To think when a couple with kids separate: the woman usually gets the raw deal

[Mammylamb]

Just that every couple I’ve seen separate in my adulthood; the woman seems to have to take up all the slack of bringing up the kids, and the man just seems to get away with looking after them once a week, getting on with their own life the rest of the time

if you consider raising your dc solo why did you have them ? no relationship is 100% certain to last,

*sorry meant to say if it's a raw deaf raising solo

On the whole I agree with the op.
We see post after post on here of step mothers sorting out the step children whilst the dad is otherwise engaged, often doing a hobby!
When I split with my ex i encouraged him to see the children often and frequently, this did not happen.
From my experience the majority of men prefer to have their free time so that they can piss about doing as they please. Sure they kick up a stink at Christmas and holiday times aided and abetted by the new woman but don't want to reduce their working hours and take time off during the week so that they can have the dc say Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday morning.

Of course some people are better parents than others.

The only elements I see as being a “raw deal” are picking up the logistical slack, the financial burden and having to deal with the emotional fallout of the kids being let down time and time again by their father.
I wouldn’t want to swap my circumstances for his though.
We’ve been in family court for 2 years because of domestic violence on his part and, despite being offered more time, we now have a final order where he spends one Saturday afternoon a month with our son and every other Saturday with our daughter for 5 hours- 2 of which will be in the car because he’s moved away
He absolutely has the raw deal but it’s all he wanted and I’ve had it drummed into me by solicitors etc that, unfortunately, you cannot force someone to see their children if they don’t want to

Yes. But it's not a raw deal for me. I love being with my kids and would not want to have ex's shit life of drinking and spending weeks away in the hectic, sweaty cities his "job" is based in for anything. If I ever moan about his lack of attention or child support for his children he grandly informs me I am "just jealous" as he gets to travel and be free.

Exactly Quandary
My ex h’s words to me were you can’t force me to see my kids!
Of course he denies it and the piece of shit he is married to now lies through her teeth about it claiming that I have poisoned the kids against him. Err no I was the one who repeatedly asked for contact arrangement and he rejected them preferring to have his free time.
I think the best scenario is for both parents to share things and both work part time.

Yet I don’t think a lot of second wives like that idea, they prefer to have a man who works all the hours god sends, then moan that their poor dh doesn’t get to see his kids often. Well duh yeah.

I disagree. When DH split up with his exP he saw his kids one evening and one weekend day for months and months while going through mediation and court hearings. His ex wouldn't let them stay overnight because he lived in a rented studio flat so he didn't have bedrooms but she wouldn't consider any release of equity from the main 5 bed family home to allow him to buy something bigger. He hasn't seen them on Christmas morning since they were 3 and 5 years old, didn't share a birthday tea with them on their birthdays until they were old enough to make their own choices, didn't get to hear their stories after school or tuck them up in bed apart from a week of holiday in the summer. Now they are early 20's and their relationship is not what it could have been.

I would say he got the raw deal.

I do agree though that the woman usually ends up with the bulk of the caring responsibilities and probably end up economically worse off in the majority of cases. So economic raw deal I agree, but overall probably not.

I would agree with a PP that everyone suffers when a family breaks down.

That isn’t to say that it isn’t necessary, but I’m not convinced any arrangement is workable.

There are exceptions but as a rough rule of thumb, the way men bond with their children is different to women. Men bond with the child via the mother. Once the bond with the mother is severed, the relationship with the child often suffers too.

It’s not about what fits in with the parents life, it’s about what is best for the child.

I can’t tell you how many episodes of Thomas the Tank I’ve had to endure or how many times I’ve read the entire series, over and over and over again to the point where my dcs learnt to count knowing which e fine was which number. Mind numbing at the time, a loving memory now.

If you can’t put your children first then you shouldn’t have them.
In the majority of cases seeing both parents frequently and having their undivided attention is beneficial to children.
It shouldn’t be a game between parents.
Parents shouldn’t expect to stay in huge houses unless they buy the other parent out.
Likewise children should see a lot of the nrp and that parent should prioritise that time, not spend it working or with the latest shag partner.

Why is having your child living with you a raw deal ?
Why is caring for them a raw deal?
It's sad that this is how you perceive it.

You can be annoyed that an ex doesn't see your child or pay maintenance but for those many ex's that do they have a very raw deal imo.

Genuine question so please dont think im being goady...

To the posters saying their current partners cry when they drop off, or only see their children EOW etc. Why is it not 50/50?

My exh wont have them 50/50. He moved too far away and is too abusive to facilitate a co parenting relationship. He then moans his children dont want to spend time with him but he has no interest in their lives. The times he sees them they have to drop in to his live far away from their own.

But to anyone that will listen I have poisoned the children against him. I wont let him have them as ive 'bred' them to want to spend time with me.

When asked if he'd share the holidays so the kids can see him and me and their friends i was told that its not about the kids. Its about him. He needs a rest. He even got upset that our DD loves our dog more than him.

So I know my personal story may colour my view of oeople saying they only see their kids eow due to the other parent.

I would move heaven and earth to be involved in my children's lives. Why dont they?

