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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be pissed off with 'the man should pay' types?

362 replies

wimbmumma · 11/11/2019 19:52

I just find it so outdated! The only time I've ever let the man pay was, coincidentally, on my first date with my ex husband. Doesn't even cross most of me and my friends' minds that you should split it (if it is a dinner date that is) but A LOT of the schoolmums feel very differently, as they made abundantly clear at a coffee morning... so AIBU to find them a bit annoying and utterly stuck in the 19th century

OP posts:
Minikievs · 12/11/2019 09:08

When I started dating my DP I offered to split but he insisted on paying. I don’t want to be martyr so I agreed, the next date, I paid.
We took it in turns until we were comfortable enough to do it a bit more on an as and when basis. Eg I paid for all the kids to have a takeaway while he was out, the next day he took all the kids out and bought them lunch.

I have friends that are horrified at this and think the man should pay for everything, and I’m a fool for paying my way

Minikievs · 12/11/2019 09:09

@XXXXXX42 Exactly this!

PanGalaticGargleBlaster · 12/11/2019 09:23

XXXXXX42

and to offer to carry a heavy bag.

Do you take a bag with a few bricks or anvil in it on dates to test the manners of the man you are with? Wink

moominmammy · 12/11/2019 10:25

I never go anywhere involving payment, without at least being able to pay for myself. It's nice if a man offers to pay on a date, it's also nice if a friend offers to pay for lunch. I would expect to return the favour in both cases though.

My ex was very odd about "allowing " me to pay, despite earning the same as me. I'd have to pay the bill when he went to the loo or he'd have a big strop!

My DH earns double my salary, he happily accepted me taking him for dinner for his birthday, as he knows I don't spend what I can't afford and I like to treat him too.

Aridane · 12/11/2019 10:41

Went out at the weekend with new guy. He paid for our brunch, I paid for tea and cake later. It broadly adds up equal

Just how expensive was that tea and cake? (Cream tea at the Ritz?)

PurpleDaisies · 12/11/2019 10:44

I do, however, expect guys to open doors for me (in a subtle way) and to offer to carry a heavy bag. It’s old fashioned manners that my Dad, exH, exFIL, colleagues etc. Display.

Why? Can’t you open a door or carry a bag? Do your ovaries get in the way?

DisorganisedOrganiser · 12/11/2019 10:47

She has explained in her post that it is good manners to open the door for a woman. I would be appalled if a man didn’t offer to open the door for me (assuming no physical reason why he couldn’t etc.).

FishCanFly · 12/11/2019 10:51

Depends how old you are. If both schoolkids/students, then of course its unfair to expect the guy's parents to fund your nights out.
Otherwise, the one who invites - expects to pay. Assuming you're both adults with own income. If a man invites a woman on a date - and then refuses to buy her a drink or pay for a pizza - it is pathetic.

Lovesgood · 12/11/2019 10:53

This is the one somewhat good thing about the massive gender inequality that is going on (women always get the shitty end of the stick) and you moan about it? Nah, the guy pays. Im worth that.

littlehappyhippo · 12/11/2019 10:59

Thank you @HelenaDove

@AhNowTed stop making up your own version of events to try and win your (lame) argument. As Helena said, I never said that my DH was like this, (lazy and housework shy.)

You're deluded if you actually think that some men aren't like what I described - wanting equality, and for women to always pay their way - but never lifting a finger in the house, or helping with the kids. As I said, wanting equality when it suits THEM.

The relationships board - on here AND on other forums is littered with posts from women who have had kids with a man who earns much more than them, but still makes her pay half towards everything because ya know EQUALITY ! Hmm

But he does fuckall to help with the childcare or chores or general running of the home.. He just gets in from work, and sits his arse in front of the playstation or TV, or nods off in the chair. In some cases, the woman works as well. But she has way less income than him, because she has had her job/career/earning power affected by having children.

His surplus money is usually taken by his expensive and time-consuming hobbies.

I suppose she shouldn't have had kids with him eh? Probably her who wanted them and not him. Should have worked harder at school to get better educated to she could get a better job? Some clown always comes up with one of these fucking gems. Hmm

No, my DH ISN'T like this, and I most certainly wouldn't be with a man who WAS like this, but you go on making up your own version of events up to suit your argument if 'making stuff up' is all you've got. Wink

@HelenaDove

Splitting the bill is no guarantee that a man believes in equality.

Definitely not. Indeed, as I said, a man who believes women should pay their way, ALWAYS, are way more likely to be selfish and self-serving, and never give an inch. And he will most certainly be a man who will expect his lower earning wife/partner to chip in 50% for everything when they live together and have kids, but will NOT chip in 50% when it comes to housework and childcare.

IMO, any man who always wants everything 50/50 from the first date, is someone to be avoided, because he will NOT want to share the housework and childcare 50/50, and he is way more likely to be selfish and grabby. Be warned!!!

@Bubs101

I agree its outdated to expect the man to pay all the time. But with they way society is geared towards women and women roles i'll be damned if I'm working full time, doing the lions share of housework and childcare and then being told to 'split the bill because equality'. Because lets be honest so many studies have repeatedly said women do most of the unpaid labour in the home, no matter how much you bleat on about your DH doing 50/50 thats not the reality for most women.

Excellent post! ^

I am ignoring the clearly sexist posts on here from a couple of posters who are clearly men. No woman would post such damning remarks about women.

I am also hiding this thread and switching off notifications, because I have said all I can say now, and some comments on here are really fucking pissing me off.

PurpleDaisies · 12/11/2019 11:04

She has explained in her post that it is good manners to open the door for a woman
Why though? Just because something has historically been considered good manners, doesn’t mean that in modern society it should persist. I would open the door for anyone regardless of their gender. Carrying on with this chivalry does women no favours at all and continues the idea that we are weak and need looking after.

