To be tired of the ‘racist UK’ remarks?

[AGermFreeAdolescent]

By that I mean people talking down the UK and say that it’s a racist country since Brexit. I appreciate everyone has their own experiences but I dislike when people say Brexit has made the UK more racist and make out it is more so than its EU counterparts when I, as a non white person, feel WAY more safe anywhere in the UK as I would compared to any other country in Europe. Can’t help but feel that the people that denigrate the UK for racism because of Brexit are white and have not visited countries in Europe as, or with, a person that isn’t white. Started this thread mostly because of the ‘shock’ about the racism that Bulgarian fans displayed to England and my first thought was ‘And this is a surprise, because...?’

If we limit immigration who is going to do the jobs that immigrants currently do?

The market corrects the imbalance, just like in any other country that has limited immigration.

“ The market corrects the imbalance, just like in any other country that has limited immigration.”

You’ll have to explain that a bit more.

@heronry "the success of British imperialism", are you insane? Success is murdering millions of people and taking their land?

You do realise that we can acknowledge the success of the British empire while having eyes wide open about how catastrophically racist it was? Do you normally try to shame people out of precise speech?

Low-paid jobs go unfilled, inputs recalibrate, some jobs will pay more, some are automated, business leaders complain to politicians and vocational training is refined, some businesses go bust, and so on.

Immigration is in my view comparable to exceedingly low interest rates- keeping zombie companies afloat, hampering innovation, keeping wages low, compromising a nation's productivity.

^Unchecked immigration

I think it's correct to say that British Imperialism was successful in that it fulfilled it's objectives at the time - that is the definition of success. However, in fulfilling those objectives, it callously caused much human suffering, death, and an ongoing legacy of more of the same that has not been addressed.

Would that be fair?

The UK is a racist country. As others have said it's not more racist just more people feel freer to air their racist opinions since the Brexit referendum.

And op just because you have been lucky does not mean you should think you are safe.

There are more racist countries than the UK but please don't confuse politeness and seething tension as no racism.

There is more and more everyday casual racism, institutional racism and out right violent in your face racism.

Okay @heronry , thank you for the discussion

@EntropyRising you can NEVER call the murder of millions of people succesful, you should be ashamed of yourself.

However - apparently the true story of what the British Empire did, is not even taught in schools. So that is why we have people thinking it is "sucessful".

Here is an article where the Education secretary says that British colonialist history is not taught in schools at all.

www.google.ie/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/british-people-are-proud-of-colonialism-and-the-british-empire-poll-finds-a6821206.html%3famp

When I think about England taking over India, I don't think:
Great, we were so powerful!

I think, "what the f"@k were we thinking - millions of people died , because of our greed".

The thing is, it's not just random comments. It's organised racism. Letters through letterbox, spraying on houses, posters around areas, groups bullying people... I heard number of people saying it feels like it might go back to how it was in the 70's.

@Heronry

Would you make similar claims of coldness and arrogance for the Dutch/Spanish/Portugese/Germans/Belgians/Italians/Japanese and other countries who had empires?

Of course not. It's only English people (white English people obviously,) who are pure evil, nasty beasts who are mean to all and sundry, and have been since forever. 🙄 (We know this because we never stop hearing about it...)

And it's only ENGLISH people (white English people obviously) who are racist and bigoted. And it's almost ALWAYS the middle aged and older white, English people. 🙄

Never mind, at least there are plenty of PC brigade warriors, who are the guardians of the ethnic minorities, who can continue to put us all in our place, and remind us how vile and putrid we all are.

That's just silly rainingallday. Quite a standard way to try and deflect though, isn't it, to play the victim card? No one has been saying that, as far as I can see.

angel84, thank you for answering a question I've been wondering about, whether British colonialist history is taught in schools. I'm rather surprised that it's not, I would have thought it far more pertinent and relevant to modern day Britain and her place in the world than the Tudor Kings and Queens for example.

