AIBU to tell my lodger he needs to go home for Christmas?

[CupOfTeaAndSixBiscuits]

I have a lodger who has depression (recently started to receive care from the CMHT and GP) and he made a suicide attempt relatively recently. I have to encourage him to take his pills and not take his own life, in a nutshell. He's also got Asperger's, which can affect his understanding of some things, but he's still pretty social.

We actually get on quite well, and have become friends. It's just that I worry and have to keep an eye on him.

Since he moved out of the local family home in the spring, he literally hasn't visited once (though he has seen them, they come to us). They're not especially supportive with MH things, but they do care about him. He's talking about not going home for Christmas and just staying in the house by himself, which I don't think will be good for him. I'll be staying with my family in another city.

I've told him that he needs to go home for Christmas, essentially so that I don't have to worry that I'll come home to a corpse about him. He's resisting this. There's no written lodger agreement, and I have no actual way of ensuring he does go home.

Am I being unreasonable? Part of me says I am because he'll still be paying to be there just like I am, and part of me says I'm not because it's for his own good!

I might phone Mind and ask for advice. Also the CMHT. I would say that I am just renting this guy a room and that I am not a friend or a carer.

I think it's very easy for us here to minimise the awfulness of coming home to find a dead body. Would you ever be able to feel the same way about your home? When you rent a room to someone, you don't expect to have to face this.

Poor you, OP. This is one of those horrible life lessons that nothing can prepare you for. Lodgers aren't friends and you need a tenancy agreement to protect you both. You have rights as well as him. Good luck.

Very very difficult call this. I understand a lot of posters positions about him being an adult, free to make own choices etc. However, he is unstable and vulnerable and you cannot keep him safe or be expected to keep him safe as a landlady....you do sound v kind and caring, bless you! I agree with @Genevieva. I think be firm and kind and given his history hold firm and say he be with family; they are probably protective factors that would prevent him from carrying out a suicide attempt. He will be at risk alone. If he did take his life in your home, would that alter your feelings about your home? It would for me, I'm afraid I'd want to sell up and move on...this is your home too, your refuge. I'd offer to refund the rent for the period and be firm but kind about this one, of course only with the knowledge that he absolutely would have a bed and you're not putting him onto the streets!!!!!

He shouldn't have to live his life based on your fears.

If his family aren't supportive, then it may not be the best place for him. People don't just suffer poor mental health over Christmas because they are alone.

I think you've blurred the boundaries and have stopped viewing him as another adult, who has autonomy and just shares a house with you.

There is a fine line between care and control and I think you've stepped over it.

Fortunately, nobody's suggested that you "kick him out"

Get him out and change the locks.

I'm afraid they did.

You need to talk to him.

I have some ASD tendancies and the big family Christmas is my idea of hell.

I don't actually celebrate Xmas but in the past when I did I chose to be alone for a number of years.

It might be that he is looking forward to time alone.

I do think you (both) need to make a plan though for if he does feel down.

@tinkobell How can she enforce your idea that he goes to his parents? Is she going to lock him out?

She cannot force him. He is not a child. His parents may be a source of stress- just consider for a moment how many people without MH issues hate being with their parents at Christmas.

She is not his mum but is behaving like one.
The person who ought to be involved is his mum and dad. They will know surely he is on his own? It's up to them to make plans to see him or leave him alone- whatever he chooses.

This whole idea that he will commit suicide if he doesn't have the OP at home with him every day is crazy. He may find Christmas alone absolutely fine! Not everyone wants to socialise.

Gosh this is hard OP

I think it is tricky territory you being his landlady as well as his friend.

i would, in the long term, try to untangle that, somehow.

I had a flatmate who committed suicide, she was depressed and suicidal and once, when I had not seen her for a whole day, I checked her bedroom, and she was unconscious. I called an ambulance.

She ended up being sectioned, and sadly ended up killing herself in a suicide pact with someone else on her ward. It was most awful.

