Bedtime for Y7 DD

[TheHuntingOfTheSarky]

Genuinely curious as to whether DH and I are being unreasonable or whether we are in fact doing what other parents are doing.

DD1 is 11, turning 12 in November so in Y7 just gone up to secondary.

Each year we have been in the habit of adding an extra 20 minutes to bedtime for her and DD2 who is 8, 9 in January. So at the moment DD1 has to go up at 8:20 and DD2 at 7:20. The expectation is that they will read for a bit then lights out. We don’t police exactly when lights out are.

DD1 has recently been complaining that “all of her friends” go to bed at 9.30 at the earliest. We take this largely with a pinch of salt, thinking she’s just changing her arm, but I did do a bit of a straw poll amongst friends and was surprised to find that some of their same-age children are staying up regularly until 10pm even on school nights. DD1 needs to get up by about 6.15am to be ready to leave for school by 8.

Are WBU? Whenever either DD has gone to bed late ie after a special event etc, she’s been ridiculously tired the next day and IMO not really fit to put in a solid day of school (fwiw we’ve never kept her out late when she has school the next day). She is adamant that everyone else stays up much later than her and that we are being Draconian.

So who IBU? What time do your 12 year olds go to bed and what time do they need to get up?

Thanks in advance!

That's very early. My 9 year old goes to bed between 8.30 and 9. He gets up at 6.15 in the morning.

That's really early! my dd who will be 12 in January only comes in at 8! She go's up about 8.30/9 and I take her phone at 10, she's then asleep by 10.15.

She has to do homework & eat before she go's out though so doesn't get out until 6ish.

Lights out by 8/8.30 here. Dc are 12,10 and 4. Dd1 is up at 6.30 and has a shower and leisurely breakfast before leaving at 8. A bedtime of 9 would have her tired and feeling ill. Each child is different. She's allowed to stay up at her dad's and returns home barely able to attend school and has missed time due to tiredness. This is why I insist they are in bed early here to make up for the ridiculous bedtime at dads.

I think you have to arrange bedtimes and meals to suit your child, they are all different. When you have a couple or more children, obviously they have to conform to a routine up to a point, such as all eating at the same time and specific bathroom times but if there is room for the individual it should be embraced (I don't like the word 'should' but couldn't think of any other).

9.30pm seems reasonable for an eleven year old in term time. It's a shame she has to get up so early, I presume her school is a distance away.

I never made mine go to bed at a specific time and turned out fine but didn't have to get up at the crack of dawn to go to school. I also started work a bit later than most; I did my required hours, sometimes more, but had flexitime which helped. My husband too had a degree of flexitime so between us we managed well, he'd often do school run.

With babies and small children, it's best not to be a slave to routine. Ignore other people who 'tut tut', your child is an individual.

@DtPeabodysLoosePants This is my fear. I know a family with 11yo twins. They are allowed to stay up with devices until 10, 11pm, mainly because the parents can’t be bothered to make them go earlier. The parents are also night owls - fair enough, but these same children arrive at school seconds from a late mark every morning, hair unbrushed, having invariably forgotten something and often still eating their breakfast on the car journey to school. Obviously not everyone is like that but surely it’s no fit state of mind to start their day? I wouldn’t be productive at work if I was that frazzled every morning.

I am also in bed by 830/9 most nights as I'm just knackered due to being a single parent, walking 5 miles a day on the school run as don't drive, chronic illness and the effects of trying my best to deal with the abuse fished out to all by exH. Dd1 has set her own routine at home and likes a leisurely get ready and a cup of tea with her breakfast before school. She's naturally an early riser and has been since a baby but she does need her alarm to wake her up.

I’ve never understood arbitrary bedtimes.

My children have always been allowed to go to sleep when they feel tired. It’s always worked. They’ve learnt to control and regulate how much sleep they need. DC13 will stay up later than me some nights, but they wake themselves up for school on time and achieve well when they’re there.

I’d only enforced bed and waking times if my DCs weren’t doing it themselves.

I’ve never understood arbitrary bedtimes

I’d only enforce bed and waking times if my DC weren’t doing it themselves

Bobby so you do understand

@cassianandor

What I meant was I would only enforce a bed time if they were tired the next day.for example, if they struggled to get up for school, then I’d tell them that they had to go to bed earlier that night. I’d only say earlier, I wouldn’t dictate at time. It’s about teaching them to listen to their bodies.

In 25 years of parenting, I’ve only had to do that on two or three occasions.

Arbitrary is to allocated a time based on age. Every child has different needs.

@Bobbyflay It’s an interesting concept certainly. Probably wouldn’t try it out until it was school holidays though. They probably need a week or two to get used to that type of change.

DD yr7, most nights its bed by 9, though last night I could hear her awake at 10. Lights were out she was just restless. Very tired this morning at 7am! One of her sports means she doesn't get to bed until 10pm once a week on a school night. As long as she has a good sleep on the other nights shes fine. I also keep same the routine on weekends she struggles to adjust and has sports early on Sunday (7am)

bobby I agree that it’s nothing to do with age, but if I didn’t enforce a bedtime Dd would go to bed at gone 10 every night and we’d be shaking her away every morning, as it is we do that when she goes at 9 but she simply wouldn’t go to sleep if we make it any earlier.