Sorry i also meant to put having the children with me full time isnt a raw deal. What is a raw deal is the impact it has on me finacially and my career.

Such a shitty and flawed OP.... Such a generalisation about what it's like in a breakup.

My partner has spent thousands going through the courts to see his DC and I see first hand the pain that has caused him and DC. But that doesn't mean I can't understand a RP who says her ex has pissed off and doesn't see the DC or doesn't pay maintenance. There are so many situations within a family split you can't generalise that NRP can't be bothered full stop.
Your own experience isn't the same for everyone else.

Simple answer chuckles because they don’t want to!

I know there are some good fathers and there are so bad mothers.
However, like I said before if you genuinely want to see your kids, then drop some hours at work. Work 4 days a week and have your children at your house on the other 3 days. This then allows the other parent to work too.

However in real life, lots of second wives wouldn’t like that. They prefer their partner to be out working and earning more money, rather than earn less and spend more time with their children, which is what the majority of single mothers have to do.

If a man wants to see more of his kids then alter your life around your children.

Having my children live with me is NOT a raw deal. The suggestion that it is has made me really angry, especially a Pp’s use of the word ‘lumbered’. Why have children if that’s your attitude?

My dc have a very involved and positive relationship with their dad. They spend 2 days (midweek) with him. If he and they wanted 50:50 I would consider that fair even though I wouldn’t like it. As long as he wasn’t going to stick them in childcare while I’m here and available to look after them. At the moment everyone is happy with the arrangement we have.

I think I’ve got a bloody good deal.

I do about 80% of the childcare. I don't feel that I got a raw deal.

Why don't we do 50/50? Because to be honest neither of us want to, it wouldn't work for us, and I actually do not think it is always in the child's best interests. 50/50 is more for the parents than the child an I think it's a lot of upheaval. I think (especially when the child is young) that one main home "base" is important for the child's security rather than being at one home half the week and one home the other half, never really settling in one place. It makes sense for us that the home base is my home, because my exh is a train driver and works weekends/nights on a shift pattern, whereas I work part time office hours. Exh has no problem with this and we have never had any reason to go to court or mediation, we just arrange things between us.

Exh is a very involved father, he has DS one or two nights a week and speaks to him on the phone regularly, he pays me generous maintenance as he is on a good wage and recognises that I do the bulk of the day to day things with DS and we get along very well.

There are some dads out there who are just shit (my own father included) but I feel that I have a good deal to be honest. I am definitely worse off financially than my exh (I earn about a fifth of what he does) but I'm not bothered about that to be honest as I know he also has a lot of debt whereas I don't have any.

I think it’s becoming more common than it was for men to have the kids or 50:50 tbh which is a good thing in some ways, my BIL has the kids full time apart from every other Sunday. I wouldn’t want that personally, I can’t imagine seeing DS once every 2 weeks but she doesn’t want them full time, I don’t think BIL has been given the raw deal or lumbered they’re both really happy with the set up!

Very true.
That being said,the time goes so fast you will one day be glad you had them 90% of the time.

everyone suffers when a family breaks down

Not always. Not us. It’s been a positive decision for us. We’re all happier. Children agree.

And it hasn’t broken down; it’s been restructured.

I completely agree but I prefer it that way. My selfish ex has never committed to having them regularly. Which means it’s he gets all the freedom to plan his work and social life, but I get more of the best bit.

Yes prosecco your set up sounds very good.
However, I doubt you would be feeling quite so positive if your ex told his children that “You can’t stay at my house overnight as this will mean your mother can then go out, and I’m not facilitating that.”
Or “you can come here but I won’t feed you, that’s your mothers job.”
Or how about, “No, I can’t see you this weekend, new partners kids are at their dads, so we are having a child free weekend.”

I often see from friends who are separated that it's not so much the 'raw deal' but they have the juggle of children & work and childcare. My close friend loves her kids and but yes her husband walked away dumping the responsibility of the three young kids on her and now he has 'no ties' he's focused in his career and been promoted quite a few time whilst my friend struggles to work full time hours and she's the one that take time off work when the kids are ill ir juggles the holidays. Her ex just swans in every other weekend and is the cool fun dad who spoils the kids materially every other weekend where as she worries about trying to afford the house and run a car

I think men get the raw deal not women. They often end up with little access and lose their house etc.

It’s not a raw deal to have the bulk of the time with your children

I am glad I have more time with my DC than my ex and I think it's far better for them. He was abusive in the relationship and isn't a good father imo. But it does mean taking on the responsibility for almost everything to do with them. I don't think my ex has any idea what it's like to get DC up and out to school every day, to make sure lunches are organised and homework is done. I am single and run the household alone. He isn't, and of course his partner picks up a lot of the childcare, most of the housework etc. She also has to put up with his behaviour.

I don't want to move to 50:50 ever because I really believe it would be detrimental to my DC. I do worry ex will push for it at some point because of the financial benefit to him. He's been happy to let me do all the work while they have been young and take more looking after but as they get older and can do more for themselves he might change his mind.

Depends on your viewpoint, doesn't it?

I'd rather do the work and live with my children the majority of the time.