I can understand that it would likely be uncomfortable and contentious for many, but that's no reason why an important subject should be avoided - any more than Nazi Germany should be ignored in German history, Apartheid in South African, or the New Zealand Land Wars and Colonial History in New Zealand (this is still not given its rightful place in the NZ school curriculum - many of the reasons argued by European heritage New Zealanders being no doubt very similar to those who would object to British Colonial History being taught here!)

@rainingallday you don't know the background and ancestory of any poster on here so don't presume everyone taking you to task is white.

Oh and the stereotype of "coldness" you mentioned is never strongly associated with the peoples from all the other nations you mentioned.

@angell84 my history teacher, who was head of history, delibrately chose one of the GCSE syllabuses that had the break up of the British Empire in it. My school ran 2 history courses at GCSE and that option was so popular they had to put on an extra class.

Though to be fair there are other horrors in history that while more recent are still historical to teenagers living that have implications from the British Empire that that could be studied to cover this.

Angel so long as we're discussing empire, the currency of success is subjugation. Please stop trying to goad people into using language you find acceptable.

@OnlyFoolsnMothers -My brother in law has been asked by many Eastern Europeans "where are you from" and when he says London "no where are you really from".

The same thing is happening in the UK all the time! I have friends born in the UK, some 3rd generation, who still get asked where they are really from, depsite havign hardly any links to where they grandparents or greatgrandparents are from.

I have travelled extensive around Europe and never had any negative things happen across in Eastern Europe, neither had many of my friends of different races, all commented on how lovely and welcoming people were. On the other hand, I got off a bus in a certain place east of London and got told by a random guy to 'go back home' amid some racist slurs.

Best not to harper on too much a the empire, France, Holand, Germany Spain Portugal, Turkey, have all had there empire days. And in 20th century of course Germany and Rusia, attrocities happened and the scars are still felt to this day. But I think thats not what this is about.

@Colafreezepop and @Angell84.

I was pointing out the irony of the comment. Angell84, you say we're hated by other nationalities because we are viewed as being a bunch of arseholes and all the same.

Yes, that's called racism.

And therefore, those people from the (unspecified) countries that hate us because they think we are all the same are racist.

I can't really put it any simpler than that, sorry.

@SleepOhHowIMissYou I get what you are saying.

God racism is everywhere isn't it.

Wouldn't it be a great little world, if we didn't identify as being, "from one country".

For example, nearly the first that people say about anyone, is
"He is English
He is Spanish
She is chinese "
Etc

We are all human beings, we are all from the world.

Why does the rock that you happened to be on at the time of your birth, really have much to do with anything? Many people move around.

Seperating people by saying

"He is polish"
"He is Spanish
She is English"

Is causing loads of problems right now.

Can you imagine a world with no countries?

As John Lennon said "imagine there's no countries". He knew that it would stop a lot of fighting

We can get to a more developed world where we say

"He lives on a different rock to me, but we are all worth the same,". We are worldwide citizens

Partners family are from Ghana, day after brexit a man shouted out of his car window at DH “go back to where you come from” he was born in Manchester. Disgusting people, my DHs parents worked for over 30 years in this country & pay tax they do not deserve to be treated like.

I was accused of making things up by some posters on another thread when I said I witnessed the abuse of a polish couple in Cardiff a couple of weeks ago.
This country is in denial about what it is.

For example, nearly the first that people say about anyone, is
"He is English
He is Spanish
She is chinese "
Etc

The problem is when people tell my dc ‘you are french’ when they are British, born in Britain and have never known anything different. They just happen to have a French mother. (But also a BRITISH father etc...).
Or when they are saying to the Spanish woman who acquired BRITISH citizenship that they are Spanish, not British
What they REALLY mean is your are not TRULY British and therefore nit BRITISH at all.

That sort of stuff goes much further than just separating people in different citizenship. It also evaluate if you are a ‘proper’ British and out a value on ‘how long’ you’ve been living in the U.K. (and yes it has to go back generations to be properly British)