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Original poster

To think there’s little point vilifying Boris when he’s only echoing what millions want to hear?

255 replies

dameofdilemma · 26/09/2019 20:47

Boris (I had to stop myself prefacing that with ‘that twat ‘) seems to have become some sort of pantomime villain but isn’t that a bit pointless?
He (and his cronies) are only voicing the opinions that they think will get them elected, the opinions probably held by millions of voters.

The right wing tabloid press are only printing the (vile) stories that their millions of readers agree with.

Much as Trump isn’t the problem, it’s the millions of voters who support him, who agree with his views, that are the real issue.

We’re entering a new era of fear, violence and division. There will be very few winners. Homelessness, poverty and job insecurity is on the rise. Public services are crippled by underfunding and underresourcing.

Personally we’re getting our ducks in a row to be as financially resilient as possible and to live in the most tolerant part of the country. Good luck everyone!

OP posts:
TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:06

I mean that it’s left-leaning remainers discussing the WCs as though they were a race of subterranean simpletons. The LEFT.

leckford · 27/09/2019 08:06

Sorry, he is no worse than the comrades in the nasty party

Iggly · 27/09/2019 08:08

Over 16 million people wanted to remain 🤷🏻‍♀️

Does their vote not count?

That’s why Brexit needs to be a compromise effort because it was not a great thumping majority for leaving.

In 2010, the Tories won the majority of votes but had to go into a coalition with the Lib Dems because it wasn’t a thumping majority. That’s the best analogy I can come with for the Brexit result.

So there is no mandate for a hard Brexit at all costs for more than one reason:

It wasn’t a thumping majority
People were not asked what Brexit they wanted. There are different options.

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:12

Over 16 million people wanted to remain 🤷🏻‍♀️

Does their vote not count?

Behave yourself. It was an in/out referendum, not a mixing desk.

Ratcatcher9 · 27/09/2019 08:12

I'm almost beginning to think we need to partition Britain. Not along the lines of religion a la India, but along the lines of leave/remain.

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:14

People were not asked what Brexit they wanted. There are different options

Do you seriously not understand why you can’t put possible negotiation outcomes on a ballot paper in advance?

Fatshedra · 27/09/2019 08:17

Haha - remoaners getting their knickers in a twist now ......

BarbariansMum · 27/09/2019 08:18

Which would also be why you cant presume exactly the what people were expecting by way of a leave vote, right Tottie. Pretty sure that subverting our parliamentary system wasnt on the ballot at all, fi.

Limitedsimba123 · 27/09/2019 08:19

I’m a left leaning, WC, remainer and I don’t think the Brexiteers are simpletons at all. I think some Brexiteers have fallen for some very clever propaganda that the reason for their poor prospects is EU membership/benefit cheats/Labour spending too much money before the global recession Hmm but on the other hand some Brexiteers have some very real concerns about the economies of some of the other members etc. What surprises me about Brexiteers at the moment is how they are seemingly happy to see the very foundations of our democracy trashed in order to push through a version of Brexit which there is no mandate for. The only way I can see out of this mess is a people’s vote with all the options, WA, no deal and remain.

chomalungma · 27/09/2019 08:19

I'm almost beginning to think we need to partition Britain. Not along the lines of religion a la India, but along the lines of leave/remain

I suspect that many of the people in those 2 groups probably have similar views on many other things as well.

You can almost predict the way someone voted given their views on other things as well.

Iggly · 27/09/2019 08:21

Do you seriously not understand why you can’t put possible negotiation outcomes on a ballot paper in advance

Where, exactly, please point, did I suggest that they should have done?

Iggly · 27/09/2019 08:22

I suspect that many of the people in those 2 groups probably have similar views on many other things as well
Jacob Rees Mogg and Jeremy Corbyn both want to leave the EU

Iggly · 27/09/2019 08:23

Behave yourself. It was an in/out referendum, not a mixing desk

Which indicated that a small majority of people want to leave. So if you want to respect the wishes of all voters then you have to come up with a sensible approach.

A hard no deal Brexit is not sensible in any way shape or form.

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:25

Which would also be why you cant presume exactly the what people were expecting by way of a leave vote, right Tottie. Pretty sure that subverting our parliamentary system wasnt on the ballot at all, fi.

Of course proroguing wasn’t on the paper.

