, and anything that the police have that allows them to see a pattern of abuse will help her if she ever seeks help before he kills her

If he is hitting his children as hard as he can IN FRONT OF GUESTS, hitting female guests under his own roof for calling him out on his rough carryon, and his wife is not allowed to speak to people without his supervision, and his belligerent behaviour has alienated him from their entire community, it's not a huge leap to "he's beating her and she is scared shitless of him", hence the lack of communication after what happened - she is embarrassed as well as frightened.

I know you can't go to the police and say "I think my friend's husband is an abuser" but you can report what happened to you factually and ask them to record it (or however it is done in the US or wherever you are).

The best thing you could do to support her and her children would be to report him for assault and alert the school to the behaviours you’ve witnessed.

That's a good point about telling the school. Do your kids go together?

You absolutely need to go to the police, report both last night and his abuse of his daughter.

So you saw him beating his children and did absolutely nothing? Not only that, but you're continued to socialize with them and only now contemplating ending the 'friendship' because he tossed around YOUR son. But seeing him hitting his small children didn't bother you enough. Just wtf... Please share his details, so people can report him and help those poor children (and his wife).

Also, your husband is a coward. Some bully is annoying his son, then assaulting his wife, and he does nothing at all? Awful, how can you respect him?

This needs to be reported. Maybe it will help his wife realise his behaviour is no longer acceptable and herself & her children aren’t safe with him

Which country are you in?

Can you and your husband safely move to somewhere where you won't be seeing this family? I'm having a British reaction to reading he has access to guns and thinking you're better off well away from them.

Is hitting children culturally typical where you are? If not/if there are some culturally accepted limits to it, it might be worth reporting the incident with the daughter to their school.

What's domestic abuse support like? Are there equivalents of women's aid who might be able to help you find a way to help her? If they're likely to be supportive rather than alert him to the allegation and you know who they are, you could try writing to their GP to explain you suspect she's being abused.

You can probably safely report his assaulting you to the police, unless you're somewhere where the home owner might be taken at his word vs a visitor / very patriarchal / the police force is known to be corrupt.

You might start with a criminal lawyer from a couple of towns away if you're really unsure as to how the local police might react.

Definitely tell your own child's school what happened in case he tries to take it further eg. offering to coach rugby or some other macho sport to toughen him up [I know that rugby for little ones is non-contact - thinking about the concept rather than the specific of that sport]

I think the only justification for continuing to socialise with them would be on a very temporary basis whilst you make arrangements to move house, so they don't notice your reduced contact until you've disappeared from their social circles. He sounds dangerous to me.

Shocking! This man assaulted you and your son. The picking up your son was bad enough, but he actually assaulted you. It doesn't matter if he was drunk or not, you can't risk being in that situation again., so don't have anything more to do with him.

And what the h**l was your DH doing while this was happening? Standing around, giggling? Shrugging this off? My DH would have yelled (at least).

If it were me, and in the UK, I would have called the police. And I would be calling SS. They may be overworked, but you should NOT let this go. This man needs to be locked up, far, far, away from his vulnerable children.

Otherwise, you can be there for your friend when she hits rock bottom. And she will.

If you are in the US (gun reference), call police and CPS.

YANBU Cut Contact 💐
This will never right itself - he has gone too far, drunk or not.

The man sounds vile, you are absolutely right to be concerned and in your place I'd end the 'friendship'. I'm surprised his wife puts up with it but you've said he is intimidating.

I remember a while back a thread in which a poster said a man of her acquaintance 'pushed' her in much the same way as you were pushed. I'm not saying it was you, I think the circumstances were different but it seems to be something that happens with some people; he should not have done that.

Bin 'im! 'Friends' like that you can do without. However make sure the wife knows you are there for her.

He's a very domineering man. He shouts his wife and kids down constantly. He hits his kids for misbehaving. His daughter once snuck downstairs when she was meant to be in bed and he made her hold her hands out and hit them as hard as he could. In front of us.

Two different but connected issues here:

1. You should have reported this man to the NSPCC when you first saw this physical and verbal abuse of his wife and children. You can still do this now, they must be living in fear of his reaction all the time, poor things.
2. You are well within your rights (indeed should) report this man to the police for his assault of you. You did nothing wrong (besides not alerting the authorities earlier), you were defending your son and he reacted violently.

With you reporting an assault against you, plus accusations of domestic and child abuse, there's a good chance something will stick.

PS: Just re-read what you said about the man and wife always being together and you can't even contact her. There must be a subtle way of letting her know that you are still her friend. She is in a dangerous position living with a man with guns.

Good luck to you, please let us know of any developments; I have a feeling you won't hear from either for a while but, one day, he will be unwell and she will go out shopping or something like, without him and may contact you.

You sound like a good friend to have but you and your family must come first.

He parents and disciplines his children differently to you and that's fine.
What's not okay is to threaten or shove or in any means intimidate his guests.
I would go NC with him and expect his wife to visit you without him.
His behaviour isn't something she should be in control of but at the very least, she should be embarrassed.
If she is proud of the way he treated you - I would cut her off.

Jesus christ op, protect the innocent child he is abusing and report the bastard!

also what fucking planet is your husband on? My DH is the least aggressive person i know, but if that was me and my son this vile man had assaulted my DH would have lost his shit!

you yelled? VERY restrained. Id have killed him for laying hands on me

Very glad you stoodupto him, do not ever go back there for your son's sake

makes my blood boil people like this

Hi Op, sadly a very similar thing happened to me a month ago when I was hit and then verbally abused by my friends husband (he was drunk), at a party. I posted on here for advice, which was so helpful.

I did report the incident to the police. They have made a record but asked them not to approach him as I did not want to make trouble for my friend. The police were excellent and very supportive. I have told friend and her husband I will not put myself in a social situation with him again as a value my safety more than his friendship. He obviously took this badly and my friendship with her has cooled substainally. I cannot accept his behaviour and she knows that, but I will still be there for her.

Did your friend witness her husband's assault on you?

@Savingshoes what was described was not different parenting or discipline of children. It was a physical assault on his daughter.