Later, much later, her brother and parents came to talk to me, to apologise for leaving it all up to me.

only with hindsight did I get angry at them using me like her unpaid carer (we lived together for 2 years, I was always worried about her, checking up on her, but also not much good as I was young and busy living my own life), an uncomfortable combination of guilt and anger. Also, ultimately I could not help her.

Anyway, you have to decide if you are going to be his de facto carer. And I would advice against that. As long as you are looking after him, his family won't.... and it is a massive responsibility

It's hard, I hope you find a solution.

I'm afraid they did

I know now, SpiderCharlotte ... see my response to CustardySergeant at 13.18

I agree with @Seaweed42 , you sound like a good person doing your best.

Ignore the people laying into you, OP, you're in an impossible situation. As you said, you were unaware of his problems when you agreed to him becoming your lodger and of course you've ended up looking out for him because you're a nice person.

Re. His family. I have a feeling that they know full well about his problems and were more than happy for him to move out and let someone else take responsibility, which is totally unfair.

As he doesn't want you to mention Christmas to his family, I would let his medical professionals know that you're concerned about his welfare over Christmas and leave it at that. Perhaps you can then address his lodging with you in the New Year and suggest that he looks for somewhere else (unless things are improving).

I actually feel quite angry on your behalf, OP, you've almost been tricked into a caring role.

@TheHumansAreDefinitelyDead

I think the OP is in a similar position, OP, and it's totally unfair.

@ Ponoka7

Have you ever lived with a mentally unstable, suicidal person? I've lived with a suicidal parent and it's THEM who's controlling the situation, not you. They can make you afraid to leave them. Don't put blame on the OP who had no idea that her lodger had problems.

I'll be staying with my family in another city

Just thinking ... since he's become "a friend", is what he's actually after an invitation to join your family instead at Christmas?

Very tough, as others have said, but as they've also said, no, you can't force your lodger not to stay in the home he is paying for just because (leaving aside the MH issues) it doesn't sit well with you.
In the nicest possible way, which isn't going to sound nice at all, you've rather brought this on yourself by crossing the lodger/tenant lines (and then some) Whilst it was undoubtedly done out of kindness, it's got you into a bit of a mess.

@CupOfTeaAndSixBiscuits

Lodgers are not "tenants". They do have rights but much, much fewer. I would really suggest that - in addition to the wonderful caring practical advice given here you should research your [mutual] rights and obligations.

@CupOfTeaAndSixBiscuits

much, much = many, many

[Grammar police]

It is extremely difficult to be put in the position of default carer for a friend or housemate. If you have any kind of professional background in mental health care, you might have a better idea of what to do and how to deal with the person's issues (but then again, if you are a competent MH professional, you would probably have good enough boundaries not to end up in a situation like this in the first place.)
It's a very common and profoundly stupid and dangerous idea that all a troubled person with MH issues needs is 'more kindness'. Kindness does not cure mental illness - though kindness can support a person's recovery while they are having treatment, it is not a replacement for proper treatment.

At the moment OP has no rights to her lodger's medical information, because she is not a family member or partner, nor an official carer. She can't know quite what she's dealing with - and if this ends up impacting on her finances (either because the lodger's behaviour causes property damage or because she has to take time off work to look after him) she won't get anything like carer's allowance.

Sympathies to you, OP. In your position I would be inclined to steer the lodger towards professional support and try to keep a polite distance, but I appreciate that it's complicated by the fact that you consider him a friend as well as a lodger. Try to seek out some support and advice for yourself - perhaps from one of the MH charities?

Before you do anything else OP please put a proper agreement in place between you and your lodger. make sure your mortgage and home insurance know that you have a lodger and please get all of this done and above board asap. You are entering into a number of rights and responsibilities with your eyes shut.

I’ve never seen a vote so evenly spread!

I voted YABU as you can’t force another adult to do anything they don’t want to do. He’s paid the rent on his new home and is entitled to spend Christmas there if he wants to.

However, YANBU to be concerned about him. I would be too. I am also concerned that you are becoming overinvolved in his life. You need to maintain healthy boundaries for the sake of your own wellbeing. Don’t get trapped into feeling responsible for him.

