AIBU putting my DD to bed at 6pm

[cavycavy]

My DD is 4, very nearly five. She is a VERY early riser. All her life it has been 5.30/6. But at the moment 4.30am is has become our new normal (and this was before the clocks changed). I think part of the reason is that DH is up at this time during the week and he must be waking her (he is as quiet as he can be). At the weekends when DH wakes up at 7ish DD still wakes up at 5.

As a result I put her to bed at 6. Any later and she gets over tired and really struggles to settle and then still wakes at 4.30 anyway.

Part of me worries she’s only getting 10.5hrs of sleep at night (shouldn’t it still be 12 at this age?) and part of me is just SICK of waking up this early every day. I go to bed at 8 to compensate and feel I have just enough sleep.

So what do I do? Accept this is how it will be for a while and go with the flow? (I like the ‘path of least resistance’ approach to parenting so this is what I’ve done so far). Or should I try and play around with bed time? Or have some kind of gro clock system in place?

My daughter, as it happens, also appears to be going through a massive clingy separation anxiety phase (maybe because she’s just started school - although she really loves it) and I think staying in her room alone for an hour in the morning would be torture for her at the moment.

Or maybe this is normal and children are programmed to wake up at stupid o fucking o clock in the morning?

WWYD?

My ds was always an early riser.

I use to let him come into my bed and watch something whilst I dozed for another hour or 2!

I didn't engage and he was told quite firmly if he woke me up there would be no tv that day! (I used tv as that's what he had whilst I slept)

He was good at doing that. I then introduced a radio alarm clock. Put a piece of paper next to it that says what time she can come in. Make it later and later each day.

Some people are just early risers. That in itself can't always be changed but she can be supported to be alone and awake.

One of mine wakes at 5.00-6.00am always has.. I put him to bed at six pm in reception, he needed it. He still goes to bed at 7 ( nine year old)

Those saying it’s only a few years...not always 9 years!!! To compound the problem my other child is a late sleeper😢 late to bed.

I’m never off duty!

I have had 2 early risers one now almost 5yo and 2yo. Both have done 4am -4.30am wake ups for long periods. These are wide awake bouncing off the walls wake ups with no chance of getting them bsck to sleep, believe me I have tried! It's very very hard as you become more and more sleep deprived as time goes on. Mine also have a 6pm bedtime because they still wake up early with a late bedtime. The difference is their behaviour is awful the next day as they are so tired. Also if you miss the window when they are tired they become hyperactive and are very difficult to get to sleep for hours. The cycle continues the next day as they are even tireder!

The 4yo now wakes later ( if not disturbed by 2yo!) So it does get better and my 4yo can entertain herself in her room on the rare occasions 2yo wakes after her. School will mess things up for a while. Don't be too harsh on her if she is behaving well in the day but just waking early.

So many people think you are just being soft and should put them to bed later. They have not experienced the hell of an overtired child awake at 4.30am having had 7 hours sleep. It's a very long day ahead......

Sorry OP If thus has been suggested (haven’t read the whole thread) but if your DH is waking her when he gets up put some white noise on! We have an app running on an old iPad in my son’s room, so he is not disturbed by us getting up early for showers. Secondly, he’s had a grow clock for a while, set to 7am. I think he naturally wakes at 6am as I hear him tolling around his bed, but he sings/chats to his soft toys etc until his clock turns yellow. That may be because he’s a stickler for rules and likes routine but something to work towards? There is no way I’d be getting up at 4.30 just because he wanted to.

My four year old wakes between 4:30 and 5:30 every day and always has done. The later he goes to bed the earlier he gets up so now he goes to bed at 6:15 for a story and usually falls asleep halfway through the first few pages before 6:30. I wouldn’t call 5:30 a particularly early wake up as it seems to be normal amongst my little ones friends but 4:30 is. Our rule is that at four thirty he can come into bed with us but has to at least try to sleep till after 5 which he does because he knows if he wakes his brother he will be in trouble. The baby is a terrible sleeper and regularly up for three hours at a time between 1 and 4.

The advice to not allow her up bed make her stay in her room until 6/7am is so unfair to the child when she is being put to bed at 6pm. You can't have your whole evenings and your mornings child free.
It is unfair to expect her to spend 12 or 13 hours alone in her bedroom.
It's cruel.