I think that some children are innate self regulators and some aren’t. See also ‘I never have to enforce screen time, my kids self regilate’.

My year 7 DD goes up at 9.15 with lights off and phone taken away at 10

9.30 is reasonable. 8.30 is insane.

I still remember my own year 7 experience.

My mum didn't care when I went to bed, but I was so so tired I would take myself to bed at 7:30!!! I got up about 6:30 and had long school days with a 45 minute bus trip.

My boys are still little, but I think if they are tired, they'll continue having 8pm bedtimes I until and if, they start to look like they could manage a later time (I foresee some battles with DS1 here!! But he neeeeeeds his sleep!)

FishCanFly - insane if your kid can handle and us fine with a late bedtime, but quite sensible if an 8:30 bedtime works and they need it ...

Everyone has different routines. Some don't eat breakfast, others don't eat dinner until late, some have strict rules on devices, others have almost non. We are up by 7 on average, leisurely breakfast, showers for me and Dd1, dresses and ready for the day, lunch at midday, home by 3.30 for Dd1, home by 4 for the rest of us, homework done before dinner, dinner at 5/5.30pm, play out with friends, shower for dd2 and ds and tv and family time, no devices after 7pm, everything ready for the next day, reading and bed. No routine at all at their dad's so they need it at home.

Interesting range of opinions. I have 3 kids in this age bracket; all go to bed about the same time. We generally aim to have people in their rooms by 8.30 on a weeknight when there are no clubs/football on the TV. In practice, it's normally closer to 9. Lights out supposed to be 9.30.

DD1, 12 1/2, Y8 gets up at 6.45 for school - woken by an alarm but gets up easily, usually asleep by 10, will self-police to an extent if she gets tired which happens occasionally.

DS, 11, Y6, generally asleep by 9 or just after, wakes naturally 6.30 - 7, only occasionally tired

DD2, 11, Y6, often still awake (with lights off) when I go to bed at 10.30 ish, finds getting up at 7.30 am for school very difficult. Tired and grumpy in the mornings. I think she's just wired differently - she sleeps late at the weekend and rarely shows any sign of being tired in the evenings.

If what you do is working for you, I think it's fine!

DS2 is Y7, his bedtime is 930, usually gets into bed at 9, lights out probably closer to 945 (he is autistic and has various routines he has to follow). He doesn't have to get up till 715, they leave at 815 so we ensure everything is ready the night before for them.

DS1 is now Y9 but has always gone to bed late, from Y7 we didn't even give him a bed time, hes a brilliant self regulator and we have never had an issue with him, if hes tired as has gone to bed too late it's his own fault but quite often the following day we'll find him fast asleep much earlier. IMO it's a vital skill to learn.

If you Google NHS sleep guidelines there is a brilliant chart giving the info for bedtimes/wake up times. For my 11yo it is pretty much spot on for the time he needs to get up.

@TheHuntingOfTheSarky it’s all they’ve ever known. My partner worked late so it was easier to let them stay up to see each other. The children just stared to self regulate themselves, wanting to go bed before my partner came in because they were tired on occasions.

We let them continue to do that but only if they got up when told to without question, no complaints of being tired etc. or I would be in charge of bedtimes again.

There are still rules, lights off when parents go to bed, upstairs when told so parents have time together, only quiet activities such as reading or drawing are allowed, no toys (such as Lego 🙄) allowed in the bed.

We actually found that as they got older their bedtimes got earlier in the week but later at weekends. The novelty of staying up until midnight passes very quickly once they find out that it’s boring.

@CassianAndor I still have to ration screen time. I haven’t managed to get anyone (including myself) to learn to self regulate.

@FishcanFly She goes up at 8.30, she doesn't have to go to bed at 8.30. I say this in my OP. I've also said she stays up later if there is a valid reason to do so. Her beef with me I suspect is more to do with the fact that we won't let her take her phone up with her. She wants to stay downstairs because that's where her phone is. If I said OK, stay downstairs til later but you still can't have your phone, I imagine she'd end up going to her room anyway.

I honestly don't think it's insanity taking her devices away from her at 8.30!

Maybe you could trust your DD to self regulate, you don't know till you try. Why wait for school hols, surely the worst that would happen is that shell be tired for a few days. The fact she doesn't really do any activities after school means she's not flat out busy etc.

FWIW I still send my 2 upstairs about 9/930 so we get time alone etc. They have their phones until lights out. We have never had an issue.

I guess I dont mind the phones though as often my 2 are at sports training till 830 so its their only time to chat to mates.

Leaving the phone downstairs is a great idea! The school I worked at told parents to do this and blame the school rules if they wanted as it made so much difference to bullying, mood and tiredness.

Sounds like you're following really good sleep practices - consistent bedtimes and good sleep hygiene. Maybe let your daughter try going to bed when she wants for a trial period and then all chat about how it has gone so she can be involved in looking after her own sleep needs?

I work backwards: what time do you need to get up: 06 15

how many hours sleep do you need:
www.nhs.uk/live-well/sleep-and-tiredness/how-much-sleep-do-kids-need/
11 years, 9.5 hrs

so go to bed at: 8 45. What you're doing sounds about right to me!