Shamima Begum....where do you stand?

[LeahSMS]

What are your thoughts?

AIBU to think she was only a child but unfortunately she’s now considered as a threat so therefore she will never return it’s not only about her safety but the people around her?

Tell me your thoughts

And yet a 15 year old brown girl is portrayed
as cold and calculated and blasé about severed heads.

When I saw my first severed head. I didn’t phase me. Her words no one else’s
She’s not being “portrayed” as anything.

@ActuallyItsEugene it's not me being deliberately obtuse... Do you actually understand what is means to be groomed and brainwashed?

Why the hell should Syria have to deal with criminals from the UK, that country has been through enough and has few resources as it is without British terrorists that have gone over to join in the atrocities.

She should be jailed here, however I would be uneasy about her ever having complete freedom having been involved in such a fanatical cult as islamic state.

@IntermittentParps I know. Which is why I still worry about attempting to rehabilitate her. It failed previously and it's a huge risk to take again.

@IntermittentParps I know. Which is why I still worry about attempting to rehabilitate her. It failed previously and it's a huge risk to take again.

@Norabird

She's a British citizen, she was a child, she was groomed.

Should she be punished for crimes that she has committed? Sure!

Should she be stripped of her citizenship and refused entry to the country? No.

She needs to be brought back here to safety, then dealt with appropriately by the legal system here.

There is far too much of a culture of blaming and punishing victims in this country.

100% this!

Actually, I think letting her become stateless, or whatever would happen instead, and roam the world with a grudge, is quite possibly a bigger risk.
I'm not saying there are any good solutions, just wondering what might be the least bad one.

I have no sympathy for her. She was old enough to know what she was doing and I remember the early interviews with her, she did not come across as remorseful at all.

@GreytExpectations I do, yes.

And I'm of the belief that Begum was neither. It's widely reported of the acts carried out by IS.
What on earth else could she have thought she was getting herself into?

Since you're so desperate to try and defend her, what do you believe was done/said to her to make her choice excusable?

She may well have been a victim of grooming, but she's also guilty of terrorism.

Being a victim and being a criminal aren't mutually exclusive, just because you are one, doesn't mean you can't be the other.

Over half the women in UK prisons report having suffered domestic violence with 53% of women reporting having experienced emotional, physical or sexual abuse as a child. That doesn't mean they aren't also guilty of a crime and deserve their punishment.

@GreytExpectations I do, yes.

And I'm of the belief that Begum was neither. It's widely reported of the acts carried out by IS.
What on earth else could she have thought she was getting herself into?

Since you're so desperate to try and defend her, what do you believe was done/said to her to make her choice excusable?

@IntermittentParps I agree. It's a tough call to make and, no matter what, there's going to be a huge element of risk with regards to her reoffending.

young people do stupid shit and we don't turn out backs on them
Stupid shit like getting drunk when underage, getting involved with wrong crowd, taking drugs, dropping out of school and going awol even, all not good but forgiveable.
Running away from the country that has kept you safe all your life, to join a mad fucking army of barbaric fucked up murderers, to ultimately fight against your own country is not stupid shit!

@GreytExpectations

I love how so many posters think once someone joins ISIS (after being groomed and brainwashed) that they have free will to pick and choose what they do. Like they can just go and say to the leaders " Nah, don't fancy supervising beheadings today" and be happily off on their way. Do you all honestly think that once you join you have loads of freewill and choice in your "tasks"? In case you didn't realise, they are a terrorist organisation that know how to control people.

Well she told BBC reporter that the videos of the fighting attracted her. So she knew what was going to be on the other side when she got there.

Only some one who had psychopathic traits would think this way of life is ok that the murder of innocent people was justified. If I couldn’t escape I’d turn the gun on myself. This young lady was only found when Isis had lost the strong hold and she was hiding in a refugee camp.

She gave an honest and very frank interview. She wants to come home because the party has ended and she feels legally entitled too as as well.

She has said on tv that she doesn’t regret going. That she would have wanted her son to join them. She still has sympathies with IS, that she had a good time time there but wanted to come home when it got a bit tougher - I’d say that was round about the time when IS were being beaten and she ended up in a shit hole refugee camp.

Just by going off her own words this is an incredibly damaged and dangerous woman.

For those who are saying that she's made her choice, she's not our problem, whose problem do you think she is? Saying "She's made her choice!" doesn't make any sense does it because it's not really about her, it's about who takes responsibility for her from now.

Since you're so desperate to try and defend her, what do you believe was done/said to her to make her choice excusable?

It's not a case of defending her it's a case of understanding she was groomed and brainwashed as a child by a group of people who are professional at recruiting people. You say you know what that means but if you did then you wouldn't be asking "what on earth she got herself into".

As I've said, which I'm sure you have ignored, I think she should face the criminal justice system but here in the UK. I'm not saying she is innocent, I'm saying that she was groomed and brainwashed. Something you don't seem to understand.

She’s a British citizen, why on earth would she be anyone else’s problem?

When I saw my first severed head. I didn’t phase me. Her words no one else’s
She’s not being “portrayed” as anything.

@Awwlookatmybabyspider well done for cutting out my sentence on PTSD/numbness to violence. See what I mean about how things are portrayed?

I wonder if Myra Hindley would have had such support on MN as she was in coercive relationship with Brady. Would people say - she was ‘groomed and brainwashed’?

For those who are saying that she's made her choice, she's not our problem, whose problem do you think she is? Saying "She's made her choice!" doesn't make any sense does it because it's not really about her, it's about who takes responsibility for her from now.

I think they think any country of brown Muslim people should take her.

Well she told BBC reporter that the videos of the fighting attracted her.

She told them that AFTER being groomed and brainwashed.

well done for cutting out my sentence on PTSD/numbness to violence. See what I mean about how things are portrayed?

Agree with you. It's interesting how people are choosing to ignore what the effects of PTSD, after what would have intense grooming and brainwashing has. Of course she will appear cold because she isn't mentally well.

Why the heck do people keep bringing up “brown skin”... her character is cold and callous, she was quite ok with severed heads, murdered Syrians and raped Yazidi women.

She was happy until ISIS was defeated and she ended up in a refugee camp.
Then it all got rather hard for her, and she wanted to return to U.K., despite hating the U.K. and the people in it?!
I feel she is an extremely dangerous person, and irredeemable.
She will possibly still want to create harm and carnage to what she perceives as “ infidels”
Look at the murdered London Bridge “do Gooders “ who thought in their idealised way that they could “ de radicalise” a terrorist.

He murdered them!
Begum is likely just as dangerous.

I feel she is an extremely dangerous person, and irredeemable.

Let the British courts decide that.

Where else should she go, in your opinion? Some country has to house her.

It's interesting how people are choosing to ignore what the effects of PTSD, after what would have intense grooming and brainwashing has. Of course she will appear cold because she isn't mentally well.

It's crazy isn't it @GreytExpectations, given how the effects of PTSD are well known now.