I think 6pm is way too early to expect hem to not get up at 5am. As someone else said, with bed at 6pm, she must be eating dinner at 4.30/5pm, so is probably hungry 12 hrs later.

Shift everything later. Dinner 6pm, bed 7.30pm. Any waking before 6.30am they are returned to bed or have to quietly entertain themselves in their room.

This is my life too - husband up and out by 6, dd5 waking at 5:30 every day despite busy school life and tons of after school activities, but I also have a newborn waking me every 2 hours

We've tried an earlier bed time (ie before 7) but I'm now tempted to go later as pp. DD has never needed much sleep and I wonder if we pushed bedtime to 8 then she might sleep in a bit later.

You’ve never asked your husband to sort his daughters breakfast???? And she’s 4 years old? Sorry what am I even reading? I thought we were in the 2000s not the 1950s?

She will struggle with after school clubs and playing with friends after school if you maintain going to bed at 6 pm. This is too early and you need to shift it later or she will have no after school life at all. That sounds like a very limited childhood to me.

If DD and DH are awake at the same time, she needs breakfast sorted out by him. No, DC don’t need 12 hours sleep. I agree she’s waking because she’s hungry and she needs to go to bed later. What time do you eat? Eat together in the evening at the weekends. Then bath for her, then story, then bed. Just move bed time later every week. At least she will be awake for play dates!

Is she waking due to hubby getting up, and then unable to get back to sleep due to hunger, thirst, a need to go wee.

Going to bed at 6 means eating early, and if she is staying properly hydrated (especially after school, they usually need to drink a lot) her bladder will fill up before morning - the evening period means you can gradually drink less - going to bed at 6 means either being thirsty in the morning or having too much fluid just before bed.

Would also try to gradually move it to 7.30/8pm so you get to sit and relax with her after tea. Let the food digest, let the drinks pass through, go to bed rested and ready to sleep.

Forget all ‘should be having 12 hours’, some kids need less sleep and 10.5 is pretty good (one of mine has never slept more than 10 since birth and she’s eight!)

If you can, I’d experiment with putting her to bed increasingly later (e.g. 15 mins later per night) to see if she adjusts to a more reasonable hour over a few weeks. This is a perfect time as it’s still dark in the mornings until at least 6am.

I would drop the iPad, it’s blue light is stimulating and guarantees wakefulness. A sleep specialist (medical) told us to let DD read, do sticker books, word searches etc. or even quiet play, but the rule us you need to stay in your bed until the Groclock says (or mummy gets you up). Buy a new stack if lovely things to do, make it exciting, get her a cosy lamp so it’s still restful during sleeping hours.

Some kids will wake FOR the iPad as it’s somehow addictive and stimulating. You want the 4.30 to be boring as hell. No breakfast or electronics until 6am. Stay in your room playing quietly. You might find she nods off again and realises she can. It worked for us!

I agree with the feed her later to get a bit more sleep, but I think you are always going to have an issue when your husband is up and out so early.
Sounds like 6-5 is her natural pattern at the moment. You will need to shift this quite a lot to make her not prone to waking at 4.30 when other people are up and about.

I'd be tempted to get a sunrise clock rather than a groclock at her age - effectively do the same thing. My early riser actually asked for an alarm to be set. It actually helped him stay in bed - I think because he knew he wasnt missing out on things..... it also meant there was no way he would have a lie in...... he was woken at 6am even on the exceedingly rare occasions he might sleep later.

He is now 10. He woke at 5.30 today..... rule now is no lights on until 6am. Then they can read, but cant get out of bed (other than bathroom) until 6.30 - which is when DH gets up for work. Alarms on school days go off at 6.30 (7.30 would be more than enough time to get to school, but they are both awake by then anyway).
I would strongly advise against "valuable" things early morning. If food and screen time are highly valued in your child's world, it will encourage them to wake up fully, rather than snuggle back down. So, the trick is to find something that will be acceptable if they need to entertain themselves, but aren't worth waking up for.... DS1 reads. DS2 lies in bed making up stories in his head!

PS that 10 yr old has always been below the bottom of recommended sleep. He goes to bed at 9. He is up at 5/6am. Recommended sleep is 9hr45 on the NHS. He gets max 9 hrs.

