Help please - difficult issue around child access and terminal illness

[Unhappytraveler]

Hoping someone might be able to help with the following...not really a AIBU but have posted for traffic:

I'm going to have to be slightly vague about the info as it is a very sad and sensitive situation but the crux of it is that someone close to me (let's call them A) has in the last few days been given a terminal cancer diagnosis. 3-6 months was suggested but they aren't doing too well and sadly we think it might be a lot less than that. There is no possibility of a cure and they have chosen not to have any treatment which might give them a few more months but cause more pain etc.

A has a grandchild who they haven't seen for several years due to the fact that As child B ( the non resident parent/ NRP) was under criminal investigation - the offence did not relate to the child but the child's (resident) parent said they would no longer agree to visitation or contact with nrp or their family, including A. Prior to that B had 40/60 access.

B decided (and this isn't intended to be a debate about rights and wrongs of that decision) to step away temporarily a couple of years ago rather than fight for contact but with every intention of re establishing contact in the near future...obviously the current unexpected situation now means that there is some urgency to do so for As sake.

At the time B was told they could go to court or that social services would be prepared to try and mediate to facilitate contact. SS advised that from a child protection perspective they had no concerns over access.

So what I'm trying to help the family with is what's the quickest way to achieve some contact with the child for A whilst they are still with us. Clearly B could apply to court but I'm anticipating that's a process that could take a while especially if the other parent refuses to engage ( which is a possibility) and time is not on As side.

Is there any way social services could assist? Given that previously the family were advised they might (but 2 or so years on and with the current traumatic situation no one can remember who to contact)

Op, you said from the beginning that parental access was cut because of criminal activity.

If the errant parent has made a turn around in life, they by all means, that parent should seek to reestablish contact. That would need to happen slowly, with emotional supports put in place for the child.

If you want the child to see the dying grandparent, that can only happen if the residential parent grants permission. I’ve got my own similar situation right now. My grandmother is Dying and my 10yo dd has never met her. She feels bad that she has never met this person, so I had to be somewhat honest with her about why I have shielded her. Said dd will not be visiting and will not be attending a funeral. It isn’t in my child’s best interest. She already has complicated feelings about her lack of contact with her great grandmother and I’m not going to do anything to make that worse. I’m also not going to risk my dd being exposed to the very behavior that I am protecting her from.

‘ Death is a part of life. Artificially shielding children from it is a very modern idea that isn't followed in most parts of the world.

I don't see illness and death as something children must be protected from at all costs . It's attitudes like that which produces snowflake kids and fucked up adults. The child deserves the right to know and make a choice. Whatever that choice is.‘

You’re not the child’s active parent and have absolutely no right what so ever to decide this for them.

You’re right, death is a natural part of life. Having someone tell you a relative is dying when you’re 12 and haven’t seen that person in years is not. Having to watch someone die a miserable death when you’re 12 isn’t either.

I don’t shy away from death but seeing someone go through cancer fucks up most adults, never mind a child who has no contact with his father or grandparent.

You’re also getting B involved with the child again for the wrong reasons.

You’re being incredibly selfish. You should be staying out of it and let B deal with it. If he wanted to see his child he would do it himself, no matter how grief stricken he is. After all, he caused this mess.

@ Gruzinkerbell1

If the father did that himself it would be tolerable, but only if he waited until things were over and calm.

Because then he would be contacting his child for the right reasons. Not just to give A one last wish.

Every response op has given the main person of interest has been A, not B or the child.

It’s not good.

Why won’t you tell us OP what relation you are to the child?

My DC have attended funerals.

None of them have seen someone in their final days.

None of them have heard a death rattle.

That isn’t molly coddling. It’s being a PARENT.

This child is fuck all to do with you, and here you are, thinking you know what’s best for them?

You’re fucking deluded OP and I’m rather concerned that you’re so invested in this being as you say you’re not related...

Oh whatever jellybeans.

You and other posters have been judge and jury on B. Termed B a deadbeat Dad, who stopped contact with no thought for child and no future plan. There is nothing that could be said to sway you from your firmly held beliefs even though most are gender biased.

Shall I clarify that B is female? Does that change it up at all?