Can’t we all stop looking for silly loopholes now? (We can’t unhave the referendum. Of course possible negotiation outcomes weren’t put to the electorate in advance. “Advisory” doesn’t mean fine to ignore. No Boris being Boris doesn’t nullify the whole thing. Etc.)

We need to accept the facts we don’t relish and put firm pressure on our MPs to hold discussions and find a compromise solution.

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:26

Which indicated that a small majority of people want to leave. So if you want to respect the wishes of all voters then you have to come up with a sensible approach.

I’m all for compromise.

Myriade · 27/09/2019 08:28

I would vilify ANYONE who is refusing to follow the law and is telling me he is planning to not respect it.
I mean if you NDN was telling you that he got caught up speeding whilst being drunk and got condemned but he doesn’t care and he is right. Would you believe them and think they are a nice person? If that NDN was then telling you they are planning to go and rob a car because they need one, would find that normal?

Nope. What he is doing is exactly the same. Actually even worse because it’s the whole country he is affecting as well as undermining democracy. I’m sure that all the people cheering him on wouldnt like it off democracy was sent right down to the pan and they were losing their own individual freedoms...

Myriade · 27/09/2019 08:32

It was an in/out referendum, not a mixing desk
Actually that’s not true. During the campaign, many people were talking about a soft Brexit, Norway type. All of the Leave supporters, incl BJ, were talking about having a deal. It was NEVER about a simple in/out referendum where OUT meant No Deal.

Having said that, it doesn’t matter. NOTHING is a reason god enough to refuse to respect the LAW, esp as a head of state. And NOTHING is a reason good enough to destroy the democracy in your own country (unless your plan is to also become the dictator of that country maybe?)

Limitedsimba123 · 27/09/2019 08:34

The problem is I don’t think the EU will budge on the backstop, and no other realistic solutions to the problem of the Irish border have been forthcoming in 3 years, so are we ever going to get that compromise? If not, it needs to go back to the people so they can choose which version of leave they want, WA or no-deal, with the option to remain as well if neither option seems palatable.

ReanimatedSGB · 27/09/2019 08:36

Thing is, there never was a coherent strategy for leaving the EU. It was never about 'taking back control' or 'sovereignty'.
It's always been a handful of already-wealthy crooks wanting to obtain even more money by not allowing the UK to come under the new EU tax laws (which will put a stop to their tax-dodging and wealth-hoarding and stealing from the country) - and by gambling on the currency markets.

They don't care about how Brexit gets managed. They are not interested in what happens with regard to Northern Ireland. They know that the money they already have will stop any shortages or disruptions from inconveniencing them in the slightest.

Brexit is a heist. It's a criminal consipracy. That's what it always was. And if you're still bellowing about 'Just get us out of Europe!' or the 'will of the people' you are either a crook, a racist, or a fucking idiot. There is no rational, reasonable pro-Brexit position.

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:38

Actually that’s not true. During the campaign, many people were talking about a soft Brexit, Norway type. All of the Leave supporters, incl BJ, were talking about having a deal. It was NEVER about a simple in/out referendum where OUT meant No Deal.

It is true. It was in/out. Didn’t you read the ballot paper?

Believe me, I understand the broader point you’re making. But “what many people were saying during the campaign” isn’t the same as the question on the ballot paper.

If everyone could be a bit for factual and less emotional, it would help.

Jillyhilly · 27/09/2019 08:39

if working class people up north think BJ and Rees Mogg are their saviours then unfortunately they have another thing coming.

Exactly! They all think the same way, and they’re too stupid to know what’s best for them! If they’d only do what they’re told, they’d be so much happier.

Alexandrite · 27/09/2019 08:39

Very well summed up Reanimated

Cinammoncake · 27/09/2019 08:40

Oh, yucky! Not people from towns up north! Those ghastly places where they voted for Brexit? It really is frightening when those ordinary working people are given a voice and allowed to make a decision about their own future. They can’t possibly know what’s good for them. Stuff ‘em back in the box, say I!

This would be funny if it wasn’t true.

This sums up exactly what the anti brexit brigade thinks. And they call Boris ‘dangerous’ hmm

what a load of nonsense. I'm part of that brigade and do not think this, nor does anyone I know. there are people lacking critical thinking skills in all parts of the country. hth

TottieandMarchpane · 27/09/2019 08:41

That’s not very constructive @ReanimatedSGB

Limitedsimba123 · 27/09/2019 08:46

So do you agree Tottie, that now everyone has a much clearer idea of how leave will be achieved, WA or no-deal, we need a second vote?