If it works for her then keep on doing it.

@bubblesbuddy Why push children to stay up later for after school clubs and playdates? If a child is tired after school, maybe they need that early bedtime. They won't be waking early forever. I don't think it's going to limit their childhood, there are weekends....

It is very unusual to go to bed at 6 when you are at school. Playing with other children is important for social development and friendships. If you do not do any of this, then a child is left out. Other parents and DC are not always around at weekends. It is normal to play after school. It is also fun and a reason to stay awake. There will also be homework and reading to fit in before long. It is also good for DC to do something after shool when they are older: again so they are not isolated. Therefore I think moving bed time later bit by bit is the best idea for social development as well as getting DH to help if the mornings are problematic.

I don't think it has to be exactly 12h. I just looked it up and the NHS is really precise (11.30-12) but all the other websites had a range of either 10-13h or 11-13h which seems more reasonable.

FWIW DSs ideal bedtime is asleep at 8.30 and then up at 7-7.30 so about 10 and half hours. (He's 3.5)
He used to have a long afternoon nap until around 2.5-3 but doesn't have one now unless he falls asleep in the car after a long day out.

If it works for her then keep on doing it.

It's clearly not working for the OP though. Family life is about compromise and boundaries. Waking at 4.30am is antisocial, irritating and an unreasonable hour. Her 4yo needs to know this.

If she only needs 10.5 hours sleep, work backwards from your ideal wake up time and put her to bed then. Might be brutal for a few days but there's no way I'd be getting up at half 4 regularly.

My DD2 (now 7) used to be like this, waking up at 4:30/5am. Back then we only had CBeebies for children's TV, so there was nothing on the TV either! It was exhausting! She used to wake up in the night as well and come into our bed. We only changed this when we kept her up later. It didn't change all at once, it took quite some time, but we got there in the end.

You will have to keep her up later, and stick to that, IMO. As others have said, a 6pm bedtime is unsustainable as there will be clubs for her to go to as time goes on.

Both of my kids were early risers, so for years I put them to bed at 6pm every night. They slowly got later bed times by getting an extra 30mins to stay up at each birthday from around age 7-8.

This worked well for us, and there was no whining at the different bed times as they grew as they knew bedtimes got later with every birthday.

Thank you for all the replies. I genuinely thought 6 was a normal bed time at this age.

I think, moving it gradually towards 7/7.30 is the way forward then. They’ll be some tired evenings but I can’t keep up these 4.30 mornings. I feel a bit crazy today!!!

For reference my 2yo goes to bed at 7.

@BubblesBuddy

Thank you for your reply. I must admit, she goes for tea at her friends after school about once a week and I’m always (secretly) shocked when they say pick up at 6-6.30pm! I say nothing and go with it so my DD can have fun. But it’s a one off late night for her.

To be honest.... I’ve had a few looks when I tell people what time DD goes to bed.

I honestly thought 6pm was kind of normal!!

Have you done the 6pm bed time yet or just thinking about it? Because if you haven't done it, I actually would try it. I am a huge believer that over tired children wake up earlier. So DD, who is a really good sleeper all round and needs her 11- 12 hours at the same age, is more likely to wake up at 7am if I put her to bed at 8:30 because we're late. But if I have her in bed at 7:30 she'll sleep straight through until 7:30.

And with starting school I think they are knackered so I'd be tempted to try the much earlier bed time for at least a couple of days and see if you have the corresponding slight improvement in waking up time.

I also agree that 4:30 is way too early so if the above doesn't work, I'd wake her a bit earlier, lightly, then let her go back to sleep. There's a name for this technique which I can't remember but we used it in desperation with DS at one point when he was waking at 5 am every morning. We were ALL knackered. SO for a couple o days, one of us got up at 4:30, woke him a little - not a lot, enough that he was half awake, then helped him settle back to sleep. He'd then sleep through the usual 5 am wake up. I can't remember what it's called or why it works but it's something about breaking their circadian rhythms.

PS - I have a good friend who put her DD to bed at 5:30 until year 2. She just needed that much sleep - she'd wake up at 6:30 the next morning!! If she went to bed later, she was unsettled all night.