To think that these are not signs that we live in poverty.

[Tweedledeedumb]

Had an unexpected phone called from DS's school.
All year 7's were given a survey and my sons answers indicated that we might be in need and the school were offering friendly help. It turns out that the questions that he responded no to were:

Do we have a dishwasher
Do we have a microwave
How many holidays abroad has DS had this year.

AIBU that these are not an indicator or poverty. I have never seen dishwashers or microwaves as necessary.

Both I had in the past and never used them. It is personal choice not to own them and we do perfectly well without.

As for the holidays, why is going abroad necessary when we have amazing places in the UK. Fair enough if they said holiday in the last 2 years but for all they know, I may have had 6 holidays last year.

I work in education so not knocking the school as we see these things all the time but this had to be the most ridiculous one to date.

The school said that it was fine and it was just to flag those needed help and they couldn't ask the children if their parents struggled to pay bills.

What do you think? Are these questions useful?

You should have said you don't need a microwave as you have an Aga.

Not an indicator*

Super weird because there are choice or other factors behind the answers, potentially. We don't have a dishwasher because I think they aren't energy efficient for a family of one adult and one child and I don't mind washing up. And no holidays abroad because I didn't fancy it with a one year old! Could have afforded either/both...

Having a microwave is not a marker of living on ready meals. We cook from scratch mostly and use the microwave to heat up leftovers.

Dishwashers are far more efficient than washing up by hand, especially for water, unless you produce hardly any washing up, which is less a factor in household size and more to do with the sort of cooking you do.

After all, you need the same number of pans, oven trays etc to produce a roast dinner for 2 as you do for 6.

Dear god. We’re in absolute poverty by their measurements. If they want to send us to St Lucia that’d be lovely.

But I still don’t want a dishwasher or a microwave thanks 🤷‍♀️

Well, I live alone and my parents live just the two of them and don't cook elaborate meals involving lots of pans or trays Barbara, so a dishwasher isn't that efficient for us unless we let things pile up over more than a day. Breakfast and lunch are eaten at work.

I can imagine it could be the same for a single parent and child.

Ridiculous. Do you live in a very wealthy area? Is it private school?!
No.
No.
None.

My children are fortunate enough to have home cooked meals, I hand wash my dishes! Our kitchen doesn't even have space for a dishwasher!
And okay, we can't afford holidays abroad. Perhaps we can usually get together enough for a relatively cheap week away in the UK!
But I wouldn't say we're in poverty. Poverty, to me, is not being able to afford enough food for your family, soap, toothpaste, wearing shoes or clothes too small, having to buy 2 sizes too big to get more wear, wearing coats to bed in the winter.

Did you say you would be able to take him on holiday abroad if they let the kids go away in termtime?

That's extremely intrusive. l suspect their intentions are good but that's a very cackhanded way of asking.
l've lived in three houses (including the one l'm in now) that had dishwashers. l've never used them. l don't think l have enough dishes!
Microwave - yes, use it very occasionally. Usually to start off baked potatoes.
Holiday - l haven't had a holiday in 11 years.
l wouldn't say l'm living in poverty. l have been, at one point, when l as on benefits, and really struggling, but not now. lt's all about perspective.

Besides which, my parents never ever discussed money or their financial situation with me. Even as an adult. l imagine my mother would have gone mad if l'd been asked questions like that at school. l remember at about 15, wanting to go on a school trip to Germany. Paid the deposit, then when the remainder was due, l was told l couldn't go. l said l'd have to explain why. My mother said "because l say so" and wouldn't elaborate. l realise now that they couldn't afford it, but l felt very embarrassed at school not being able to say anything other than "my mam says l can't go."

I'm a single parent with one child, dishwasher certainly wouldn't be more efficient for me and it would increase my energy bills. I often batch cook and freeze food so don't use my pots and pans every night, just 2 plates and cutlery.

Poverty?!
Give me a break

Those questions are a disgrace. I'd make a serious complaint to the school.

These are ridiculous questions.

You might not go abroad on holiday because of a family member having a fear of flying, or a disability, or because you have older parents elsewhere whom you visit to provide support. Or because your heritage is in another part of the UK, so unintended as it is, it could be construed as anti-Welsh or anti-Scottish to ask.

You might not have a microwave because you have an Aga (as someone pointed out), or because you are prepared to spend the time that conventional cooking takes.

You might not have a dishwasher because you do not have the space in your kitchen, or because like me you think it is just laziness if you are in a small household.

I agree Darling I'd be complaining. Highly intrusive. I would be very, very uncomfortable as an 11 year old filling that in. I thought things had moved on. I got into a grammar school many years ago and the head came in with a similar "survey" that asked about how many cars your family had, what papers your family took, how many times you had been abroad etc. It was excruiating for me as a child who had never been abroad, parents didn't buy a daily paper etc. I was singled out as we were asked what your favourite tv programme was and the head came over and told everyone that someone of my class couldn't possibly have that as their favourite. It has stayed with me, for example, I always have far too much food in the cupboards and cleaned like a devil even when very ill post partum as I panicked when HV came for baby visits or the teacher wanted to come for home visits before DC started school.

I think it is totally disgraceful to ask intrusive, personal questions like that.

i have a microwave and a dishwasher, and ive been abroad five times in the last 12 months....i wouldnt consider myself afluent, have struggled at times, just prioritise my spending on what i enjoy, but that doesnt make me better than anyone else...im shocked that they put children in this position, making them feel different. I didnt go abroad until i was 21, and never had a dishwasher or microwave when i lived with my parents...did that make us poor, i dont think so....had food, warmth and a lot of happy memories...which is the main thing

We don’t have a dishwasher or a microwave 😂

Do the people who think a dishwasher is lazy also think a washing machine is lazy?

You don't have to put it on after every meal, or even every day, just when it's full and then it washes up a full load on about half a sinkful of water. There's only two of us, and a load of cats, and our dishwasher goes on about 4 or 5 times a week. Far more effcient than having to wash up all the time.

IMO...its bloody nosiness on the schools part and i would be complaining!

The abroad question tells you nothing, for example it's almost certainly cheaper to go on a package holiday to somewhere like Benidorm, especially in term time, than it is to go to Center Parcs or rent a cottage in somewhere like Cornwall.

Clearly they let some Y7's write the survey questions as part of some project or other !

We earn a (low) 6 figure salary between us. Until last year we didn’t have a dishwasher (no space in kitchen til we had an extension) and we didn’t go on holiday abroad last year either, we went to a very middle class holiday cottage complex in Wales 🤣. I agree with a previous poster, there will be lots of middle class/eco-conscious types who would have answered no to all of those!

I would be ripping mad at that.

Those questions are wierd at best, downright intrusive and inappropriate at worst.

What kind of bubble is the teacher living in to think those are a sign of poverty, and could lead to an efficient use of extra funding? It's bizarre and shows a lack of professional competence.

Having a microwave is not a marker of living on ready meals.

No, but I would say that having a microwave but no oven probably is. Just as not having a foreign holiday is not a marker of poverty, but not having a holiday of any description possibly is. It’s the questions that are poorly thought out, rather than that the intention behind them was wrong.
And if you work with the same children every day, I would have thought it would be pretty easy to spot the ones who might be in need of help.