To wonder about people's awareness of fertility decline

[Orangeblossom78]

decline I mean, in late 30s/40s. I know someone who on trying to get pregnant for the first time in their early 40s is shocked and devastated to be told of their fertility being low at this stage. AIBU but is is not usually apparent that our fertility declines after mid 30s and you can't just expect to have an easy time getting pregnant in early 40s.

(And, obviously, this is why you do IVF if you only have a small number of viable eggs. That's basically what the procedure is designed for.)

Personally I’d love to see more media awareness targeted at men about their fertility decline and urging them to have babies earlier, rather than think it’s fine 50+.

Hear hear Longlongsummer as pointed out above, a lot of developmental issues are correlated to older fathers. Also the reality is that the vast majority of relationships are between people within 5 years of each other. The stereotype of the older man with a significantly younger woman is actually not that common in long-term relationships.

@LauraMacArthur

That's really interesting. Do you know where the report can be found?

Here’s my anecdata:

TTC v early 20s took 2 years on/off to conceive.

26 TTC took 9 months.

30 accidental pregnancy while using contraception, ended in MC

34 TTC pregnant in first month

So for all my worrying about infertility in my youth I seem to have got more fertile as I’ve aged!

But I’d say to my DD if you want dcs esp 2/3 don’t wait until you are 30+ before ttc/ investigating fertility.

People arent honest about fertility treatment so I wouldnt necessarily believe those who say they got pregnant naturally in their 40s.

I was actually more concerned about my DH's age due to the risks of things like ASD, ADHD and schizophrenia.

Agree that 50 year old men having kids with 28yos is not common at all. Men do not exactly have a biological clock but they do have a social one--most are sensible enough to do the maths and realize that they do not want to be arguing with a teenager in their 60s, and also if men get to a certain age without kids they usually like their lives the way they are at the moment. If a guy has got to his early 40s without having children, he very seldom has them after that age in my experience. So in practice, it is not so very different from women!

The only men I know who had kids aged late 40s or older were the divorcees who ran off with younger women and then their younger second wives talked them into starting a second family. In both cases the guys are now poor, stressed and knackered, and I think it serves them right.

The vast majority of children had been born to mothers in their 20s or early thirties...in my time working there I never came across a child with Down's Syndrome whose mother was, what I thought was the stereotype, late thirties or forties when the child was born.

I wonder if this is partly related to screening, as younger women may be less likely to have screening done.

**I think the saddest thing to see is women hanging onto a relationship with a guy who doesn’t want kids but is clearly stringing her along for years with a ‘someday’, believing that she can wait until her late thirties/early forties and then finding out too late the ship has sailed (and their ex moving onto someone younger and having a couple of kids pretty quickly). I very nearly was that woman. It’s crazy what you’ll put up with if you’re blinded by love and hope.I think the saddest thing to see is women hanging onto a relationship with a guy who doesn’t want kids but is clearly stringing her along for years with a ‘someday’, believing that she can wait until her late thirties/early forties and then finding out too late the ship has sailed (and their ex moving onto someone younger and having a couple of kids pretty quickly). I very nearly was that woman. It’s crazy what you’ll put up with if you’re blinded by love and hope.

This is me right now.

I read a study a while back about the reasons women "delay" starting a family and it said that the most common reason by far was women not having found the right man yet.

And there's a ton of data showing that suitable male partners are generally very difficult to find - that women tend to become unhappier and worse off when they marry whereas men become happier and better off. There was one out just the other day too that said that marriage is a bad deal for most women unless they can find an exceptional man and I think that's true. I've been online dating for 10 years now and have met very few men that have the relationship skills that data shows you need to make a relationship happy and satisfying for another person.

So I think the real choice many women face is this: have children at the right time with the wrong man or wait and give yourself the chance of having them at the wrong time with the right many while knowing that ultimately you might end up having them at the wrong time with the wrong man. It's a very tough choice. I know a few people who I believe opted for the former and I'm very interested to see how their lives work out. I know many more women who are hoping to achieve the 2nd scenario but ultimately, who knows who will and who won't and who will end up in the 3rd situation and who will end up childless?

maryboleyn what’s your situation? Maybe if you explain a bit I/others can advise.

I am aware of this but it if course not the case for everyone the same way as not all women in their twenties and early thirties conceive and carry pregnancies to term.

I fell pregnant with our three children very easily, in fact one was conceived after I had had the contraceptive injection. None of them were tried for but very much wanted.
I had three relatively straightforward pregnancies and all were delivered via induction at 41, and twice at 39 weeks with easy labours and all good weights over 8 lbs.