PurpleDaisies · 12/11/2019 11:09

IMO, any man who always wants everything 50/50 from the first date, is someone to be avoided, because he will NOT want to share the housework and childcare 50/50, and he is way more likely to be selfish and grabby. Be warned!!!

The bill doesn’t need to be split 50:50. Women should expect to pay for what they’ve had. Nothing to do with what the man wants. I can’t see how anyone has a problem with that. When I go out with my friends, I don’t expect them to pay for my dinner.

In my experience, men who “insist” on paying/holding doors etc are most likely to be traditionally minded dinosaurs who expect their women to cook, clean and behave like 1950s housewives.

bgmama · 12/11/2019 11:10

But with they way society is geared towards women and women roles i'll be damned if I'm working full time, doing the lions share of housework and childcare and then being told to 'split the bill because equality'. Because lets be honest so many studies have repeatedly said women do most of the unpaid labour in the home, no matter how much you bleat on about your DH doing 50/50 thats not the reality for most women.
So you believe that an occasional free drink or meal can make up for working full time and doing the lion's share of housework and childcare? Have you considered that there is another way ie. paying for your drinks and food yourself and only doing half of the housework and childcare? After all, this is what feminism is all about.

I am ignoring the clearly sexist posts on here I don't think I have seen any on this thread unless you consider "women should pay their own way" sexist.

bgmama · 12/11/2019 11:11

Carrying on with this chivalry does women no favours at all and continues the idea that we are weak and need looking after. Oh god yes, I can't believe this needs pointing out!

AryaStarkWolf · 12/11/2019 11:12

Why though? Just because something has historically been considered good manners, doesn’t mean that in modern society it should persist. I would open the door for anyone regardless of their gender. Carrying on with this chivalry does women no favours at all and continues the idea that we are weak and need looking after.

Totally agree

Women getting precious about being treated like a princess and wanting the man to pay for everything annoy the fuck out of me. I much prefer to pay my own way

Oh and I wouldn't put up with a husband thinking I'm his servant either, luckily I married a responsible adult though

HPT9000 · 12/11/2019 12:04

Its good manners to hold a door open for anyone. Holding a door open for someone because you are male and they are female is a bit weird imo (are females incapable of opening a door?) and if the male insisted on holding doors open for women but not men would suggest to me that the male in question has quite outdated views on what equality between the sexes looks like.

Whattodoabout · 12/11/2019 12:07

I always offered to pay but never experienced a man accepting. Some guys wouldn’t even let me pay on second and third dates tbh, I distinctly remember booking tickets for something once and having the guy slip the money for it into my bag when I turned away...

I think there’s a lot of macho pride in it for guys, not sure why.

matcatwomanheresheis · 12/11/2019 12:14

People always get on some kind of rigid moral high ground about this in MN, but why should it bother you what other people do on their dates OP? Go in your own dates and split everything to the penny if that’s your thing. Does it matter?
I’ve never done OLD because we’ve been married 18 years but I could never be bothered doing casual dating even in the 90s. By casual, I mean speculative - ie. I wasn’t sure if I liked him but thought he might grow on me or something like that. And call me old-fashioned, but I was never one to ask men out either. So if a man asked me on a date, I would expect him to want to pay. Why wouldn’t he? It’s not about me needing anything free. I just value men who are gents and have good manners and aren’t wishy-washy. And no, men who expect / prefer to pay are not necessarily control-freak, misogynists either - no more than the next man anyway. That’s a daft argument. Anyway, we’re all attracted to certain people and certain behaviours, it’s instinctive. So each to their own. Wouldn’t life be boring if we all went on dates and fussed about bill-splitting and took everything literally all the time.

AryaStarkWolf · 12/11/2019 12:14

Some guys wouldn’t even let me pay on second and third dates tbh

How can they not allow you though? It would make me feel uncomfortable to be constantly paid for. I would slip that money right back

matcatwomanheresheis · 12/11/2019 12:17

Plus men who open doors for women do not actually believe women are any less “equal” to them. What nonsense! Do people actually think that?

AryaStarkWolf · 12/11/2019 12:25

Plus men who open doors for women do not actually believe women are any less “equal” to them. What nonsense! Do people actually think that?

It's more than the door opening though, it's that old fashioned mindset that usually goes along with that type of mindset, so open the door for a lady, don't swear in front of the lady, don't talk business in front of the lady etc. Imo they're all from the same family. Opening a door is of course good manners but I would hold a door open for either gender as would my husband, not just because you're a lady type thing

PurpleDaisies · 12/11/2019 12:42

Plus men who open doors for women do not actually believe women are any less “equal” to them. What nonsense! Do people actually think that?

They have been socialised to fit a particular gender role. You’re very naive if you think that doesn’t affect how women are viewed and treated in wider society.

HPT9000 · 12/11/2019 12:47

Plus men who open doors for women do not actually believe women are any less “equal” to them. What nonsense! Do people actually think that?

Why do they only open doors for women then?

matcatwomanheresheis · 12/11/2019 12:50

Anya - well who would you want to be with a man who swears in front of women? I was in a train the other week, for over two hours, and there were two men in the carriage swearing for all to hear (until I glared at them). If DH had been there he would have told them to cut it out. No I don’t want yo hear that and nor do my kids. If that makes me a “lady” or a “pearl clutcher” welll, so be it. DH would never behave like that and he certainly doesn’t thing less of women. And nor do my sons and they’re only teenagers.

PurpleDaisies · 12/11/2019 12:54

If DH had been there he would have told them to cut it out.

Why didn’t YOU tell them to cut it out?

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