Is anyone suggesting the child attends the death bed? Because if not, this talk of death rattles is a bit dramatic.
(Doesn’t always happen, by the way, in case the thought is worrying anyone)

I'm not related to the child. I've akready stated that at least once.

And no one is suggesting the child should be present at As death, what a nonsensical inference. A visit soon is all that is hoped for before A gets much worse but certainly weeks at least before A passes.

Yeah, because mothers who abandon their children go down real well on Mumsnet.

Come on OP, behave. This involves a child - if your approach to them is in any way as hostile and dismissive as you have been on here, I fear for what may happen.
You have had numerous thoughtful responses from individuals with experience of children and death and the response has been consistent - it's about the welfare of the child - not anyone else. It isn't OK to "produce" a child to meet a dying relative after many years of absence in order to meet the wishes of the dying. So much depends on the emotional context of the child and it's not up to you to decide that the child must experience this particular death.
You've had some excellent advice on here - painful no doubt - but maybe it's time to step away and reflect on what you have been consistently advised - it's about the child and only the child.

The sex is irrelevant OP because this shouldn't be about the adults.
It should be about what is in the best interests of the dc.
It is highly doubtful that contact with a GP they haven't seen for several years, who is now very ill will be in the best interests of the child.
But the person best placed to make that decision is the resident parent, regardless of their sex.

Well OP, if you're not related to the child then respectfully BACK THE FUCK OFF!

In all honesty op, you can see that this isn't going to happen. The RP has not replied to any requests from A over the years to see the child. You absolutely should not try to contact the child direct, that would be very inappropriate.
I cant see why a mother (if it is a mother) would want this contact to happen. I certainly wouldnt. We had a similar situation recently where a grandparent was dying. I absolutely did not want my children to see that. The person got very ill very quick and it would have been frightening for the children to see. In our case, there were no requests to see the children, which I was thankful for. I think it is the child that is important here and at 11 or 12 they should not be asked to choose. They have no idea what they are letting themselves in for.

I've been asked to be involved by family. So thanks but I wont be backing the fuck off, cheers

Neither will I 'behave'. How ridiculously patronising. Fwiw I dont need advice on children and death, I have children. I've also dealt with the deaths of every member of my family apart from my children so, you know, I think I understand.

Yet again no one is contacting child directly.

I have been explicitlg clear this is WHY no one is calling in person at RPs house or hand delivering letters. Precisely to AVOID direct contact!

I think you are bs new love interest. No one else would gloss over his criminality, lack of interest in actively pursuing a relationship in his own child, point out his glowing record for actually handing over some money towards the maintenance of his own child and at the same time demonise the woman who has been raising this child against this miserable backdrop.

OP, is there something we thread readers are missing here? Some piece of information that makes this seem more sensible?
If there a cultural aspect you haven't mentioned?
Long standing traditions in relation to dying and family contact?
Because there is a pretty clear consensus on here that at best this isn't a great idea but you seem really sure it is.

You sound really immature op. Your responses to people are disgusting.

@BertrandRussell thank you, it was! I thought I could handle this thread but all this talk of death rattle is a bit much. I think I need to hit the hide button!

The child should be given a choice, and that choice needs to be respected. The needs of the child will always come first, above all others, even if the others only have a few months to live.

There is no point going to court as again the child's views will override everything at 12.

B is still a dead beat mum and gets no sympathy from me. The only person you care about is A OP and not the child. This is completely unnecessary for a young child

Doesn’t change anything for me.

NRP is still a deadbeat and a massive cheeky fucker.

I would not give my child a choice in this. At 11 or 12 they have no idea what effect seeing a very ill dying person would have on them in years to come. I would shelter my child from this. I know others would disagree though.

B has shown no concern for 2.5 years and was going to wait another year before even bothering to try and see their child. No matter Bs thoughts the impression the child will have is that B, A and the rest of the family don't care and don't want a relationship with them. To contact and guilt the child into seeing dying A now would be traumatic and selfish.

You need to step back, by all means B can send a letter the the RP, but that is completely down to B or possibly A at a push.

Before your twattish reply op, I've been there. I've lost close family members and some not so close. I haven't always chosen to see them and resented being made to feel guilty for not going, doing that to a 12 year old is definitely out of order.