To ask why you think the Tory party are nasty / evil?

[MellowBird85]

This is not a loaded question, I am genuinely interested to hear why some people are of this opinion. Fire away...

"I didn’t realize that nurses need a degree!" Nursing degrees have been available for many years, but I believe have been compulsory since the mid 90's? I got mine just before they were compulsory.

However, if as a nurse you take on further training and further responsibilities thereby increase your salary, by your standards Xenia you can’t go on to purchase a house and have a family because you’re paying back a student loan and therefore cannot afford a mortgage and family. Choices, choices, eh?

richdeniro the mindset is that they are somehow intrinsically more deserving than the people lower down the social scale. Their parents were more industrious, prudent, intelligent or astute than the working class parents. And they inherited those qualities.

Gilead and the same situation is replicated with GPs who lose money on pensions etc over a certain salary point. The same people arguing that people won't work for 40% of their salary over 150k expect NHS staff to put up with punitive impacts on their salaries under other names.

So if the nurse is on uner £25k they receive the free training they used to have before student loans were brought in by Tony Blair. If they earn well then like doctors and many others they pay 9% of earnings over £25k so about £500 a year if they earn £30k etc. I don't see what the problem is - that is the sysem and probably fair that the higher paid nurses pay for their university education rather than minimum wage cleaners having to fund it from their national insurance and tax contributions.

probably fair that the higher paid nurses pay for their university education rather than minimum wage cleaners having to fund it from their national insurance and tax contributions.

We'll make a socialist of you yet Xenia !

Except a socialist would probably say that university fees shouldn't exist in the first place.

I do think uni should be paid for and the current loan scheme should be changed to ensure loans are actually paid back as far too many don’t pay them back.

Education should be used, not wasted. Too many see uni as just something to do/lifestyle choice rather than as something needed for a certain career.

The only degrees that should be subsidised are those for essential jobs like doctors, nurses, teachers etc. It would be easy to build in a clause saying the debt would be wiped after say 10/15 years in the career.

Who gets to decide what essential jobs are?

IceCream or you could think of continued learning as something valuable in its own right rather than thinking in rigid commercial terms. Tuition fees in many EU countries are far lower, even non-existent. Their economies seem to function just fine, within the context of global economic cycles. Why is it different in the UK and the US? The answer is probably ideology.

The problem with what you suggest, IceCream, is that it closes off the arts, law, sciences etc., to all but the wealthiest or the children of the wealthiest.

It also turns universities into businesses if they "have to be paid for". This is happening already, which means some universities are now 'selling' degrees to potential students. So it changes the balance of things, whereas before students competed to attend university, now anyone can go if they 'buy' the right degree.

So things like getting a law degree for example, which, back in the day was a badge of honour and almost a guarantee to get a 'good' job, now law graduates are in oversupply. Many, many of then cannot find jobs or traineeships. Some universities are happy to continue to churn them out, as they are becoming more like businesses and are less concerned about whether their graduates can actually make a career out of it. So they end up, like a former colleague of mine, working in bars, cafes etc on minimum wage, rather than in a solicitor's office and...you guessed it, they can't begin pay back their loans till much later in life. Silly isn't it? And it's no good for the graduate either, as by the time they have to pay back their loan, they will probably have more outgoings; mortgage, childcare and so on.

before student loans were brought in by Tony Blair.
Wrong. Thatcher.

The only degrees that should be subsidised are those for essential jobs like doctors, nurses, teachers etc. It would be easy to build in a clause saying the debt would be wiped after say 10/15 years in the career.
These couldn't function without the IT industry.
Arts degrees are as valuable as others.
Scientists, researchers, Lecturers.
Not really thought it through, have you.

before student loans were brought in by Tony Blair.
Wrong. Thatcher.

Thatcher brought in student loans to help students pay their living costs through low-interest loans. But at this point there were no tuition fees.

It was Labour/Tony Blair who passed the Teaching and Higher Education Act in 1998 to bring in tuition fees.

Ah jeez, Tony Blair is as much a socialist as my Grandad in law. Which is to say not at all. (If you knew him, you'd TOTALLY lol ).

Never understand why people feel that student loans are a good thing. Those that do, it may surprise you to know that the student loan company is owned by CarVal Investors which is based in the Cayman Islands, wouldn't it make more sense for graduates to be able to spend the money that they earn in the wider UK economy which creates jobs rather than a portion of their wages being siphoned offshore which adds no value to the country?

In a true Freudian Slip moment I once referred to Tony Blair as 'Tory Blair'.... By the standards of European social democracy, the Labour Party under Blair was well and truly on the right side of the centre ground.

Tory Blair!

Tony Blair PM is an anagram of
I’m a Tory Plan B

Hence why he actually, y’know, won elections...

Boris the Sex Pest Lied to the Queen From the party conference that took off a lot of Sheen.

Tories lost their probity spark To splurge on voters in corners dark For Brexit I voted more times than Bojo did, said father of house Ken Clarke.

The Country is sick of experts,
Immigrants, remainers and hairshirts.
They should be quiet.
Lest our supporters riot,
Fuck business! How dare they sound alerts.

Iain Duncan Smith Rummaged around in his nose In front of all the cameras better behaviour seems he does not knows

There once was an MP from Somerset Due to 7 children not enough sleep did he get So he slopped on green benches Was bored not apprehensive Just waiting for his private jet

Brexit party Tory party
Tory party Brexit party:
Does someone know the difference?
From economy both extract pounds and pence.

Damn - I’m not sure about the rest of the economy, but the bad doggerel market is booming under Brexit!

Hence why he actually, y’know, won elections...

...which is more than either the current or most recent Tory PM did.

which is more than either the current or most recent Tory PM did.

You’re not one of those people who thinks Jeremy Corbyn’s been PM for the last few years, are you?

As for the current PM, for some reason Labour is running scared of facing him in an election, despite whining for two years about how much they wanted one...