I also have several friends who conceived and had children later in life without interventions or asssoted reproductive techniques.

My babies were born when I was 39,41 and 42. Their father is six years younger than me though so perhaps it’s a combination of those things ? I also have never been on contraceptive treatment apart from ironically the injection for that one time which was actually to see if it helped my periods. Many of my friends were on the pill from aged sixteen or so for at least a decade and it seemed to wreak havoc with their ability to conceive, though of course there may have been other factors masked by the pill hitherto.

It’s all very well to say that my story is just my own anecdote but there seems to be quite a few of us having babies over the hill!

the problem is that more and more people are aving fertility treatment to have children, so ou may now know loads of people in thier 40s who have had babies but as you dont know the ins and outs of thier conception and the use of ivf etc you may niavely believe its easy to get pregnant at 40!

And there's a ton of data showing that suitable male partners are generally very difficult to find

Really? I'd love to see their methodology. Could you link to it please?

gave a man 8yrs of my life. from 28 to 36. we even chose a ring together. its now sitting in jewellery box upstairs. has been for the past 4yrs. he's moved on. I'm now sat here having hit early menopause (my mum & 2 sisters had this aswell). so my ship has well & truly sailed

I agree that most men having children later in life are on second families. I do wonder whether that's a subconscious motive for the younger OW targeting a married man. A man who already has children is a much safer bet to procreate with than a man who doesn't from a fertility POV. I can't think of why a young woman would want a man 20 years her senior otherwise.

And yes, vasectomies exists, but the prehistoric part of our brain that drives reproduction doesn't know that.

In my experience, most men that want children will have them before mid 30s, usually before 30.
So if he's stalling after 30, it isn't because he's unaware of the risks, it's because he doesn't care because he isn't that keen on having them at all

@maryboleyn I’m so sorry. That is rough. I really feel for you.

I have two male relations who are absolutely lovely men, great fun, great jobs, kind, loyal. Yet they too both went out with fantastic women for 10 years, whilst the women were approx 30-40yrs. These women were lovely, and hoping for marriage and kids, had good careers themselves, but weren’t the kind of women to push this in their BFs, who eventually ditched them aged 40. I am so sorry for them, it seems so unfair. And both male relations have now both got kids, ironically from much less lovely women, quite difficult women really, who basically got pregnant ‘accidentally’ very soon and bagged their man!

It is an extremely tough world out there for women who haven’t found a man by their 30s. And if I ever see a headline berating women for having careers and not being alert to their failing fertility, it will make me want to scream!

Oh, maryboleyn, that's rotten. My heart goes out to you.

@traineepro I agree sadly.
And there's a ton of data showing that suitable male partners are generally very difficult to find - that women tend to become unhappier and worse off when they marry whereas men become happier and better off.

I have two male relations who are absolutely lovely men,

No one who does that is lovely.

I agree that most men having children later in life are on second families. I do wonder whether that's a subconscious motive for the younger OW targeting a married man.

I also think this is likely to be true.

@timshelthechoice that is true. It was not a lovely thing to do, to take their GFs fertile years so lightly.

It also makes me worry a bit. My relations, ultimately do now have children but with women who basically got pregnant and were more selfish and ruthless. And in some ways, considering how blasé many men are, prepared to waste women’s years by stringing them along, who can blame them?

However it also means that two lovely women, who were not as selfish, lost out and their genes are not being passed down.

I’m so sorry maryboleyn.

I know it’s no use to you now, but I’d advise any young woman reading not to spend more than two or three years in a relationship before actively TTC in her late twenties and beyond, if she’s sure she wants children and isn’t willing to risk not having them, and to make that clear when starting a new relationship. And to end it and move on if she’s two/three years in and the guy is stalling. Your fertile years are precious and once they’re gone they’re gone. No man is worth losing out on having a family for in my honest opinion.

The Tommy’s stats are based on Danish women from the seventies to 1992. Older women have gotten healthier now and it’s more common now for the reasons for miscarriage to be identified and treated sooner. So I would treat this study with a large pinch of salt.

It would also be interesting to see statistics which controlled for the father's age, which is believed to be a factor in miscarriage rates. Since most women marry men close to their own age, the high miscarriage rate of older mothers might also be due at least in part to the age of their male partners.

I was told in my early 20's to get on with it before 30 so knew it was time sensitive