OP there is only one thing you can do in this situation and that is to regretfully give him his notice.

I don't know how you've managed to become entangled like this - landlady, carer, mental health nurse, friend, mother - but the blurred boundaries are unhealthy and inappropriate.

It's all completely wrong. And not helpful for him.

The only thing you can do is distance yourself.

If you have any kind of professional background in mental health care, you might have a better idea of what to do and how to deal with the person's issues (but then again, if you are a competent MH professional, you would probably have good enough boundaries not to end up in a situation like this in the first place.)

No (sensible) MH professional would have got themselves into this situation.

I think it's very easy for us here to minimise the awfulness of coming home to find a dead body. Would you ever be able to feel the same way about your home? When you rent a room to someone, you don't expect to have to face this.

I don't think anyone is suggesting for a moment that coming home to find her lodger/friend's dead body wouldn't be awful. But trying to force him to go leave his home and stay with his family for Christmas doesn't actually mitigate against that risk does it? OP could come from from work one day to find him dead. She could go shopping and come home to find him dead. She could go to bed and find him dead in his room the next morning. If he's determined to end his life (which we don't actually know for a fact that he is) then he'll find a way to do so regardless of where he is and who else is there unfortunately.
The whole Christmas thing is a red herring. OP needs to decide whether she can cope with the responsibility of living with someone she is scared to leave alone.

This man MAY never attempt suicide again.
Are some posters really suggesting that because he has attempted this, he should NEVER be left alone for the rest of his life?
At what point will it be OK for him to spend Christmas as he chooses?
DH worked in a psychiatric hospital for a number of years and while there, they had more than 1 disturbed, troubled patient take their own life while on the premises.
If a whole team of mental health professionals, with 24/7 staffing in place cannot stop this from happening on occasions, what chance does a lay landlady have?
The fact that he is now under the care of the CMHT and his GP is aware of the issues is a good thing.
These professionals should be his go to people when he is struggling mentally.
Having said that, having a good friend is helpful.
Continue to be his friend OP - you sound very kind - but don't become his emotional dustbin!

Lodgers do not get the same rights as tenants. This man is a lodger, not a tenant. They have pretty much no rights, and can technically be told to leave with no notice (although most people wouldn’t do this, I hope!).

What a load of crap. I’ve been a lodger twice and had formal tenancy agreements in both - they can’t just kick you out and when my first lodger asked me to leave because her partner was moving in with her I had three months notice as agreed. No rights my arse.

YABU, because as someone with a history of mental health problems (which I now manage much better), I would have found it MUCH more stressful to spend Christmas with my family than to spend it alone. It all depends on what one's family is like. I'm now a uni lecturer and some of my students come from quite troubled families -- as a result some of them find that staying away from their families at holidays is actually beneficial for their own mental health. Not all families are nurturing. Even now I only visit mine when I'm in quite a strong mental place, so to speak (I wouldn't visit them when I'm feeling vulnerable). So it really should be your lodger's decision, not yours. Don't assume you know what's best for him.

That said, whether you can cope with the mental load of having such a vulnerable lodger in your house is another question. Your first priority should be self-care, because as others have said, you're not his carer and it's his responsibility to seek support for himself! Good luck.

I think YANBU to not want a suicidal lodger in your home over Christmas when you’re elsewhere. He’s a lodger living in your home, not someone renting a separate place off you so you have much more right to insist on things that don’t leave you vulnerable, including things that don’t leave you vulnerable to finding a corpse in your home when you come back from Christmas. You also have the issue of you being his friend and not wanting to see him commit suicide anywhere at all. So I think ethically, your covered when it comes to insisting he doesn’t spend the holiday alone in your home.

The question, as the first response said, is how you can do that.

He’s a lodger so legally you could insist by kicking him out before you leave and telling him you’re able to rent the room again after Christmas. But I think that could seem like a betrayal to him, so last resort. I would probably just be really insistent and if you have a relationship with the family that visits him, talk to them a bit about it too.

I hope you find a way to make it work, OP, and that your lodger finds his way back to a better place soon.